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Old 03-14-2007, 12:29 PM   #16
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

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Originally Posted by Da KO King
Can you give a logical reason why KG could not effectively replace Larry on those teams?
Larry Bird was the clutch, go-to scorer. In most areas, Garnett would replace Bird pretty well, would even be a great improvement on d, but in that one area he's way behind.
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Old 03-14-2007, 12:31 PM   #17
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

larry is clutch and can take over, garnett can't, larry is at worst a top 3 clutch performer of all-time along with jordan and west, so a better question is, can the garnett groopies tell me why discredit a true legend like larry for his teammates just to make excuses for someone who has never proven to even be better than webber ? get back to me as soon as possible.
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Old 03-14-2007, 12:35 PM   #18
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

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Originally Posted by DreamRockets
larry is clutch and can take over, garnett can't, larry is at worst a top 3 clutch performer of all-time along with jordan and west, so a better question is, can the garnett groopies tell me why discredit a true legend like larry for his teammates just to make excuses for someone who has never proven to even be better than webber ? get back to me as soon as possible.
Just because we don't call Garnett a "choking wannabe" doesn't mean I'm a "*******" I'd say it just hows me to be somewhat reasonable, as opposed to bashing a great player just because he was never fortunate enough to be on a great team. I do not discredit Larry Bird, I just slightly disagree with him. There's a difference.
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Old 03-14-2007, 12:36 PM   #19
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

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Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
Larry Bird was the clutch, go-to scorer. In most areas, Garnett would replace Bird pretty well, would even be a great improvement on d, but in that one area he's way behind.
So you honestly believe that on the 80's era Celtics Garnett would not be able to get 25+ per game? You seem what KG did the one season ('03-'04) he had two above average players with him. 24/15/5 in the regular season and the playoffs. Was a Sam Cassell injury away from going to the NBA Finals.

I'm not one to say he "deserves" to be traded to a contender. Nor do I feel sorry for KG being stuck in Minny. However, people aren't acknowledging exactly how talented a player he is and how poor his team's have been overall.
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Old 03-14-2007, 12:39 PM   #20
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

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Can you give a logical reason why KG could not effectively replace Larry on those teams?


Even if we assume that KG and Bird have the same individual impact on the game, which is a very big assumption that I'd like to see argued, KG would've been more of a redundancy with the front court in place (McHale, Parish) than Bird was. KG's game doesn't compliment that team as much as Bird's did, because they didn't need rebounding, post scoring, or post defense. KG can play on the perimeter, but he has nowhere near the perimeter skills of Bird. The team would've been substantially weaker based on poorer balance.
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Old 03-14-2007, 12:53 PM   #21
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

if i was building a team today, i'd take a prime garnett over bird anyday. garnett is a badass, i love how people try to even debate this
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Old 03-14-2007, 12:55 PM   #22
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

Quote:
But this much, I'll agree with: Garnett is not a great clutch player...I don't know if that means he's not super-competitive, but he doesn't have the signature game-winning moments of most of the all-time greats. Now, I'm not calling him a choker either, just pointing out that he has no history of great play at the end of the game.
This is the correct assessment of Garnett's clutch play.

He is neither great nor sub-par. He's certainly had his clutch moments, but they seem to spread out for him to develop the proper reputation.

Another part of it is people's perception of Garnett as "the whole team." He's had so little talent around him so many different seasons that people come to expect a little more out of Garnett than they do out of other #1 guys.
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Old 03-14-2007, 12:56 PM   #23
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

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Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
This is the kind of critique that I just can't find valid. What, do you think that Garnett chooses to get a triple-double instead of a win? How could he even do that? Does he stand under the basket and think, "if I grab this rebound we'll lose the game, but I'll have my 20th straight double, so who cares?"
Don't ask me ask him. He's the one that made that 20,10,and 5 commercial. He must believe that he can go out and put those numbers up at will.
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Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
This is also unreasonable. He has said that he wants certain players. He has publicly criticized Minnie for not doing anything around the trade deadline this season. Beyond that, what can he do? He can "demand" whatever he wants, he's still just a player, an employee. He does not get to make trades.
He did that this season? Because I don't remember him fighting to keep Cassell in town. Cassell is the perfect teammate for him. Sam really steps it up in the post season. Why KG didn't got to bat for him is beyond me.

