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Old 05-08-2013, 12:49 PM   #16
28renyoy
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Force
To the OP,

Since OKC without Westbrook is a much better team still than anything Lebron played with in Cleveland, would you agree that by 2006, Lebron was one of the greatest of all time? His teams were far less talented than what Durant is playing with.

Don't kid yourself. Any LeBron supporting cast from 2007-2013 has been better than the one Durant is currently playing with.

Ibaka is shooting 38%
Martin is shooting 37.1%
Sefolosha is shooting 32.4%

His 2nd option is literally Reggie Jackson/Derek Fisher. And his center rotation is Kendrick Perkins/Hasheem Thabeet. This team wouldn't win 10 games in the regular season without Durant
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Old 05-08-2013, 01:16 PM   #17
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

Quote:
Originally Posted by 28renyoy
Don't kid yourself. Any LeBron supporting cast from 2007-2013 has been better than the one Durant is currently playing with.

Ibaka is shooting 38%
Martin is shooting 37.1%
Sefolosha is shooting 32.4%

His 2nd option is literally Reggie Jackson/Derek Fisher. And his center rotation is Kendrick Perkins/Hasheem Thabeet. This team wouldn't win 10 games in the regular season without Durant

Lol? Just because they're underperforming right now doesn't mean they're worse than LeBron's Cavs. SMH
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Old 05-08-2013, 01:22 PM   #18
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

Quote:
Originally Posted by 28renyoy
Don't kid yourself. Any LeBron supporting cast from 2007-2013 has been better than the one Durant is currently playing with.

Ibaka is shooting 38%
Martin is shooting 37.1%
Sefolosha is shooting 32.4%

His 2nd option is literally Reggie Jackson/Derek Fisher. And his center rotation is Kendrick Perkins/Hasheem Thabeet. This team wouldn't win 10 games in the regular season without Durant
I don't get this logic... you're gonna argue that Martin, Ibaka, Perk and Sefalosha are worse than say ... Delonte West, Mo Williams and Jamison ? just because the former are under performing ? (the latter under performed in the playoffs as well)


There is no way with a straight face you can say Durant's supporting cast is worse.

LeBron has been surrounded with nobodies and players past their primes his whole career.
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Old 05-08-2013, 01:38 PM   #19
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chosen_wun
I don't get this logic... you're gonna argue that Martin, Ibaka, Perk and Sefalosha are worse than say ... Delonte West, Mo Williams and Jamison ? just because the former are under performing ? (the latter under performed in the playoffs as well)


There is no way with a straight face you can say Durant's supporting cast is worse.

LeBron has been surrounded with nobodies and players past their primes his whole career.
There's a very good argument to be made that Durant's supporting cast is just as "meh" as LeBron's was in Cleveland. This isn't a team mean to support just one star. They were built around two. Take one off and it really shows.

Not to mention they're still only 8 games into the whole playing without Westbrook experiment and have had almost zero practice time to figure some things out. It's basically been learning on the fly for two weeks while working out what kinks they can in games.
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Old 05-08-2013, 02:12 PM   #20
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

Quote:
Originally Posted by KG215
There's a very good argument to be made that Durant's supporting cast is just as "meh" as LeBron's was in Cleveland. This isn't a team mean to support just one star. They were built around two. Take one off and it really shows.

Not to mention they're still only 8 games into the whole playing without Westbrook experiment and have had almost zero practice time to figure some things out. It's basically been learning on the fly for two weeks while working out what kinks they can in games.
By that I assume you mean there is no legit scoring threats after Durant (Westbrook out) ?

IMHO Martin is a more viable second option than a Mo, Jamison, old Shaq, Big Z, Hughes etc., especially if you already have the best scorer and second best player overall. In the grand scheme of things I agree this current team should not have high expectations placed upon them but compared to LeBron's Cav's I think he'd take this group over the one he had 09-10 any day.
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Old 05-08-2013, 02:19 PM   #21
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chosen_wun
By that I assume you mean there is no legit scoring threats after Durant (Westbrook out) ?

IMHO Martin is a more viable second option, especially if you already have the best scorer and second best player overall. In the grand scheme of things I agree this current team should not have high expectations placed upon them but compared to LeBron's Cav's I think he'd take this group over the one he had 09-10 any day.
I've got to stop getting into basketball related discussions with you.

Take their second options....Martin and Mo Williams. Both are really similar in that they're streaky shooters who can get hot and give you 20ish points here and there; and they both do some things marginally better than the other. Neither are good 2nd options and I'd take 2009 and 2010 Mo over current Martin, although the difference is pretty negligible because you're not winning a ring with either one as the second option.

