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Old 05-20-2013, 03:02 PM   #211
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

Quote:
Originally Posted by tpols

Jordan had GREAT teams for the bulk of his prime starting in the early 90s to the late 90s.. and he won 6.

The stars aligned perfectly for Jordan in that era. The NBA declined greatly after 1988. The NBA expanded way too fast and competition at the top suffered, It was the perfect opportunity for a "GOAT" level player to step up and scoop up the championships in the post Magic/Bird era. The East was nearly as bad as it was in the early 00s...seriously, you could beat barely above .500 teams in the East (as Jordan did in '91) on your way to a championship.

Mike had his own stage because Magic had HIV, Bird had a broke back, and the Pistons and Sixers were just old and depleted. All the greats and legendary teams were aged out by the time Mike was ready to contend. Not his fault. But lets tell it like it is. Big reason why Jordan is widely vied as the greatest ever. He was the greatest player in his era by FAR since all the other legends who would have challenged his throne were all retired or old, nobody to be measured against him.

People remember 90s as better than they actually were, I should know, I grew up remembering 90s as the golden era...now though? I look back at the laughable perimeter talent and even worse competition at the top of the league (even the center talent declined greatly post-'95). Is it even a question that during the "second threepeat era" that Melo would be the best player in league from 96-'98 (in the absence of Jordan)?

Last edited by Ne 1 : 05-20-2013 at 03:07 PM.
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:05 PM   #212
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

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Originally Posted by Ne 1
The stars aligned perfectly for Jordan in that era. The NBA declined greatly after 1988. It was the perfect opportunity for a "GOAT" level player to step up and scoop up the championships in the post Magic/Bird era. The East was nearly as bad as it was in the early 00s...seriously, you could beat barely above .500 teams in the East (as Jordan did in '91) on your way to a championship.

People remember 90s as better than they actually were, I should know, I grew up remembering 90s as the golden era...now though? I look back at the laughable perimeter talent and even worse comptetion at the top of the league (even the center talent declined greatly post-'95). Is it even a question that during the "second threepeat era" that Melo would be the best player in league from 96-'98 (in the absence of Jordan)?


huh? Shaq says hi? or u still talking about perimeter players?
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:08 PM   #213
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

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Originally Posted by Ne 1
Is it even a question that during the "second threepeat era" that Melo would be the best player in league from 96-'98 (in the absence of Jordan)?

No it wouldn't be a question cause it be an absolute stupid question to ask, just like it would be now.
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:11 PM   #214
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

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Originally Posted by rzp
huh? Shaq says hi? or u still talking about perimeter players?

Yeah, Shaq was the best player (even though he won't be remembered as such) in the era but Melo on that Bulls team (winning championships and all while shooting <42% in the Finals...twice) would be remembered as the best in the league.
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:33 PM   #215
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

One thing you guys are forgetting in your scenario of Jordan winning 8-10 rings with Shaq is that Shaq has an ego size of a planet. There's a reason why Shaq's burned bridges every place he's played. Jordan has a massive ego as well eventually these two are going to clash just like Shaq and Kobe did. The difference is that Jordan wouldn't let it effect his on court play. But eventually I could see the team split up into Shaq guys and Jordan guys. Which brings us to another point the salary cap. Jordan's not going to take a paycut so it's either the Lakers end up paying Jordan and Shaq 20 million plus and surround them with d league players or the team is getting split up.

Anyways continue arguing that one poster's completely made up scenario is more believable than another poster's completely made up scenario
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:44 PM   #216
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:51 PM   #217
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

Please guys. I'm reading this and you guys are mentioning Melo. He's not even close to be on the same breath as them.
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:52 PM   #218
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

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Originally Posted by longtime lurker
One thing you guys are forgetting in your scenario of Jordan winning 8-10 rings with Shaq is that Shaq has an ego size of a planet. There's a reason why Shaq's burned bridges every place he's played. Jordan has a massive ego as well eventually these two are going to clash just like Shaq and Kobe did. The difference is that Jordan wouldn't let it effect his on court play. But eventually I could see the team split up into Shaq guys and Jordan guys. Which brings us to another point the salary cap. Jordan's not going to take a paycut so it's either the Lakers end up paying Jordan and Shaq 20 million plus and surround them with d league players or the team is getting split up.

