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Old 10-14-2013, 05:48 PM   #31
DMAVS41
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by kennethgriffin
if thats the case then who isnt a hall of famer


how many guys in the nba dont around 4 reserve allstar games and a single 2nd team all nba

and his current average isnt even what he'l retire with

considering

2011 - 18.8ppg, 52%
2012 - 17.4ppg, 50%
2013 - 13.7ppg, 46%

he'l play 4-5 more years

projected

best case
2014 - 17ppg
2015 - 16ppg
2016 - 16ppg
2017 - 14ppg
2018 - 12ppg

worst case
2014 - 14ppg
2015 - 13ppg
2016 - 13ppg
2017 - 11ppg
2018 - 9ppg

no matter what.. his career average will drop from 18/9 to around 16/8

and worst case ( based on his current body conditioning ) ... his career average will drop from 18/9 to 15/7



so even with just 1 post prime drop off season. his career average is boarderline hall of famer


by the time hes retired.. he wont have a chance in hell at making it



shaq had a 27ppg career average... it dropped to 24ppg after his last few years of being tossed around hanging onto his playing days


What are you talking about? Gasol's 3 straight title appearances and back to back titles will go a long way in beefing up his resume.

You can't just ignore that.
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Old 10-14-2013, 05:52 PM   #32
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMAVS41
What are you talking about? Gasol's 3 straight title appearances and back to back titles will go a long way in beefing up his resume.

You can't just ignore that.


oh common... titles and finals appearences are used when talking about legends.. not role players

people laugh at kobes 2000 title because he was "only" a 1st team all nba defender, 2nd team all nba, starting allstar with 23/5/5


they say only kobes last 4 rings are on par other hof'ers



so if thats the case.. then paus 18ppg, 0 all defensive team, 3rd team all nba reserve ASG titles are worth even less than that... "I WOULD ASSUME???" lol

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Old 10-14-2013, 05:56 PM   #33
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMAVS41
Not to mention the main reason Gasol hasn't been himself since the 11 playoffs was being forced out of his comfort zone by Bynum and then Howard.

He was a 19/10/3 59% TS 23.3 PER guy in the 2011 regular season. It was Bynum coming back and playing more minutes and taking Gasol away from what he did best that messed with the Lakers chemistry and Gasol's effectiveness.

He was absurdly good as a 2nd option from 08 through 11. And I bet you see him get back to producing very well if his idiotic coach can put him in the right position to excel.

I don't even view him as a 2nd option. He was a co-1st option imo. He has dominated so many series. In game 7 vs houston 09 Kobe choked and Gasol tore it up and led them to the win. He is so underappreciated. I agree he will perform well now. Gasol is pretty much a center on offense so other centers did get in the way. That team was not some Batman-Robin type team that people want to make it out to be.

One key point is that whenever Gasol had a subpar game they rarely won yet when Kobe had entire subpar series, let alone games they could still win.

That team's success was fueled on the dominant front court play. People give Gasol flack for not even winning a playoff series before LA well what did prime Kobe did? Failed in all 3 chances he got. Kobe even had 2 7th seeds and a missed playoffs. Yet Gasol joins them and they win the west 3 times and back to back titles yet Gasol is ignored.
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Old 10-14-2013, 05:56 PM   #34
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by kennethgriffin
oh common... titles and finals appearences are used when talking about legends.. not role players

people laugh at kobes 2000 title because he was "only" a 1st team all nba defender, 2nd team all nba, starting allstar with 23/5/5


they say only kobes last 4 rings are on par other hof'ers



so if thats the case.. then paus 18ppg, 0 all defensive team, 3rd team all nba reserve ASG titles are worth even less than that... "I WOULD ASSUME???" lol


This is not true at all. You are talking across points as usual. The hall of fame is different than ranking players in a specific order.

This is true whether you like it or not...which makes this so fun. Gasol will be in the hall of fame whether you like it or not...and his 3 finals appearances and 2 titles will be part of the reason why...whether you like it or not.

Being a part of titles as the clear cut 2nd best player while playing at an all nba level matters for the history of the game. Again...whether you like it or not.

And when you combine what Gasol did from 08 through 10...with a very good career overall. You get someone going into the Hall. Simple as that.
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Old 10-14-2013, 05:58 PM   #35
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMAVS41
This is not true at all. You are talking across points as usual. The hall of fame is different than ranking players in a specific order.

This is true whether you like it or not...which makes this so fun. Gasol will be in the hall of fame whether you like it or not...and his 3 finals appearances and 2 titles will be part of the reason why...whether you like it or not.

Being a part of titles as the clear cut 2nd best player while playing at an all nba level matters for the history of the game. Again...whether you like it or not.

