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Old 03-14-2007, 02:28 PM   #46
EricForman
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Default Re: Shaq>wade still?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannonball
I know great Big man. Are the key to sucuss.

Yes, sometimes I really find it hard to believe at the amount of people still dismissing Shaq/Duncan or downplay their greatness.

Why do we still hear people claim Shaq isn't top 10 all time, or how Shaq wasn't better than Hakeem? Shaq is a MORTAL LOCK to be ranked higher than Hakeem on any and every all time greatest list, deal with it. Hell, Shaq should be top 5, 6 all time, he's basically earned his way up there with Magic and Bird, as in on the same level.

Duncan gets the same ignorant treatment. Last year, some actually believed Parker was the Spurs MVP, or that Duncan wasn't a superstar anymore because his points and rebounds dipped. Also, why do I still hear "he's not better than KG" or "Duncan's always had a stacked cast"? No one realizes he's been in the league a decade now and has a winning % that is f'ning UNPARALLELED, despite playing with 2 or 3 totally different cast, won rings with an old, aging cast (99) and a young, raw-as-hell cast (03)? 3 rings+3 finals mvp+2 regular mvps+his win % = easily a top 15, 18 player all time and guys like Dirk and KG are nowhere CLOSE career-wise, and quite frankly, it would take a damn near MIRACLE at this point for those two to "catch up" to Duncan career wise.

Last edited by EricForman : 03-14-2007 at 02:31 PM.
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Old 03-14-2007, 02:52 PM   #47
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Default Re: Shaq>wade still?

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricForman
Yes, sometimes I really find it hard to believe at the amount of people still dismissing Shaq/Duncan or downplay their greatness.

Why do we still hear people claim Shaq isn't top 10 all time, or how Shaq wasn't better than Hakeem? Shaq is a MORTAL LOCK to be ranked higher than Hakeem on any and every all time greatest list, deal with it. Hell, Shaq should be top 5, 6 all time, he's basically earned his way up there with Magic and Bird, as in on the same level.

Duncan gets the same ignorant treatment. Last year, some actually believed Parker was the Spurs MVP, or that Duncan wasn't a superstar anymore because his points and rebounds dipped. Also, why do I still hear "he's not better than KG" or "Duncan's always had a stacked cast"? No one realizes he's been in the league a decade now and has a winning % that is f'ning UNPARALLELED, despite playing with 2 or 3 totally different cast, won rings with an old, aging cast (99) and a young, raw-as-hell cast (03)? 3 rings+3 finals mvp+2 regular mvps+his win % = easily a top 15, 18 player all time and guys like Dirk and KG are nowhere CLOSE career-wise, and quite frankly, it would take a damn near MIRACLE at this point for those two to "catch up" to Duncan career wise.

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Old 03-14-2007, 04:14 PM   #48
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Default Re: Shaq>wade still?

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricForman
Yes, sometimes I really find it hard to believe at the amount of people still dismissing Shaq/Duncan or downplay their greatness.

Why do we still hear people claim Shaq isn't top 10 all time, or how Shaq wasn't better than Hakeem? Shaq is a MORTAL LOCK to be ranked higher than Hakeem on any and every all time greatest list, deal with it. Hell, Shaq should be top 5, 6 all time, he's basically earned his way up there with Magic and Bird, as in on the same level.

Duncan gets the same ignorant treatment. Last year, some actually believed Parker was the Spurs MVP, or that Duncan wasn't a superstar anymore because his points and rebounds dipped. Also, why do I still hear "he's not better than KG" or "Duncan's always had a stacked cast"? No one realizes he's been in the league a decade now and has a winning % that is f'ning UNPARALLELED, despite playing with 2 or 3 totally different cast, won rings with an old, aging cast (99) and a young, raw-as-hell cast (03)? 3 rings+3 finals mvp+2 regular mvps+his win % = easily a top 15, 18 player all time and guys like Dirk and KG are nowhere CLOSE career-wise, and quite frankly, it would take a damn near MIRACLE at this point for those two to "catch up" to Duncan career wise.

I haven't seen ANYBODY say Shaq isn't a top-10 center of all time. Do you mean top-10 center or top-10 period? If it's the latter, then it's certainly debatable. As for Shaq vs. Hakeem, that is also debatable and has been so in this forum.
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Old 03-14-2007, 04:32 PM   #49
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Default Re: Shaq>wade still?

i dont think that u should be able to compare the two because they play diff positions...they support each other and thats what makes the team good...right now the team realizes that the yneed to nut up and play ball if they want an post-season future
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Old 03-15-2007, 06:47 AM   #50
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Default Re: Shaq>wade still?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedinpurpleTwo
I haven't seen ANYBODY say Shaq isn't a top-10 center of all time. Do you mean top-10 center or top-10 period? If it's the latter, then it's certainly debatable. As for Shaq vs. Hakeem, that is also debatable and has been so in this forum.

