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Old 06-15-2007, 02:47 PM   #31
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Amare FG%, taking away dunks from Nash' passes would probably be in the vicinity of 40% or less in the last series. Duncan' individual defense is very good, if not spectacular. Malone was very crafty, and that part of his defense was solid. If anything it's a wash between those two in that particular area of defense, and thats giving Malone the benefit of the argument here.

Don't bring up the second last time they squared off if the playoffs. Did you forget Duncan had severe foot problems, limiting his lift and quickness in that one series where Amare went off? If there was ever a legit excuse, that would be one. A hell of an injury to play on, let alone be effective.
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Old 06-15-2007, 02:47 PM   #32
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

I wouldn't argue for Malone, but what about Pettit? He ought not be excluded from the discussion.
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Old 06-15-2007, 02:48 PM   #33
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Quote:
Originally Posted by geeWiz15

I don't personally think these two should be compared. there are four types of big men in my opinion:

1. Shaqs and Wilts (Cs)
2. Duncans (CF)
3. Malones (PF)
4. Dirks (SFs/SGs with PF size)

you left 1 off:

5. Barkleys (Pfs with SF/SG size and skills)
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Old 06-15-2007, 02:50 PM   #34
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Quote:
Originally Posted by geeWiz15
I disagree with the whole "Malone sucked in the playoffs" thing. he had some disappointing games, and he had some dominating games.
He didn't "suck" but he did have some chokes. My generation will never forget "the Mailman don't deliver on Sundays."
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Old 06-15-2007, 02:53 PM   #35
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Quote:
you left 1 off:

5. Barkleys (Pfs with SF/SG size and skills)
I consider Barkley a Malone. you kinda have to. their effect on a game was similar. how they did it was different but their impact was almost identical as far as I know.

or you could put Barkley into the Dirk category.

I wouldn't say Barkley had SF/SG size. Bonzi Wells is a PF in a SF/SG's body; not Barkley. what he lacked in height (three or four inches too short for his position) he more than made up for in girth, strength and athleticism (never mind desire).

I just don't think he warrants his own. he's the only player of his type and his impact on either end is not unique.
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Old 06-15-2007, 02:56 PM   #36
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Quote:
but what about Pettit? He ought not be excluded from the discussion.

I've seeny uo mention this guy' name more in the last two months then I have ever read about him in three years.

Thing with him is, you can only compare what they did in their generation and it's relative to that, and that alone. Was he considered the best player the league at any point? Was he considered the best defesnive player in the league at one point? These questions can't be answered without a doubt because most of us are not old enough to know for sure.

I won't lie, those numbers are awesome. At the same time, though, Russell was grabbing 20+ reounds a game and Wilt the same. 16 is comparable to around 10 or 11 in todays game I believe (taking into account the percentage of rebounds he grabbed for the team)

As far as I'm concerned I can't comment of Petite and where he should be ranked because to be frank I don't have enough knowledge of his game to make an educated opinion.
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Old 06-15-2007, 03:08 PM   #37
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Quote:
Originally Posted by geeWiz15
I consider Barkley a Malone. you kinda have to. their effect on a game was similar. how they did it was different but their impact was almost identical as far as I know.

or you could put Barkley into the Dirk category.

I wouldn't say Barkley had SF/SG size. Bonzi Wells is a PF in a SF/SG's body; not Barkley. what he lacked in height (three or four inches too short for his position) he more than made up for in girth, strength and athleticism (never mind desire).

I just don't think he warrants his own. he's the only player of his type and his impact on either end is not unique.
i would disagree with this. malone was a finisher and high post passer. charles was a creator who did a lot more with the ball in hand. take away stockton, and malone's impact lessens. add stockton to barkley, and chuck's impact may switch to being more like karl's. the only other pfs i can think of who had the same sort of effect on the game as charles were a healthy lj and a motivated coleman, though neither to the extent that charles did. it's not an important point in the topic though, and i was just adding chuck to the list for the sake of it.
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Old 06-15-2007, 03:12 PM   #38
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

I'm lost but what messageboard, website, sportd article, sports channel did most say Karl Malone > Duncan? Its the other way around. But let me know.

Last edited by GOBB : 06-15-2007 at 03:14 PM.
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Old 06-15-2007, 03:42 PM   #39
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

duncan > all
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Old 06-15-2007, 03:42 PM   #40
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Quote:
Originally Posted by geeWiz15
I disagree with the whole "Malone sucked in the playoffs" thing. he had some disappointing games, and he had some dominating games. the thing about Malone is that he can't dominate a game with his presence. he did so with points and rebounds... almost all players have great stastical games and then less than great ones. didn't Malone have 30 and 40 pt games against the Bulls while everyone said Rodman shut him down? the problem with Malone like I said is that he had little intangible effect on the game. he was like Boozer- scored a lot, grabbed every board but that's all.

I don't think most people think Malone was better than Duncan is.