And when you combine what Gasol did from 08 through 10...with a very good career overall. You get someone going into the Hall. Simple as that.


i never said he had no chance. i said he has a 50% chance infact... but it wont be solely based on his nba resume

even you gotta admit i'm not that far off by saying kobe won without another nba hall of fame team mate

otherwise we might aswell throw in guys like rasheed wallace


if you wanna lower the standard of what a hof'r is just to mess with kobe or his fans.. go ahead.


but you couldnt look at anyone with a straight face and say pau gasoft is a hall of fame talent.
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Old 10-14-2013, 06:01 PM   #36
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Gasol is quite clearly a HOFer
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Old 10-14-2013, 06:02 PM   #37
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate



Kennyboy, deal with it bud. Gasol's a HOFer.
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Old 10-14-2013, 06:06 PM   #38
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fudge


Kennyboy, deal with it bud. Gasol's a HOFer.

not an nba hall of famer though



international contributions elect
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Old 10-14-2013, 06:07 PM   #39
Heavincent
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMAVS41
Not to mention the main reason Gasol hasn't been himself since the 11 playoffs was being forced out of his comfort zone by Bynum and then Howard.

He was a 19/10/3 59% TS 23.3 PER guy in the 2011 regular season. It was Bynum coming back and playing more minutes and taking Gasol away from what he did best that messed with the Lakers chemistry and Gasol's effectiveness.

He was absurdly good as a 2nd option from 08 through 11. And I bet you see him get back to producing very well if his idiotic coach can put him in the right position to excel.

Funny how you agree with blatant trolls such as secund2nun. I thought you were an objective and unbiased poster?
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Old 10-14-2013, 06:08 PM   #40
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Not only that, but more largely speaking, it is well known that the 08 to 10 Lakers were a stacked team. To suggest otherwise and try to paint them as a "one man band" is pure historical revisionism. They had by far the best frontcourt in the NBA, with Gasol averaging 18, 11, 3.5 and near 2 blocks, Bynum averaging 15, 8 and 1.5 blocks, and Odom averaging 10, 10 and 3.5, not to mention Ron Artest and his incredible defense. And it's not just the stats - it was really obvious to anyone watching the games that the Lakers had a huge competitive advantage against pretty much any team in the frontcourt.
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Old 10-14-2013, 06:10 PM   #41
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by kennethgriffin


no other player in history has done it

the only other guy on his team that might make it will be as an international contributor

Pau Gasols individual nba accolades arent up to par

4 reserve allstar selections
1 third team all nba
2 second team all nba's
0-16 in the playoffs without kobe bryant

just as a comparison.. this is anfernee hardaways career

4 starting allstar selections
2 first team all nba's
1 third team all nba
9 playoff wins without shaq


now.. say anfernee hardaway lucked out 2 rings with the suns behind jason kidd.. even if he had 2 good years.. he still wouldnt be a hall of famer.

and making the hall of fame based on winning olympic silver medals or euro competition gold isnt exactly on the same level as an nba hall of famer. considering that if an american wins a silver medal or some second rate international gold. that wouldnt get them a hall of fame nomination. plus its allot easier to be the best player on a euro national team than it is on the US team


By this logic, Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson and Larry Bird, among others, did the same thing. None of their teammates were Hall of Famers at the time they won championships.

Gasol WILL be in the Hall one day. His international career guarantees that.
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Old 10-14-2013, 06:12 PM   #42
kennethgriffin
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by sportjames23
By this logic, Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson and Larry Bird, among others, did the same thing. None of their teammates were Hall of Famers at the time they won championships.

Gasol WILL be in the Hall one day. His international career guarantees that.


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Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate


......
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Old 10-14-2013, 06:12 PM   #43
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

op being a *** again. gasol is a hofer. go cry about it.
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Old 10-14-2013, 06:14 PM   #44
DMAVS41
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by kennethgriffin
i never said he had no chance. i said he has a 50% chance infact... but it wont be solely based on his nba resume

even you gotta admit i'm not that far off by saying kobe won without another nba hall of fame team mate

otherwise we might aswell throw in guys like rasheed wallace


if you wanna lower the standard of what a hof'r is just to mess with kobe or his fans.. go ahead.


but you couldnt look at anyone with a straight face and say pau gasoft is a hall of fame talent.

Actually I could. I think Gasol absolutely is a hall of fame talent.

Again. What is the point of this thread? Many star players have won titles with 2nd options worse than 09 and 10 Gasol.

So I still don't see the point.

Do you really think 17/10/3/1/2 57% TS 20.8 PER career playoff performers with 3 finals appearances and 2 titles as the clear cut 2nd best player grow on trees?

You brought up Rasheed Wallace...lets have a look;

14/6/2/1/1 52% TS 15.5 PER career playoffs

1 title he averaged 13/8/2

05 finals appearance he averaged 14/7/1

Wallace played 16 years in the league. Gasol has already played 12 years.
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Old 10-14-2013, 06:20 PM   #45
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Default Re: the only man to win multiple championships without another NBA HOF team mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavincent
Funny how you agree with blatant trolls such as secund2nun. I thought you were an objective and unbiased poster?

Sorry...it's trolling to claim Gasol is not a hall of famer.

Or come up with this absurd notion that Gasol wasn't a beast in 09 and 10.

I keep asking what the point of this thread is? Because we all know 09 and 10 Gasol was better than a lot of 2nd options that players have won with.

03 Parker, 11 Terry, and 13 Wade were all clearly worse than 10 Gasol.

I'd also argue that 07 Parker and 04 Billups or Hamilton (whoever you choose as the 2nd best player) was worse as well.

So I don't see the point of this thread at all.
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