Anyways continue arguing that one poster's completely made up scenario is more believable than another poster's completely made up scenario

This. Do you guys watch Shaq on TNT? He acts like a little kid constantly and he HAS to be the alpha male on the crew even though Chuck and Kenny have been there longer and are obviously better commentators. Jordan is not gonna let someone be the alpha male over him and multiply that over an 82 game season. peak/prime Shaq and 20-25 year old Jordan would obviously win rings, but just like Shaq and Kobe they would of obviously split by ring 3 or 4 (possibly earlier) and not this 10 ring crap Jordan stans/Kobe detractors are saying in this thread
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:52 PM   #219
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ne 1
Is it even a question that during the "second threepeat era" that Melo would be the best player in league from 96-'98 (in the absence of Jordan)?
So you think Melo is better than Shaq, Hakeem, Robinson, Hill, Malone, and Barkley?

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Old 05-20-2013, 04:08 PM   #220
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

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Originally Posted by Young X
So you think Melo is better than Shaq, Hakeem, Robinson, Hill, Malone, and Barkley?


Payton, stockton, wilkins, ewing, drexler, kidd are all at least debatable. Melo wouldnt be close to being the best player in that era.
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Old 05-20-2013, 04:08 PM   #221
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

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Originally Posted by Young X
So you think Melo is better than Shaq, Hakeem, Robinson, Hill, Malone, and Barkley?

Hakeem was declining after '95, he got embarrassed in the Sonics series (even though, Seattle got away with illegal defense that would be legal nowadays). So was Robinson, Barkely was never the same after leaving Phoenix and actually started declining around '94. Shaq was the best player (even though he won't be remembered as such) in the era but Melo on that Bulls team (winning championships and all while shooting <42% in the finals...twice) would be remembered as the best in the league.
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Old 05-20-2013, 05:14 PM   #222
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

Quote:
Originally Posted by Young X
So you think Melo is better than Shaq, Hakeem, Robinson, Hill, Malone, and Barkley?
Don't forget Penny and budding AI ... Melo wouldn't even be close to the best. Even with declining Barkley, Hakeem, and David Robinson. This dude spreads his hole for "Kobe's era"
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Old 05-20-2013, 05:31 PM   #223
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaWolf24
- 85' MJ was already 21 - 22 years old....

Kobe at 21 years old was also winning titles....

again this about MJ coming straight into the league as a unknown rookie playing with Prime Shaq...

MJ's numbers take a huge hit and Shaq is easily taking the majority of the shots.



your whole post makes no sense when looking at the context of what Kobe was talking about.....

- even a 18 year old Jordan was no where near Kobe's abilty ( according to MJ himeself)....and no way 18 year old MJ with Shaq win any titles...

- it would have took MJ at least 3- 4 seasons to develop his game.....heck it took MJ 5 seasons to develop a reliable midrange game. ( something he could fall back on when teams took away his slashing game)
Kobe took more shots then Shaq during 2001 season.
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Old 05-20-2013, 05:59 PM   #224
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ne 1
Hakeem was declining after '95, he got embarrassed in the Sonics series (even though, Seattle got away with illegal defense that would be legal nowadays). So was Robinson, Barkely was never the same after leaving Phoenix and actually started declining around '94. Shaq was the best player (even though he won't be remembered as such) in the era but Melo on that Bulls team (winning championships and all while shooting <42% in the finals...twice) would be remembered as the best in the league.
The 96-98 bulls isn't winning any championship with Marshmellow. Gtfo Will melody get out the first round even. Would Melo even be able to step his game up in 98 with a crack knuckle,Pippen injured for half the season and was never right that season even after he get back. Melody never even played in a creaking finals. Melody can't pass and is more of a iso player.
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Old 05-20-2013, 06:37 PM   #225
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Default Re: #apples2oranges

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Kobe took more shots then Shaq during 2001 season.

and they went 16-1 in the playoffs. Looks pretty nice.
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