I don't personally think these two should be compared. there are four types of big men in my opinion:

1. Shaqs and Wilts (Cs)
2. Duncans (CF)
3. Malones (PF)
4. Dirks (SFs/SGs with PF/C size)

guys like Duncan impact the game the same way Centers do. really, by any logical definition, Duncan is a center. how is he not? defensively he plays like a Center... and offensively he plays like a Center. how, then, can you compare him to Malone who is a CONSUMMATE PF? they play the game a different way. Malone wasn't a guy who stood in the middle of the floor and anchored a defense; Malone didn't control the middle. Duncan does these things.

if everyone has equal talent, Shaqs will always be better than Duncans who will always be better than Malones who will always be better than Dirks. do you get what I'm saying? that's how it'll always be. I think Hakeem vs. Duncan makes much more sense as a comparison than Duncan vs. Malone.



Posts like this are hilarious! Pure Comedy! Why, do you ask? I will enlighten you. Whenever Tim Duncan is being compared to a PF (meaning surpassing a PF) there is an outcry of indignation stating TD is a Center. When Tim Duncan is being compared to a center (meaning surpassing a Center), there comes the same outcry of indignation, and TD is magically transformed into a Center! Wow! This thread, however takes the proverbial cake. In this thread TD is neither a Center nor PF, but is a Corward, or is that Fenter? ROFL! For those unaware of why this strange phenomena is sure to crop up whenever TD is being compared, here is the reason. Those who don't like TD don't won't him compared, because his legacy is so great and surpassing, he has very few peers left; so instead of someone stating plainly and honestly that TD is greater than all but a few (Karl Malone? Give me break; give me a title; give me more trips to the finals even, since he played in the West, Jordan in the east, and it wasn't Jordan sending him packing from the playoffs for his 18 year, save twice), people would rather make false and meaningless assertions, anything and everything to not give TD his due.

For those who have the unmitigated gall to bring Bob Petit's name into the discussion, I have this to say: Bill Russel or Jerry West is the Goat. Russell averaged 15.1ppg and 22.5rpg for his career; West was Jordanesque long before Jordan, putting op phenomenal numbers, and consistently clutch (hence his nickname "Mr.Clutch"), maybe more than Jordan. But wait, you say. Those times were different; Russell would not average that many rebounds in todays game, and West's numbers would not be so gaudy nor clutch. So why or why would Bob Petits numbers be just as gaudy and dominant, if not more so, when Russell and West's wouldn't? Why would Bop Petit's lone (he only has one) championship all of a sudden become an unmatched dynasty today? This is nothing more than an extension of the same foolhardy line of thinking I already addressed: anything not to give TD his due. If and when TD wins another title, NBA fans around the world will exhume the corpse of Goliath and proclaim him the GOAT at the Center position. You've done it with other giants, why not him?

Last edited by poeticism707 : 06-15-2007 at 03:48 PM.
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Old 06-15-2007, 03:58 PM   #41
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbine
I've seeny uo mention this guy' name more in the last two months then I have ever read about him in three years.

Thing with him is, you can only compare what they did in their generation and it's relative to that, and that alone. Was he considered the best player the league at any point? Was he considered the best defesnive player in the league at one point? These questions can't be answered without a doubt because most of us are not old enough to know for sure.
He played against Russell's Celtics and Wilt Chamberlain. Are they ever excluded from comparisons over that? And by the way, he won MVP twice. He was also the top scorer in league history at the time of his retirement. So, yes, he was thought of as the top player in the league at various times throughout his career, though I've never heard him called the best defender.
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Old 06-15-2007, 04:10 PM   #42
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Quote:
Originally Posted by poeticism707


Posts like this are hilarious! Pure Comedy! Why, do you ask? I will enlighten you. Whenever Tim Duncan is being compared to a PF (meaning surpassing a PF) there is an outcry of indignation stating TD is a Center. When Tim Duncan is being compared to a center (meaning surpassing a Center), there comes the same outcry of indignation, and TD is magically transformed into a Center! Wow! This thread, however takes the proverbial cake. In this thread TD is neither a Center nor PF, but is a Corward, or is that Fenter? ROFL! For those unaware of why this strange phenomena is sure to crop up whenever TD is being compared, here is the reason. Those who don't like TD don't won't him compared, because his legacy is so great and surpassing, he has very few peers left; so instead of someone stating plainly and honestly that TD is greater than all but a few (Karl Malone? Give me break; give me a title; give me more trips to the finals even, since he played in the West, Jordan in the east, and it wasn't Jordan sending him packing from the playoffs for his 18 year, save twice), people would rather make false and meaningless assertions, anything and everything to not give TD his due.

