Playoff performances better than 2012 ECF G6?

[Rose'sACL]

1) I'm not a stat-head. Stats don't tell the whole story.

2) There is no more pressure than when both teams are fighting for their playoff lives. Bos didn't feel the same pressure that Miami (and Lebron, in particular) felt in that game.

Take any casual, non-biased observer and have them watch Larry's Game 7 vs Detroit and Lebron's Game 6 vs Bos and I think most would say Larry's game has more weight. Larry's game carries more weight because it's a part of a larger story bigger than Larry. Boston and Detroit played an epic game with Larry driving the nail in the coffin. Lebron's Game 6 vs Boston doesn't have a larger narrative except for Lebron fighting off his demons. The game itself was a dud.

3) Clutch moments will always matter, especially for me.

keep thinking that. pretty much the whole world agreed that lebron was under the most pressure any athlete has been in at least the nba if not all the US sports. pretty much all of it was his fault but that only increase the amount of pressure because it was his own fault. Game was only a dud because lebron made it so.
according to your logic, lebron was under more pressure in game 7 last year which any unbiased observer would tell you is just false. He could have played like he did against boston in game 6 and game would have been pretty much over unless rest of the heat had 30 turnovers.
Why can't jordan fans be happy that he is the GOAT according to most people. You have make him a god.

[Da_Realist]

Y'all dudes are so bitter with MJ = Goat talk. Let's keep the focus on the games in question. Whether he's the Goat or not adds absolutely nothing to this discussion.

As far as the topic... I see what you're saying. I still say,

Larry's game carries more weight because it's a part of a larger story bigger than Larry. Boston and Detroit played an epic game with Larry driving the nail in the coffin. Lebron's Game 6 vs Boston doesn't have a larger narrative except for Lebron fighting off his demons. The game itself was a dud.

Great performance by Lebron. Great for his legacy. I just don't think it's the same as staring down an opponent shot for shot in an elimination game, scoring 17 points in the 4th and hitting 2 clutch shots to win the series.

[Solefade]

there's really no argument when it comes to '12 ecf g6 was the most pressure loaded game ever for any superstar...and yes maybe lebron put himself in that situation and it is what it is but he took total control of that moment when everyone was expecting him to fail


sure..MJ had some way better games statistically but lebron totally decimated that choker label that was attached to him

[sdot_thadon]

So all these replies and still no one has managed to answer my question. I keep seeing these numbers thrown about which are good games but who was in a position with more to lose and under more pressure than Lebron had for that particular moment? I see you guys throwing game 5's and game 2's and sht like that around but none that fit the bill. The heat wave game is cool but in the scheme of things was only game 5 in a tied series. MJ's series winner against the Cav's was as close as it got I'd say, but he still lost in the postseason with no damage to his image/legacy.

Lebron had way more to lose than just a basketball game. They'd be eliminated from the playoffs, with this "stacked" team. Another blow to his public image and likely to his off court earning ability, as well as a fatal blow to his goal of being goat. Mj and bird didn't go through their careers with every performance scrutinized and measured up to alltime greats this same way we see Lebron deal with.

[Da_Realist]

We're looking at it from two different perspectives. I define pressure as in game, crowd on it's feet, high level of intensity from all players on the court, one mistake could cost you the series, down to the wire, clutch baskets needed on every possession by both teams type of thing. Real basketball pressure.

You're talking from a media-induced, mythical faux "legacy" defining perspective that's based solely on Lebron and has nothing to do with what actually happened in the game aside from what Lebron did. Media and fanboy pressure.

From a nail biter, edge of your seat, intensity so thick you could cut with a knife, truly legacy defining perspective, there are others better than Lebron's Game 6.

From a "If he screws up again he won't have a chance to be GOAT" fanboy perspective, then Lebron's Game 6 is up there.

[sdot_thadon]

We're looking at it from two different perspectives. I define pressure as in game, crowd on it's feet, high level of intensity from all players on the court, one mistake could cost you the series, down to the wire, clutch baskets needed on every possession by both teams type of thing. Real basketball pressure.

You're talking from a media-induced, mythical faux "legacy" defining perspective that's based solely on Lebron and has nothing to do with what actually happened in the game aside from what Lebron did. Media and fanboy pressure.

From a nail biter, edge of your seat, intensity so thick you could cut with a knife, truly legacy defining perspective, there are others better than Lebron's Game 6.

From a "If he screws up again he won't have a chance to be GOAT" fanboy perspective, then Lebron's Game 6 is up there.

So tell me what was being discussed all over when it came to Lebron, fan or not we all had to hear it. I understand what you're getting at and thise were great moments no doubt. Clutch moments. But just moments. I love clutch plays down the stretch as much as the next man but this was an entire game damn near. Took the life out of the crowd and the opponent. I watched most of Mj's career and he had tons of incredidble moments, way more than Lebron. The few Lebron has had though were things Mj himself hadn't done, and that doesn't diminish him one bit in my eyes.

[Da_Realist]

MJ's series winner against the Cav's was as close as it got I'd say, but he still lost in the postseason with no damage to his image/legacy.

I disagree with this. MJ's series winner was very important for the Bulls. That shot propelled Chicago to the ECF where they learned what it's like to play against championship ball. If they lost that game, they would have exited in the first round and their team maturity/growth would have been stunted. Who knows what kind of knee-jerk reactions might have happened had they taken a step backwards (they reached the ecsf the year before).

1989 built a foundation for the 1990 team which helped them become champions in 1991 and eventually the team of the decade.

[Frozen1]

Based on the circumnstances, that was the clutchest performance of all time.

I

[Solefade]

We're looking at it from two different perspectives. I define pressure as in game, crowd on it's feet, high level of intensity from all players on the court, one mistake could cost you the series, down to the wire, clutch baskets needed on every possession by both teams type of thing. Real basketball pressure.

You're talking from a media-induced, mythical faux "legacy" defining perspective that's based solely on Lebron and has nothing to do with what actually happened in the game aside from what Lebron did. Media and fanboy pressure.

From a nail biter, edge of your seat, intensity so thick you could cut with a knife, truly legacy defining perspective, there are others better than Lebron's Game 6.

From a "If he screws up again he won't have a chance to be GOAT" fanboy perspective, then Lebron's Game 6 is up there.

that media pressure also includes basketball pressure lol

[J Shuttlesworth]

So all these replies and still no one has managed to answer my question. I keep seeing these numbers thrown about which are good games but who was in a position with more to lose and under more pressure than Lebron had for that particular moment? I see you guys throwing game 5's and game 2's and sht like that around but none that fit the bill. The heat wave game is cool but in the scheme of things was only game 5 in a tied series. MJ's series winner against the Cav's was as close as it got I'd say, but he still lost in the postseason with no damage to his image/legacy.

Lebron had way more to lose than just a basketball game. They'd be eliminated from the playoffs, with this "stacked" team. Another blow to his public image and likely to his off court earning ability, as well as a fatal blow to his goal of being goat. Mj and bird didn't go through their careers with every performance scrutinized and measured up to alltime greats this same way we see Lebron deal with.

Part of it is the era too. LeBron is one of the only players that were all over ESPN even since high school basically guaranteed to be the next MJ. We also have Twitter, Forums, and other social media where he is constantly being judged 24/7 to the point where it's unavoidable. I mean ESPN was literally showing his 4th quarter stats all day during the 2011 finals. Because of social media, LeBron is the most highly scrutinized player in the most highly scrutinized era.