Um, if anyone said Shaq wasn't top 10 center all time, I wouldn't even waste time talking to them. Of course I'm referring to all time. And no its really not debatable anymore if Shaq belongs in the top 10, only one you can even make a case for having better careers than Shaq are-- jordan, bird, magic, kareem, bill russell. That's about it. Dr. J? Wilt? Oscar? Jerry West? Shaq won more than all of them and with the exception of Chamberlain, dominated more and put up equal, if not better than numbers.

People just take Shaq for granted. Sit back sometime and look back at his career, look at what he's done. Go check his career stats, check his playoff stats for the three title runs, check his NBA Finals average...... unless you're biased, or one of them guys that insist the older generations are superior, there is no DOUBT Shaq is top 6 or 7 all time. He's bascially accomplished as much as Bird and Magic has.
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Old 03-15-2007, 11:03 AM   #51
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Default Re: Shaq>wade still?

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricForman
WTF are you talking about? I didn't compare Shaq to Duncan in the Shaq vs Duncan sense. I am saying Shaq is FAR MORE VALUABLE than his stats, which was to COUNTER YOUR FLAWED argument that Shaq's not better than Wade right now because he only averages 16 and 7.

No SH*T Sherlock Shaq isn't what he used to be. But a 16 and 7 Shaq is still more valuable to a team than 85% to 90% of the league.

I mentioend Duncan because Duncan is like Shaq, in the sense that they are FAR MORE VALUABLE THAN THEIR STATS because they command double teams, throws the opponent's defense off, sets up teammates for EASY buckets, even when they're not scoring, they're strong enough a decoy that suddenly gusy like Damon Jones would become a legit threat.

Then there's someone like Jamal Crawford, Stephon Marbury, or Larry Hughes, they are probably worse than their stats because of their bad shot selections, costly turnovers, gambling on defense, and dumb ass me-first play in general.

I always say this, one of Duncan's 17 and 10 games is probably more valuable than one of "starbury's" 30 point nights. Just like I said, Shaq's 16 and 7+his presence+his ability to free his teammates up makes him still oneof the more valuable pieces to a winning team.

It's not really fair to compare since alot of Shaq's effectiveness at this stage is due to the lack of talent at that position league wide. Shaq battles battles a quality player maybe 5 or 6 times the entire year.
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Old 03-15-2007, 11:30 AM   #52
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Default Re: Shaq>wade still?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hotlantadude81
It's not really fair to compare since alot of Shaq's effectiveness at this stage is due to the lack of talent at that position league wide. Shaq battles battles a quality player maybe 5 or 6 times the entire year.

is it Shaq´s faul?
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Old 03-15-2007, 11:41 AM   #53
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Default Re: Shaq>wade still?

Quote:
Originally Posted by yall's G8r bait
i dont think that u should be able to compare the two because they play diff positions...they support each other and thats what makes the team good...right now the team realizes that the yneed to nut up and play ball if they want an post-season future

Were talking about who carries the team better.

Btw the way while were at it

Tmac>Yao?
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Old 03-15-2007, 11:45 AM   #54
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Default Re: Shaq>wade still?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannonball
Were talking about who carries the team better.

Btw the way while were at it

Tmac>Yao?

If you'd have asked me this earlier in the year I'd have had to find you, and punch you in the face. But now after the Rockets did fine without Yao, it brings up an interesting debate. Of course Dikembe played like he wasn't 75 years old, and T-Mac played like a man possesed. However it's hard to ignore the fact that the Rockets had an impressive record with Yao sitting.

EDIT: But give it another year or so and it'll be Yao's team.

But one thing's for sure, T-Mac w/ Yao means trouble.
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Old 03-15-2007, 11:47 AM   #55
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Default Re: Shaq>wade still?

:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timmy D for MVP
If you'd have asked me this earlier in the year I'd have had to find you, and punch you in the face. But now after the Rockets did fine without Yao, it brings up an interesting debate. Of course Dikembe played like he wasn't 75 years old, and T-Mac played like a man possesed. However it's hard to ignore the fact that the Rockets had an impressive record with Yao sitting.

EDIT: But give it another year or so and it'll be Yao's team.

But one thing's for sure, T-Mac w/ Yao means trouble.
:

Yeah I'm talking about carrying the team. And I think tmac did an amazing job.
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