Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > InsideHoops Main Basketball Forums > NBA Forum

NBA Forum NBA Message Board - NBA Fan Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-07-2007, 03:27 PM   #1
L.Kizzle
ISH's Negro Historian
 
L.Kizzle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Houston, TX -
Posts: 35,651
L.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation here
Arrow Elliot Kalb's Top 50 Players of All-Time List?

Kalb's Top 50 Players of All-Time? Shaq at #1, Jordan at #3
Since ISH is doing the Greatest Player thing, I was looking up some info on some players and found a book by Elliot Kalb titled Who's Better, Who's Best in Basketball. It was his ranking at the top 50 players of All-Time.


Here is his top 50
And no peoples, this isn't a recent list from this year, this was done back sometime in mid-2003.



1. Shaquille O'Neal
2. Wilt Chamberlain
3. Michael Jordan
4. Bill Russell
5. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
6. Larry Bird
7. Earvin 'Magic' Johnson
8. Oscar Robertson
9. Tim Duncan
10. Bob Cousy
--
11. Bob Pettit
12. Jerry West
13. Elgin Baylor
14. Moses Malone
15. Julius Erving
16. Hakeem Olajuwon
17. Karl Malone
18. Kobe Bryant
19. George Mikan
20. David Robinson
--
21. Charles Barkley
22. Rick Barry
23. Dolph Schayes
24. John Havlicek
25. Isiah Thomas
26. George Gervin
27. John Stockton
28. Jason Kidd
29. Scottie Pippen
30. Dennis Rodman
--
31. Walt Frazier
32. Dave Cowens
33. Allen Iverson
34. Kevin McHale
35. Elvin Hayes
36. Gary Payton
37. Bill Walton
38. Patrick Ewing
39. Willis Reed
40. Kevin Garnett
--
41. Tracy McGrady
42. Sam Jones
43. Nate Archibald
44. Bob McAdoo
45. Billy Cunningham
46. Earl Monroe
47. Pete Maravich
48. Reggie Miller
49. Dominique Wilkins
50. Clyde Drexler

Last edited by L.Kizzle : 07-07-2007 at 04:06 PM.
L.Kizzle is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 03:29 PM   #2
The Answer
National High School Star
 
The Answer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 1,573
The Answer has decent reputationThe Answer has decent reputation
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

I've heard about that. Evidently, he provides a lot of statistical evidence, supporting Shaq as the GOAT. I'd really be interested in reading it.
The Answer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 03:53 PM   #3
L.Kizzle
ISH's Negro Historian
 
L.Kizzle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Houston, TX -
Posts: 35,651
L.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation hereL.Kizzle has an incredible reputation here
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's Top 50 Players of All-Time List?

Quote:
Originally Posted by L.Kizzle
1. Shaquille O'Neal
2. Wilt Chamberlain
3. Michael Jordan
9. Tim Duncan
18. Kobe Bryant
28. Jason Kidd
29. Scottie Pippen
30. Dennis Rodman
33. Allen Iverson
40. Kevin Garnett
41. Tracy McGrady
48. Reggie Miller
49. Dominique Wilkins
50. Clyde Drexler
The thing's that surprised me with the list is how (in 2003) how (9)Duncan, (18)Kobe, (28)Kidd, (33)Iverson, (40)KG and (41)T-Mac were so high on the list.


Also (48)Reggie over (49)Dominique and (50)Drexler and also you're telling me McGrady passed Drexler just after 3 All-Star seasons.


I wonder how his list would look now 4 seasons later?
L.Kizzle is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 03:59 PM   #4
Richie2k6
Smooth Like Butter
 
Richie2k6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: The Terrordome Team: Nuggets
Posts: 9,906
Richie2k6 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRichie2k6 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRichie2k6 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRichie2k6 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRichie2k6 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRichie2k6 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRichie2k6 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRichie2k6 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRichie2k6 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's Top 50 Players of All-Time List?

He's got a lot of guts to put Shaq at #1. I wonder why?
Richie2k6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 04:44 PM   #5
24/7
Great young streetballer
 
24/7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 233
24/7 has an OK reputation so far
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

The only players you can even think about putting ahead of Jordan are Wilt and Kareem. Only Kareem matches Jordan's individual accomplishments combined with team success, and Wilt was just a beast in his time.
24/7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 04:56 PM   #6
24/7
Great young streetballer
 
24/7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 233
24/7 has an OK reputation so far
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

Only 3 players in the top 20 who don't strut with an MVP under their arm and they are all Lakers.
24/7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 05:06 PM   #7
dudeguykid
High school junior varsity star
 
dudeguykid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 503
dudeguykid has decent reputation
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 24/7
Only 3 players in the top 20 who don't strut with an MVP under their arm and they are all Lakers.
theres also 7 lakers in the top 20
dudeguykid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 05:08 PM   #8
LakerWarrior12
Local High School Star
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,477
LakerWarrior12 has an OK reputation so far
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 24/7
Only 3 players in the top 20 who don't strut with an MVP under their arm and they are all Lakers.



