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Old 08-21-2013, 10:04 AM   #16
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lakers2877
Kobe played them in 04

Wade played them in 06.

They went to back to back finals pin 04 and 05

Back to back deep playoff runs

To say they were the same teams is laughably stupid

Problem with this logic is, Wade was doing a lot of the same shit to them the year before prior to getting hurt. He missed game 6 and the Heat didn't break 70. So yeah, he did face them.
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Old 08-21-2013, 10:26 AM   #17
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lakers2877
Kobe played them in 04

Wade played them in 06.

They went to back to back finals pin 04 and 05


Wade played them in 05 too and in 3 games prior to injuring his back was avg 34/7/5 52% vs them and had the Heat up 3-2.

He did have a horrific Gm 1 though, but after that game he had them figured out and was DESTROYING them, but as is the story of Wade's career he couldn't stay healthy.

The 05 Heat team was a MONSTER, they swept the 05 Nets and Wizards with a healthy prime Arenas/Jamison/Butler like nothing (with SHAQ a complete non-factor for 3 of the 4 games including gms 3 and 4 where he didn't play at all) with Wade avg 29/8/7 52% in the two series.

05 Heat would have been in the Finals were it not for Wade getting injured
Game 6 of that series showed who was the MVP of the team, no Wad= 24 point blowout.
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Old 08-21-2013, 10:29 AM   #18
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

Quote:
Originally Posted by Akhenaten
Wade played them in 05 too and in 3 games prior to injuring his back was avg 34/7/5 52% vs them and had the Heat up 3-2.

He did have a horrific Gm 1 though, but after that game he had them figured out and was DESTROYING them, but as is the story of Wade's career he couldn't stay healthy.

The 05 Heat team was a MONSTER, they swept the 05 Nets and Wizards with a healthy prime Arenas/Jamison/Butler like nothing (with SHAQ a complete non-factor for 3 of the 4 games including gms 3 and 4 where he didn't play at all) with Wade avg 29/8/7 52% in the two series.

05 Heat would have been in the Finals were it not for Wade getting injured
Game 6 of that series showed who was the MVP of the team, no Wad= 24 point blowout.

Pretty much this. I don't know if they beat the Spurs, but if Wade doesn't go down no question they make the Finals. He put that team on his back (and it was very much his team, took control from Shaq in the playoffs).
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Old 08-21-2013, 10:35 AM   #19
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

Pau Gasol was a serious contender for the Finals MVP award only if we completely ignore how it was awarded since its inception.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=6431

Quote:
"It looks like the second banana generally needs to outscore the Alpha Dog as a prerequisite to vie for Finals MVP honors. They also must shoot with more efficiency to have a chance".

As usual this "criticism" leveled at Kobe is one that has no historical basis and seemingly is not applied to any other players in NBA history.

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Old 08-21-2013, 10:53 AM   #20
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

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Originally Posted by guy
3 - Kobe's resume and stats would look like Jordan's if he never played with Shaq.
IMO if you put prime Kobe in the east back when it was dreadful, he wouldn't have the rings but he'd probably get 35-40 with a couple 50's


I am not a LBJ hater. He's going to end up being in the top 3 with Jordan and magic. But his 07 finals is incredibly overrated. He played a 41-41 team in the first rd and a 41-41 team in the second rd

Meanwhile in the west the lakers open with Durant and the 50 win thunder not in rd two. Not in the conference finals, but in the first rd

That's why I think this Kobe Lebron stuff is silly. I mean lb is 7 years younger than Kobe. It's a stupi comlarison
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Old 08-21-2013, 10:56 AM   #21
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

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Originally Posted by guy
3 - Kobe's resume and stats would look like Jordan's if he never played with Shaq.

My point proven.
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:08 AM   #22
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

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My point proven.


Good to know you're stalking me
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:09 AM   #23
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lakers2877
IMO if you put prime Kobe in the east back when it was dreadful, he wouldn't have the rings but he'd probably get 35-40 with a couple 50's

Huh? When you say 35-40 with a couple of 50s, are you talking about ppg seasons?
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:33 AM   #24
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

Quote:
Originally Posted by Papaya Petee
Except the fact that Wade did destroy those SAME Piston teams.

Prior to his injury thru the first 5 games of that series, he was averaging 28\6\5 and he averaged 28\6\6 on INSANE FG% vs them the very next year.
I agree with you 100%. If it wasn't because of his back the team (mostly Shaq to be honest) would've beat the Pistons in 05 (same core as in 04). But they didn't win because of the back injury. Wade and Shaq ALMOST won and were closer than people expect.

@Real Men wear green: What Lebron beat was an out of their Prime Pistons team without Ben Wallace. And you can see the roster for that year if you want facts. I believe Billups was traded for Iverson the following year due the GM realizing that team was done.

Last edited by Bandito : 08-21-2013 at 11:36 AM.
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:41 AM   #25
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

Quote:
Originally Posted by guy
Huh? When you say 35-40 with a couple of 50s, are you talking about ppg seasons?
Probably games.
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:07 PM   #26
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

in '05, that pistons team was exactly the same. same core, same coach, same choking defense. after wade easily dispatched the nets and the wizards in consecutive sweeps, averaging 30, 7, 7 on 50%+, many still questioned his ability to have success against detroit in the ECF. the main reason being that since the pistons embarrassed the current premier sg kobe in the year before, surely a second year wade was gonna have trouble. in game 1, wade had a terrible game and everyone was ready to write him off as non factor. but wade adjusted his game, bounced back and scored 40 points, capping it off with a last second steal and dunk. after that he never looked back and he was able to do whatever he wanted against the vaunted detroit defense. everyone knew the series belonged to miami. that is until wade pulled rib muscle(many in here thought he hurt his back). missed most of game 5, sat out game 6 and played hobbled in game 7.
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:17 PM   #27
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

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Originally Posted by Bandito
Probably games.

He already had alot of those so it couldn't be that.
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:17 PM   #28
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

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Originally Posted by guy
3 - Kobe's resume and stats would look like Jordan's if he never played with Shaq.
Kobe would win 6 rings, 6 FMVP's and 5 MVP's WITHOUT Shaq??

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Old 08-21-2013, 12:18 PM   #29
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

Quote:
Originally Posted by aj1987
Kobe would win 6 rings, 6 FMVP's and 5 MVP's WITHOUT Shaq??


That's what alot of people seem to think if Kobe didn't get to play with Shaq, or if he was in Jordan's situation.
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:38 PM   #30
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Default Re: Two myths that get perpetuated way too often

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Originally Posted by guy
That's what alot of people seem to think if Kobe didn't get to play with Shaq, or if he was in Jordan's situation.
Kobe's best series without Shaq was in 2010 against the Suns. He averaged 33.7 PPG 7.2 RPG 8.2 APG 0.8 SPG 1.2 BPG on 52/43/90.

Jordan's best series (at a similar age) was agains the Suns as well, and it was the Finals. He averaged:
41 PPG 8.5 RPG 6.3 APG 1.7 SPG 0.7 BPG on 51/40/70.

Kobe with great teammates (he had absolute trash before Gasol) won 2 rings and went to the Finals 3 times. Jordan?

MJ >>>>>>>>> KB and it's not even close. One is the GOAT and the other sits at #10.

PS. I'm ignoring the Suns' defense in '10, because Kobe was a year older than MJ.
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