He is not just "a player" he is the franchise player. The player they been building around for years. But in this case I agree with you. Like someone told me long ago; "speak now or forever hold your peace". KG was never outspoken, so who is going to listen to him now?

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Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
No it didn't, lots of people talk about it, and it's true. Take Bird; he played with McHale, Parrish, DJ (R.I.P.), Walton, Ainge...these guys are All-Stars and Hall of Famers. When has Garnett ever been around teammates even half as good?
I'mma tell you like this. If I was a decent NBA free agent. I would never play in MInnie. Because one bad season I'll be labeled and another KG teammate that sucked. And there are dozens of them. I can think of a few players that went into Minnie with their reputations pretty much intact... to never being heard from ever again.
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Old 03-14-2007, 12:59 PM   #24
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

Bird's a bad ass. "Yeah I said it" :

Quote:
I can think of a few players that went into Minnie with their reputations pretty much intact... to never being heard from ever again.

list them
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Old 03-14-2007, 01:04 PM   #25
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

This has got to be one of the most incredible data points in league history:

The Celtics won 29 games in '79, the year before Bird arrived.

The Celtics won 61 games in '80, Bird's rookie year.

They did not add any other player that received significant minutes.

They were not hit by injuries harder in '79 than '80.

They did not tank in '79, as Bird was drafted the year prior.
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Old 03-14-2007, 01:04 PM   #26
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

Bird was a better scorer, shooter, and passer. More importantly, he was a bigger competitor.
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Old 03-14-2007, 01:06 PM   #27
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

Quote:
I can think of a few players that went into Minnie with their reputations pretty much intact... to never being heard from ever again.
About the only guy I could think of would be Terrell Brandon, but he was only not heard of again because he had his kneecaps surgically replaced with scrambled eggs.
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Old 03-14-2007, 01:12 PM   #28
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

Quote:
Originally Posted by 0ne50
Don't ask me ask him. He's the one that made that 20,10,and 5 commercial. He must believe that he can go out and put those numbers up at will.
You tried to make a really silly "point." Please just let it go.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 0ne50
He did that this season? Because I don't remember him fighting to keep Cassell in town. Cassell is the perfect teammate for him. Sam really steps it up in the post season. Why KG didn't got to bat for him is beyond me.
He is not just "a player" he is the franchise player. The player they been building around for years. But in this case I agree with you. Like someone told me long ago; "speak now or forever hold your peace". KG was never outspoken, so who is going to listen to him now?
You don't seem to know what KG has said. Do you recall the line "thank God for opt-outs?" he wants better teammates, has said this to the T-Wolves repeatedly. and that's not even his job. You are criticizing a player for being a poor GM. That makes no sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 0ne50
I'mma tell you like this. If I was a decent NBA free agent. I would never play in MInnie. Because one bad season I'll be labeled and another KG teammate that sucked. And there are dozens of them. I can think of a few players that went into Minnie with their reputations pretty much intact... to never being heard from ever again.
Yes, it's all Garnett's fault. Idiotic.
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Old 03-14-2007, 01:13 PM   #29
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

I wont diss Kg... but I dont think he could replace Larry Bird on those Celtic teams because there were alot of spots over theyears where Larry WON the games for the Celtics... Games where he turned L's into W's.. I dont think Kg could duplicate Larry's clutch play
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Old 03-14-2007, 01:13 PM   #30
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Default Re: Larry Legend on Garnett

Quote:
Originally Posted by Da KO King
So you honestly believe that on the 80's era Celtics Garnett would not be able to get 25+ per game? You seem what KG did the one season ('03-'04) he had two above average players with him. 24/15/5 in the regular season and the playoffs. Was a Sam Cassell injury away from going to the NBA Finals.
He might be able to average 25 but that's not what I'm talking about. I said "clutch, go-to scorer." And Garnett is nowhere near the scorer Bird was in the clutch. The End.
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