Jerry West has a Finals MVP and a championship sorry. Karl Malone has 2 MVPS.

Only leading to the most obvious answer. kobe bryant. to think of it, kobe has 2 all star mvps..but that's all star..sooo..
LakerWarrior12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 05:20 PM   #9
24/7
Great young streetballer
 
24/7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 233
24/7 has an OK reputation so far
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LakerWarrior12
Jerry West has a Finals MVP and a championship sorry. Karl Malone has 2 MVPS.

Only leading to the most obvious answer. kobe bryant. to think of it, kobe has 2 all star mvps..but that's all star..sooo..

Kobe has All-Star MVPs and West has a finals MVP, but I was referring to the THE MVP(not obvious?). What does Malone have to do with this? I was talking about Baylor, Kobe and West.
24/7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 05:30 PM   #10
LakerWarrior12
Local High School Star
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,477
LakerWarrior12 has an OK reputation so far
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 24/7
Kobe has All-Star MVPs and West has a finals MVP, but I was referring to the THE MVP(not obvious?). What does Malone have to do with this? I was talking about Baylor, Kobe and West.


Once again I fail to notice that Elgin Baylor was on that list..


Malone was a laker.


I don't know why people think that a player needs a mvp to be on the top 20 list. Baylor and West helped the Lakers to many laker Final appearence, only to lose in all but the one without Elgin Baylor.

Jerry West and Elgin Baylor deserve to be on this list. Before Wilt came, they lead the team to 5 nba final appearences.
LakerWarrior12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 05:36 PM   #11
24/7
Great young streetballer
 
24/7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 233
24/7 has an OK reputation so far
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LakerWarrior12
Once again I fail to notice that Elgin Baylor was on that list..


Malone was a laker.


I don't know why people think that a player needs a mvp to be on the top 20 list. Baylor and West helped the Lakers to many laker Final appearence, only to lose in all but the one without Elgin Baylor.

Jerry West and Elgin Baylor deserve to be on this list. Before Wilt came, they lead the team to 5 nba final appearences.


I don't think anyone said, that players need an MVP...a League MVP...to get into the top 20. My post was merely an observation. Baylor and West definitely belong there, but Kobe? Not just yet IMHO.
24/7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 05:38 PM   #12
dudeguykid
High school junior varsity star
 
dudeguykid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 503
dudeguykid has decent reputation
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LakerWarrior12
Malone was a laker.

i highly doubt anyone in the world, with the exception of you, would look at that list and associate karl malone with the lakers instead of the jazz.
dudeguykid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 07:05 PM   #13
LakerWarrior12
Local High School Star
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,477
LakerWarrior12 has an OK reputation so far
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dudeguykid
i highly doubt anyone in the world, with the exception of you, would look at that list and associate karl malone with the lakers instead of the jazz.



Karl Malone was with the Lakers for one season and the others with the Jazz.


Get your facts straight. Moron.
LakerWarrior12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 07:19 PM   #14
D-Fence
Great young streetballer
 
D-Fence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 503
D-Fence has decent reputation
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

I like Kalb's book. I don't agree with his rankings all that much, but that's not what I'm looking for. He supports his rankings very well.

Kalb said this about his rankings in the book: "But remember, in almost every instance in this book, the ties have been broken like this: big over small, modern over past, prime over longevity, and winner over loser."

Probably the biggest flaw, in my opinion, in his rankings is that defense is sometimes forgotten. He goes into good detail about why he thinks Dennis Rodman is the greatest defensive forward ever, but he uses statistics heavily (he calls himself "Mr. Stats"). So, all he really uses for evaluation of defense is rebounds, blocks and steals, which not all have been kept for all of NBA history; some head-to-head confrontations; awards and a few memories by experts. He doesn't really mention defense when he talks about Pete Maravich, for example, and then he leaves guys like Nate Thurmond off the list.

I enjoyed the book, though.
D-Fence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2007, 12:17 AM   #15
poeticism707
Local High School Star
 
poeticism707's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,591
poeticism707 has no real reputation yet.
Default Re: Elliot Kalb's top 50 Players List?

How was Tim Duncan Number 9 All Time in 2003, but 2 titles later, is ranked number 10 on ISH? FACE IT, Tim Duncan is top-5 all time (at fifth), and Shaq is in the 7 to 9 range.
poeticism707 is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:54 PM.




NBA Basketball Forum Key Links:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
NBA Mock Draft
NBA Free Agents
All-Star Weekend
---
High School Basketball
Streetball
---
InsideHoops Twitter
Search Our Site















Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy