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Old 06-19-2007, 08:53 AM   #31
EricForman
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

quite frankly, one does not need all those in depth stats to come to the conclusion that Jordan is better than Kobe. LOL
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Old 06-19-2007, 08:59 AM   #32
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrono90
i got to agree with you. Jordan is better than Kobe and lots of people tend to forget about the past easily.

i stopped reading after: scoring titles Jordan: 10 Kobe: 2 says it all... it was harder to score back then also

Actually, that DOESN'T says it all and is actually one of the weaker arguments for Jordan over Kobe. Scoring ain't the end all be all. There are about 25 better arguments one can make for Jordan over Kobe than just "Jordan has more scoring titles".
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Old 06-19-2007, 09:02 AM   #33
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wally_world
there wasn't even an arguement that Kobe > MJ in the first place... everyone knows MJ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kobe...

Actually, during the Laker threepeat days, LA routinely busted the "Kobe is better at this stage than Jordan was" claims. Especially during that one year when Kobe had that 40 point game stretch. It was REALLY annoying living in LA at the time....
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Old 06-19-2007, 09:46 AM   #34
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OneWay
Hmm, Kobe in his career hit like 22 game winners IIRC. You may be dealing with some wrong stats.

That's pretty much the only stat that's incorrect. He used Kobe's GW's from 82games.com, which only tracks over the last 3 or 4 seasons iirc. So he wasn't using career #'s for Kobe there. Everything else looks to be correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OneWay
Kobe will at least come close in most of those statistical categories.

Nah. You need to read it over.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OneWay
Kobe after 15 seasons should AT LEAST get closer in most of those categories but in the end, it's about rings, not so much the stats.
Winning is what will tell the story about Kobe's legacy, not stats.

Among similarly accomplished players, statistical dominance counts for a lot. It's why many people would still take Shaq over TD, or Wilt over Russell.

I'm also curious to know which categories you feel Kobe has a chance to pass Jordan in. The only one I could possibly see (and even there it's unlikely unless Kobe plays on crap teams for another several years) is the # of career 50-point games (39). He really has no chance to surpass Jordan in any of the other categories listed, unless I missed something.
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Old 06-19-2007, 09:55 AM   #35
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

It's pretty sad when you need to make a thread to prove that MJ is better than Kobe. Some people just need to come to there senses and realize that Jordan is GOAT and there is no in the league right now that is better.
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Old 06-19-2007, 10:34 AM   #36
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

i love reading jordan stats, cause i'm a fanboy and a nerd, but i do think kobe deserves a little bit of a defense here.

1. his stats started low because he was a teenager and a third option in his first year.

2. his clutch performances went down the toilet after shaq, horry, fisher, and fox left because he no longer had a post anchor and a bunch of great shooters to space the floor for him (endurance may have become an issue too since he had to carry his team throughout and may not have had the energy to finish strong anymore). i can't guarantee that he'd be more clutch on a better team, but it sure wouldn't hurt.

3. defensive stats aren't necessarily a messure of defensive ability - though mj was so obviously a superior man to man and team defender to anyone who watched them both play that it's not even a fair comparison.

i am surprised the win %age falls in mike's favor. kobe's only played 4 years without shaq, right? given that jordan's first and last couple of teams were sub-500, i'd think kobe's lakers would have an overall better record. i guess all those 60+ win bulls seasons made the difference.

anyway i agree with everyone who thinks the argument is baseless at this point. probably time to move onto the new kid in town. 23 might have a chance to surpass 23 one day.
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Old 06-19-2007, 10:45 AM   #37
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

Jordan > Your mother. No need for this topic.
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Old 06-19-2007, 10:47 AM   #38
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

Quote:
It's pretty sad when you need to make a thread to prove that MJ is better than Kobe. Some people just need to come to there senses and realize that Jordan is GOAT and there is nobody in the history of the National/American Basketball Association that is better than him.
Fixed.
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Old 06-19-2007, 10:50 AM   #39
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dudeguykid
ok....

Im kind of confused as to why you went so far to prove the obvious though...

Exactly. Any real basketball fan knows this. Only Kobe fans would say he's better.
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Old 06-19-2007, 10:59 AM   #40
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

- Kobe scored 81 points in a game
- He has three championships and four Finals appearances
- He averaged 40 for a month
- He's ummm, really good

Now what am I forgetting...?
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Old 06-19-2007, 11:33 AM   #41
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

I'm not getting why rings alone would put Kobe in Jordan's realm.

Let's say he DID get two more rings. That would likely be enough for his fanatics (and even some ignorant folks) to elevate him to Jordan status.

But, Tim Duncan currently has 4 rings AS THE FRANCHISE PLAYER along with three Finals MVP and we all know that despite Tony's Finals MVP, Duncan is still the best player on the team.

And if Duncan wins one more ring, that would give him FIVE rings as the MVP of his team.

Yet, even then, no one would be talking about Duncan being as good as Jordan.

So, to recap. For Tim: FIVE rings as MVP of his team, along with three finals MVPs = Duncan still not being talked about in the realm of Michael Jordan.

BUT

Kobe Bryant: Five rings (three as a sidekick with no Finals MVPs) and hypothetically two rings as MVP of the team (and let's assume he won Finals MVP)

Why would Duncan's career not be worthy of Jordan comparisons even then, but Kobe's would (to his fans)?
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Old 06-19-2007, 11:35 AM   #42
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

Because TD is "boring" and doesn't have pretty stats.
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Old 06-19-2007, 11:45 AM   #43
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

I don't feel like arguing this with you buncha Kobe-Jordan fanatics but Kobe has like 500 more games to play, if not more.
Like 350 of those games he"ll still be at his best.
I say he has a good shot to at least come close in some of those stats.

Also, what no one mentioned is that Kobe played with Shaq. You're all quick to point out how Kobe has rings because of Shaq but not so quick when it comes to acknowledging that Shaq affected Kobe's numbers because statistically alone, it's much easier to get stats as a #1 guy.
Kobe with Shaq was like 28 ppg, 25 ppg, Kobe without Shaq went up to 35 and 32 ppg, it's without Shaq when he got most of the individual accommodates like the 81 pt game, 4 games with 50+ in a row etc.
So be fair at least.

This comparison is unfair to Kobe, I hope you can at least acknowledge that.
Jordan played the whole time as a first option and he has like 300+ more games played, if not more.
300 games....that's A LOT of games and plenty of time to get stats and achivements.

Like I said, I won't argue this, I don't have an agenda here and could care less but I see Kobe approaching some of those numbers in the next 3-4 years, if those numbers are correct that is because we've already found some inaccurate stats.

Anyway, I'm done here I guess. I see this thread turning ugly with all the obsessed Kobe-Jordan folks.

Just wanted to point out a few things, that's all.
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Old 06-19-2007, 11:49 AM   #44
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Collie
Because TD is "boring" and doesn't have pretty stats.
Duncan's stats are sexy. And he isn't boring.
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Old 06-19-2007, 12:38 PM   #45
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Default Re: Why Jordan is better than Kobe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OneWay
but I see Kobe approaching some of those numbers in the next 3-4 years, if those numbers are correct that is because we've already found some inaccurate stats.

Only one thing was incorrect, and I pointed it out. All the other stuff is fine. And the numbers (games of 40+ etc.) are only regular season unless explicitly stated (I know because Jordan had 173 games of 40+ in the regular season but 215+ in total, and the 173 is listed as "games of 40+" here).

Also, I'd like to know which of these numbers you believe Kobe will approach.
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