Originally Posted by 2010splash
How so? It's the truth. Duncan won one title with an average supporting cast in 2003, but it was still much better than the trash LeBron played with in Cleveland. Doesn't mean LeBron can't win it all with a mediocre supporting cast. He's only had two options in his career - try with a trash supporting cast (Cavs) and try with an elite supporting cast (Heat). What Duncan did in 2003 is impressive but does not make him better than LeBron. In none of his playoff runs was he as dominant as 2009 LeBron or 2012 LeBron. Besides 2003, Duncan has had straight loaded teams and a much better coach than anyone LeBron's had.
LeBron basically passes Duncan after this year with another ring. Then it basically becomes LeBron's 4 MVP's and 2 titles (back to back, which Duncan never did) versus Duncan's two more rings and worse stats/far inferior offensive impact.
Duncan never came close to shooting 56.5 FG% despite being a 7 footer and living in the paint. Nor was he particularly efficient during his title runs (a pedestrian 54.1 TS% in 1999 and .540 TS% in 2005). Sure he was a great player, but offensively not even close to LeBron. He's somewhere around 7-9 all-time around where Olajuwon and Kobe are. LeBron is basically on his way to #2 all-time with no argument.
Actually, Lebron's teams in 09 and 10 were as good or better than Duncan's in 03.
And...actually, Lebron choked his ass off in 11.
You can't have it both ways. You can't use things like titles and successes to rank players and then conveniently sweep the fact that Lebron lost the 11 finals, in the heart of his prime, with Bosh and Wade and a solid team around him against one of the weakest (in terms of talent) title teams in NBA history.
So no, it's not the "truth"...there is no evidence at all to suggest Duncan wouldn't have easily won in 2011 with the kind of help Lebron had. Hell, look what Duncan is doing now at his age.
Lebron has a long long long way to go to match a guy like Duncan and his longevity and success.
Duncan has now led his team to what...14 straight 50 win seasons. Never been done before. 4 titles without an all nba teammate...never been done before.
So please don't come on here and pretend like Lebron is clearly better than Duncan or Kobe if he wins a title this year. Especially given how stacked his team is and the fact that his main competition lost their 2nd best player.
Do you Lebron stans just expect everyone to ignore the 11 finals? The 10 collapse against the Celtics? Those are black marks that aren't just going away with 1 title on a historically stacked team...sorry.
Lebron needs to win 3 titles before I move him ahead of Duncan. And this isn't a case of ring count. It's about the opportunities Lebron has had. This will be his 3rd year in a row with the best team...and that is likely to continue for at least 2 more years. So I need to see 3 titles in 5 years in order to put him even with ahead of Duncan.
And I'll tell you this. If the Spurs beat the Heat in the finals this year...Lebron will never catch Duncan. So again. calm yourself down and let it play out.