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Old 09-21-2007, 06:53 PM   #16
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

Laying down the hammer.
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Old 09-21-2007, 07:18 PM   #17
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kwajo
The San Antonio arenas have seemed pretty full to me. Winning sells, whether it's perceived as boring or not.

EXACTLY! Like I already said...the team that needs to win to make money chooses Duncan. A smaller city like SA needs to have a good record to keep fans paying. The Clippers earned money for years with loosing records becuase they have enough people there to buy Jerseys of their favorite players.

The same goes for SLC, as soon as the Jazz start loosing for a few years I expect the franchise up and go.
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Old 09-21-2007, 07:40 PM   #18
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

So is this a skills argument again?
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Old 09-21-2007, 08:23 PM   #19
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

Duncan/Garnett is one of those things that people either understand or don't. If someone claims Garnett is a better overall player, they don't have a grasp of how basketball works.

If those same people typed out Garnett was better than Duncan, they must also believe Kevin Garnett is far more skilled/talented than Shaq. If you want a guy that impresses you the most in a wide variety of skill-drills then take Garnett, but if your main goal was to win championships, or become a true contender, you go with the TRUE big men.

Kevin Garnett is NOT A GREAT BIG MAN. He's a great versatile player, a guy who can gaurd away from the hoop, at the hoop, and score from inside and out, but he's not a great big man. Not the way Wilt was, the way Akeem was, the way Shaq was.

The way Duncan is.
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Old 09-21-2007, 08:26 PM   #20
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

Duncan is better, point blank.

Let's see what KG can do and what kind of impact will this Boston team have. KG has no excuses now, so we'll see.
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Old 09-21-2007, 08:27 PM   #21
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

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I know some people will talk about Duncan's impact on the game but realize that Duncan plays the most impactful position in the game, that is, a big man playing the low post

Ignorant statement.

We should downgrade Duncan because he plays a certain position? And raise Garnett up because he plays a more skill/athletic oriented game?

Your logic is sketchy at best.
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Old 09-21-2007, 08:36 PM   #22
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

Carbine has it right.

As great as KG is basically a 7 foot jump shooter. He doesn't dominate in the post like Duncan does. Duncan can get low post position and score so easily that he forces double teams. KG isn't strong enough to overpower people down low.

If you look at the difference in shot selection it is pretty clear why Duncan is better.

http://www.82games.com/0607/06SAS13A.HTM

http://www.82games.com/0607/06MIN11A.HTM
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Old 09-21-2007, 10:05 PM   #23
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

Offensively and defensively they're pretty much on par in terms of efficiency and getting their averages. The one thing I like about Garnett so much that isn't in Duncan though is his passing ability. When he's in the high post he'll always find the cutters for easy layins. Even when he's down low he'll find a team mate for an open dunk or jumpshot (which they'll frequently miss) when he attracts more attention.

However, the Spurs play a slightly more different way especially when come playoff time when they usually just have Duncan in the middle and 4 players on the perimeter moving the ball around until someone has an open shot. That is why Duncan doesn't get to showcase his passing as much. Besides, they have a wonderful playmaker in Ginobolli.
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Old 09-21-2007, 10:08 PM   #24
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

Agree with Carbine. Especially the part about how this debate is a good way to gauge how much people really know about basketball. Pippen is definitely a better all around player than prime Shaq. Who are you taking on your team? Duncan is the more effective post player and traditionally a dominant low post player > a great all around player.

And Ridonks argument that he hardly factors in winning is flawed. True, there are several factors to winning including situations, teams, etc. but much of the time the best rise to the top. Would we talk about Jordan, Magic, Bird, Kareem, Russell in the same light without their titles? Doubtful. They would be Barkley, Ewing, Robinson. Still great players, but not considered as good.
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Old 09-21-2007, 10:13 PM   #25
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardtop Hero
Agree with Carbine. Especially the part about how this debate is a good way to gauge how much people really know about basketball. Pippen is definitely a better all around player than prime Shaq. Who are you taking on your team? Duncan is the more effective post player and traditionally a dominant low post player > a great all around player.

And Ridonks argument that he hardly factors in winning is flawed. True, there are several factors to winning including situations, teams, etc. but much of the time the best rise to the top. Would we talk about Jordan, Magic, Bird, Kareem, Russell in the same light without their titles? Doubtful. They would be Barkley, Ewing, Robinson. Still great players, but not considered as good.


Stupid comparison and you know it. One you COULD throw out would be John Stockton vs Magic Johnson but that wouldn't play out so well because Magic was always praised for his versatility.
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Old 09-21-2007, 10:21 PM   #26
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

One thing KG has never really had is a solid team backing him up. Sure, Spree and Sam I Am are pretty good, but Tony Parker/Manu/D-Rob/Etc. > The Best Supporting Cast KG Ever Had.

Not saying KG > Duncan, just pointing out that KG's teams have been anywhere from horrible to above average. Duncan's teams have ranged anywhere from average to the best.

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Old 09-21-2007, 10:23 PM   #27
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Optimus Prime
One thing KG has never really had is a solid team backing him up. Sure, Spree and Sam I Am are pretty good, but Tony Parker/Manu/D-Rob/Etc. > The Best Supporting Cast KG Ever Had.

Not saying KG > Duncan, just pointing out that KG's teams have been anywhere from horrible to above average. Duncan's teams have ranged anywhere from average to the best.


Let's not forget that Sam was injured when it counted most.
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Old 09-21-2007, 10:25 PM   #28
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

kg is the man dude- it stinks though that MN dont have him anymore but celtics team is gonna be sickly good
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Old 09-21-2007, 10:39 PM   #29
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

....and Jordan had some of the best supporting casts ever. Bird, too. Magic as well. Should we take anything away from their rings just because they had some superb talent around them? No.

Only guys who wanna bring up supporting casts to deminish the rings somebody has is someone that wants to "up" one of his favorites without one.

I've been hearing it from KG fans for years.

1) He has horrible teams
2) He came into a bad situation.
3) He's just as individually good as Duncan

Well it's getting old. If Garnett were "better" he would've gotten out of the first round more than once. I mean you guys are saying Garnett is a better player than Duncan, a guy who has led a team to four titles. It must be humbling when you have to type Garnett has only been out of the first round once. Oh, but wait...that year was the only year he had a decent group of players!!! The excuses never end, and I don't expect them too either.

When you compare Duncan' cast to the other great players that have won 4 titles it's actually quite amusing that people bring it up as a degrading tool towards Duncan. Duncan is winning championships against one of the toughest conferences in league history. It's not like he's playing in the 70's.

Duncan won his first ring without arguably a top 15 player in the league. The last three he has won without a top 25 player in the league. Yet people want to sit here and tell me how "great" his casts are.

It's something that I feel needs to be pointed out.

Last edited by Carbine : 09-21-2007 at 10:41 PM.
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Old 09-21-2007, 11:02 PM   #30
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Default Re: Do people understand that Garnett has always been better as a player than Duncan?

who was better:

1998 - duncan
1999 - duncan
2000 - garnett
2001 - duncan
2002 - duncan
2003 - duncan
2004 - garnett
2005 - garnett
2006 - duncan
2007 - duncan
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