Ibaka, purely based on potential and talent, he's probably better than anyone LeBron had on Cleveland. But his offensive game has always been heavily reliant on Westbrook's penetrating and passing. Without Russ, he's having a hard time figuring out how to play (shouldn't expect anything different since it's only been 8 games.), and has turned into a streaky spot-up shooter. Defense is still about the same, which his a plus, but offensively he's nowhere close to what he is with Westbrook.

I mean hell, OKC's second most consistent player since Westbrook went down is 38 year old Derek Fisher. And he's been the second best player in a few of those games. Look, both supporting casts are/were pretty bad. I'm just getting tired of all the LeBron d***riders like you saying "I'd take Duran'ts cast over LeBron's any day of the week" or "Durant's cast right now is easily and a lot better than LeBron's was in Cleveland."
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Old 05-08-2013, 02:58 PM   #22
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

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Originally Posted by Sarcastic
It's too early to start ranking him. He has top 10 potential though.

Disagreed.

Unless he wins a bunch of rings. Top 20, sure. He's definitely a player of this generation, but think of all of the people in the top 10. There are the ones that aren't going anywhere:

MJ, Kareem, Wilt, Russell, Magic, Bird. Then there are (arguably) Shaq, Duncan, Hakeem(?), Kobe. Gotta make room for LeBron... so somebody is getting bumped. That makes it even tighter for KD.



-Smak
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Old 05-08-2013, 03:15 PM   #23
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

It'll show what a freaking weird ass season this is. I think we should just erase this one and try to start over. I'm afraid every game which major player is going to go down next.
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Old 05-08-2013, 06:08 PM   #24
28renyoy
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ILLsmak
Disagreed.

Unless he wins a bunch of rings. Top 20, sure. He's definitely a player of this generation, but think of all of the people in the top 10. There are the ones that aren't going anywhere:

MJ, Kareem, Wilt, Russell, Magic, Bird. Then there are (arguably) Shaq, Duncan, Hakeem(?), Kobe. Gotta make room for LeBron... so somebody is getting bumped. That makes it even tighter for KD.



-Smak

He's already having around a top 15 all time peak season at age 24
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Old 05-08-2013, 06:22 PM   #25
KG215
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

Quote:
Originally Posted by 28renyoy
He's already having around a top 15 all time peak season at age 24
People will see who posted this and laugh and call it dumb; but it's not far from the truth. I'm not sure I'd say top 15, but you could probably start making a list and slot 2013 Durant in the 16-25 range somewhere in terms of best peak season. His playoff run is only making his case stronger.

Still, on top 25ish all-time peak season doesn't equate to being top 20 or top 30 all-time.

Last edited by KG215 : 05-08-2013 at 06:24 PM.
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Old 05-08-2013, 06:31 PM   #26
tmacattack33
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

Yes, if Durant can take this team to the Finals without Westbrook, he will have likely just had one of the best seasons in history and would be cemented as having one of the best (top 20) peaks of all time.
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Old 05-08-2013, 06:50 PM   #27
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

The more interesting question is...

If KD continues to average 33, 10, and 5 on 51% shooting, and somehow takes his team to the Finals (where he loses undoubtedly), will his individual post-season be considered better than Lebron's post season last year?

Considering he'd be taking a supporting cast pretty inferior to last year's Heat to the Finals, and his competition to do so would be much more difficult than last year's Heat...(2013 Rockets = 2012 Knicks, 2013 Grizzlies > 2012 Pacers, 2013 Spurs [assuming] > 2012 Celtics).

Not saying it would be better, but think it's a hypothetical worth discussing...more so than where a 24 year old player will rank All Time in his young, young career.
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:28 PM   #28
paytonfan
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Default Re: If Durant takes his team to the finals or even the WCF, it will show...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solefade
Lol? Just because they're underperforming right now doesn't mean they're worse than LeBron's Cavs. SMH

07 Cavs Finals v Current Thunder (for argument sakes)

C Ilgauskas, Varejao >>>> Perkins, Thabeet
PF Gooden, Marshall < Ibaka, Collison
SF James > Durant
SG Hughes, Pavlovic = Sefalosha, Martin
PG Snow, Jones = Jackson, Fisher

I actually think Cavs had the better team and were used to playing together ALL YEAR whereas the Thunder had there NO.2 pulled out from underneath them to start the playoffs.

I think if Thunder make the Finals against a much harder conference that the Cavs did in 07 Durant needs major props (unfortunately think the Grizzlies will knock em out though).
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