For those who have the unmitigated gall to bring Bob Petit's name into the discussion, I have this to say: Bill Russel or Jerry West is the Goat. Russell averaged 15.1ppg and 22.5rpg for his career; West was Jordanesque long before Jordan, putting op phenomenal numbers, and consistently clutch (hence his nickname "Mr.Clutch"), maybe more than Jordan. But wait, you say. Those times were different; Russell would not average that many rebounds in todays game, and West's numbers would not be so gaudy nor clutch. So why or why would Bob Petits numbers be just as gaudy and dominant, if not more so, when Russell and West's wouldn't? Why would Bop Petit's lone (he only has one) championship all of a sudden become an unmatched dynasty today? This is nothing more than an extension of the same foolhardy line of thinking I already addressed: anything not to give TD his due. If and when TD wins another title, NBA fans around the world will exhume the corpse of Goliath and proclaim him the GOAT at the Center position. You've done it with other giants, why not him?
I've never seen a post started with a bunch of emoticons that wasn't retarded. Yours is no exception. You apparently don't realize that Jerry West and Bill Russell are (rightfully) widely acclaimed as two of the greatest players ever and greatest to ever play their positions. And no one said anythng about what numbers West and Russell would or would not get in the modern era. My post is not about taking credit away from Tim Duncan, it was about giving credit to Pettit, a player that deserves to be mentioned among the greatest pfs ever and yet is routinely forgotten. And FYI, there is absolutely no reason why West would not be as clutch in the modern era, and having been a great shooter that played in an era where there was no three-point line he may have scored even more points in the NBA today.
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Old 06-15-2007, 04:44 PM   #43
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
I've never seen a post started with a bunch of emoticons that wasn't retarded. Yours is no exception. You apparently don't realize that Jerry West and Bill Russell are (rightfully) widely acclaimed as two of the greatest players ever and greatest to ever play their positions. And no one said anythng about what numbers West and Russell would or would not get in the modern era. My post is not about taking credit away from Tim Duncan, it was about giving credit to Pettit, a player that deserves to be mentioned among the greatest pfs ever and yet is routinely forgotten. And FYI, there is absolutely no reason why West would not be as clutch in the modern era, and having been a great shooter that played in an era where there was no three-point line he may have scored even more points in the NBA today.

My post was not in response to yours, but either your guilt merited an explanation, or your intellect lacks the capacity to process the crux of my point. It was not too discredit Pettit, but to expose the motives of most for throwing players into a discussion simply to discredit another player (in this case TD). I alluded to West and especially Russell, whether he is Top-Ten or Top-5 All-Time, virtually NO ONE considers him the GOAT, the reasons given because the game was underdeveloped or that much less athletic, etc. Hence, if Jordan who is widely considered the be the GOAT gets the nod over Russell because of these reasons, why doesn't Duncan automatically get the nod over Pettit, when their careers and accomplishments are not close, meaning Duncan is far ahead.

By the way, you are one to talk about emoticons when your avatar is a green smiling vat of kool aid. Also, if were you, I would not be proud of such sophomoric word placement, below level average syntax, and under-developed ideas as you exhibited in your reply. Since you cannot understand a straight forward post, and based on your post, I am hard pressed to know which is lacking more: your basketball knowledge (very much) or your education (non-existent).
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Old 06-15-2007, 04:54 PM   #44
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Duncan > Malone

Duncan is a MUCH better defender and while not the volume scorer or as efficient as Malone, he is a better back to the basket post player which open things up more.

I'd take Duncan over Malone on my team any day.
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Old 06-15-2007, 05:01 PM   #45
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Default Re: Please tell me why Malone > Duncan

Quote:
Originally Posted by poeticism707
My post was not in response to yours, but either your guilt merited an explanation, or your intellect lacks the capacity to process the crux of my point. It was not too discredit Pettit, but to expose the motives of most for throwing players into a discussion simply to discredit another player (in this case TD). I alluded to West and especially Russell, whether he is Top-Ten or Top-5 All-Time, virtually NO ONE considers him the GOAT, the reasons given because the game was underdeveloped or that much less athletic, etc. Hence, if Jordan who is widely considered the be the GOAT gets the nod over Russell because of these reasons, why doesn't Duncan automatically get the nod over Pettit, when their careers and accomplishments are not close, meaning Duncan is far ahead.

By the way, you are one to talk about emoticons when your avatar is a green smiling vat of kool aid. Also, if were you, I would not be proud of such sophomoric word placement, below level average syntax, and under-developed ideas as you exhibited in your reply. Since you cannot understand a straight forward post, and based on your post, I am hard pressed to know which is lacking more: your basketball knowledge (very much) or your education (non-existent).
1: I'm the only one to mention Pettit in this thread so trying to act like it wasn't about my post is stupid...or, as you might say, "disingenuous."

2: Pettit played against Chamberlain and Russell, guys that are as athletic as anyobe to ever play the game. Athleticism was not abruptly invented in 1984.

3: Jordan is viewed as being better than West because he lead his team to more Championships, scored more points, won more MVPs, more scoring titles, etc. He is the more accomplished player. This is not about athletic ability. Why do you think that Magic and Bird are remembered as all-time greats? Neither was a run/jump athlete. Basketball is a game of skill, not just the ability to jump high.

4: My vat of Kool-Aid wonders how stupid you must be to mistake it for an emoticon.
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