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Old 11-20-2012, 09:50 AM   #1
Take Your Lumps
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Lightbulb Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LksVbHxLRvY

He uses all the tricks in the bag...the placebo effect, confirmation bias, emotional manipulation. It's pretty fascinating if you're into psychology at all.
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Old 11-20-2012, 01:23 PM   #2
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

Great find. Thank you.

Anyone who has ever had a one night stand with a girl has done something very similar to this. It's amazing how interconnected religion is with human experience. To most this may discredit religion... but to me it seems to reinforce my belief that religion is a really good idea. Would you rather have those human needs, formed by millions of years of biological evolution, and thousands of years of social evolution, and not going anywhere anytime soon, satisfied in, say, your daughter, by the idea of God and a prescribed ritual and community designed to cultivate and reinforce that idea?.... or some guy she meets at a bar. If she has that sated by religion, she doesn't need the guy at the bar. Or even her dad, when he should die or go away or disappoint her. Or some false corrupt cleric.

And he never does prove that these impulses and needs are vain ones. No one ever will. It's entirely plausible that they were formed in us by a creator so that we would be impelled to seek "Him".

Again great find, thank you. The guy is really, really good.
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Old 11-20-2012, 01:40 PM   #3
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clifton
Great find. Thank you.

Anyone who has ever had a one night stand with a girl has done something very similar to this. It's amazing how interconnected religion is with human experience. To most this may discredit religion... but to me it seems to reinforce my belief that religion is a really good idea. Would you rather have those human needs, formed by millions of years of biological evolution, and thousands of years of social evolution, and not going anywhere anytime soon, satisfied in, say, your daughter, by the idea of God and a prescribed ritual and community designed to cultivate and reinforce that idea?.... or some guy she meets at a bar. If she has that sated by religion, she doesn't need the guy at the bar. Or even her dad, when he should die or go away or disappoint her. Or some false corrupt cleric.

And he never does prove that these impulses and needs are vain ones. No one ever will. It's entirely plausible that they were formed in us by a creator so that we would be impelled to seek "Him".

Again great find, thank you. The guy is really, really good.
it is the majority of the time..."Jesus" (or Allah, or Buddha, or etc) has saved millions of lives, weather they actually exists or not is meaningless here on Earth, their effect on people is the same either way.

The placebo effect that religion has on most people has been pretty much proven to be great for mental health...and belief of nothing (atheism) has been shown to increase odds of depression and suicide and mental illness.

There is some irony there I think in that many atheists would claim that the religious heads are crazy, but in terms of literal mental health it is atheists that are "crazy" on average... (obviously many atheists are happy and very mentally sound, not claiming all are depressed so relax)
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Old 11-20-2012, 01:56 PM   #4
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

Quote:
There is some irony there I think in that many atheists would claim that the religious heads are crazy, but in terms of literal mental health it is atheists that are "crazy" on average...
I have had trouble with this too. I find the kind of innocence and openness required to accept religious ideas as fully "true" to be kind of repugnant. But you know what the doctors and the preachers used to call that? Pride. It's nothing new. Pride is watching something like this video and saying, "hah, good thing I'm not a sucker like them." I'm more inclined to that than average and I've finally decided it's just not getting me anywhere.
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:28 PM   #5
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
it is the majority of the time..."Jesus" (or Allah, or Buddha, or etc) has saved millions of lives, weather they actually exists or not is meaningless here on Earth, their effect on people is the same either way.

The placebo effect that religion has on most people has been pretty much proven to be great for mental health...and belief of nothing (atheism) has been shown to increase odds of depression and suicide and mental illness.

There is some irony there I think in that many atheists would claim that the religious heads are crazy, but in terms of literal mental health it is atheists that are "crazy" on average... (obviously many atheists are happy and very mentally sound, not claiming all are depressed so relax)

i want some stats. what are you basing any of this on?
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:33 PM   #6
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

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Originally Posted by miller-time
i want some stats. what are you basing any of this on?
I have posted stats on that a dozen times in here...and I am pretty sure they were directed toward you at least a couple of those times
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:35 PM   #7
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

here is one study:

http://www.adherents.com/misc/religion_suicide.html
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:38 PM   #8
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

more studies:

http://www.conservapedia.com/Atheism_and_suicide
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:40 PM   #9
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

not only are suicide rates higher, but in atheism marriage rates are lower, and divorce rates are higher...less likely to have kids, etc

"the family that prays together stays together" <---true words actually
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:42 PM   #10
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

and here are studies on atheism and charity work

http://www.conservapedia.com/Atheism...charitableness

Quote:
The typical no-faith American donated just $200 in 2006, which is more than seven times less than the amount contributed by the prototypical active-faith adult ($1500). Even when church-based giving is subtracted from the equation, active-faith adults donated twice as many dollars last year as did atheists and agnostics. In fact, while just 7% of active-faith adults failed to contribute any personal funds in 2006, that compares with 22% among the no-faith adults.[1]
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:59 PM   #11
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
not only are suicide rates higher, but in atheism marriage rates are lower, and divorce rates are higher...less likely to have kids, etc

"the family that prays together stays together" <---true words actually
Its amazing how you disregard any and all effects culture can have on a persons psyche that chooses to go against it.
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Old 11-20-2012, 06:00 PM   #12
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
it is the majority of the time..."Jesus" (or Allah, or Buddha, or etc) has saved millions of lives, weather they actually exists or not is meaningless here on Earth, their effect on people is the same either way.

The placebo effect that religion has on most people has been pretty much proven to be great for mental health...and belief of nothing (atheism) has been shown to increase odds of depression and suicide and mental illness.

There is some irony there I think in that many atheists would claim that the religious heads are crazy, but in terms of literal mental health it is atheists that are "crazy" on average... (obviously many atheists are happy and very mentally sound, not claiming all are depressed so relax)
lol ignorance is bliss! You know who doesn't have mental problems also? Cockroaches.

conservapedia.com looooooooool

Jews are bad!!! I got the proof! It's on naziopedia.com!!

Last edited by Blue&Orange : 11-20-2012 at 06:02 PM.
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Old 11-20-2012, 06:08 PM   #13
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hazard
Its amazing how you disregard any and all effects culture can have on a persons psyche that chooses to go against it.
I'm not disregarding that or anything else...the religious culture is probably part of it, I'm sure it is
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Old 11-20-2012, 06:10 PM   #14
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

didn't realize that was "conservapedia"...those were just top google links

sorry


I've posted real stats on that stuff plenty of times though...(those conservapedia stats are likly legit anyway)
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Old 11-20-2012, 06:11 PM   #15
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Default Re: Derren Brown deconstructs faith and gives an atheist a profound religious experience

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Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-

^^^ not "conservapedia"

that study is legit
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