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Old 11-07-2012, 02:00 PM   #31
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

Quote:
Originally Posted by niko
The difference is you and PTiddy are discussing a minority opinion and i'm discussing what the majority of the media said at the time.
At the time? How could you possibly know how the media reaction was at the time. And it's funny seeing how Jimmy Johnson wants to take all the credit for those SB, how did you do after the Cowboys gig, it works both way.
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:04 PM   #32
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

Quote:
Originally Posted by niko
It was always viewed that way. It was the only thing i ever heard about it. Not trolling, but being told Jimmy didn't have much power at all in terms of players doesn't make sense. After he left, it was blamed on the Cowboys falling off somewaht after the final non Jimmy run.

Not trolling but that's always what the story was.
no it wasn't

are you aware that he won another ring with Barry Switzer 2 years after Jimmy left?

the blame on the downfall was "players partying", "team getting old", etc...not "Jerry is drafting now instead of Jimmy"
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:08 PM   #33
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

both Jerry and Jimmy claim they "built" the team...the truth (which no one really knows) is probably somewhere in the middle

also, players like Irvin and Norton where on the team BEFORE Jerry or Jimmy even got there...




I pretty sure Aikman was all Jerry though...because we Jimmy drafted Steve Walsh at the same time who was from Miami (where Jimmy coached) and Walsh and Aikman actually had to battle it out for the starting role...
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:09 PM   #34
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

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Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
no it wasn't

are you aware that he won another ring with Barry Switzer 2 years after Jimmy left?

the blame on the downfall was "players partying", "team getting old", etc...not "Jerry is drafting now instead of Jimmy"

No, they said Jimmy was responsibly for drafting. He was always given credit. The Cowboys were the big story. The ring they won 2 years later was with the same coach. How much credit did they give JJ for Barry winning?

Sometimes i think the Cowboy fans on this board either didn't watch games way back when, or think none of the rest of us do. Jerry's revisionist history after Jimmy left that he made all the picks is just that, revisionist history.

Knowing what you do of Jimmy Johnson, and how the years after the falloff in the cowboys from winning what felt like every year to not at all, you think Jimmy wasn't choosing the players?

You're full of it. You defend on reflex. I guess we agree, we both hope Jerry stays on as GM.
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:12 PM   #35
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigkingsfan
At the time? How could you possibly know how the media reaction was at the time. And it's funny seeing how Jimmy Johnson wants to take all the credit for those SB, how did you do after the Cowboys gig, it works both way.
at the time I don't think the media talked much about WHO was doing the actual drafting between those two, it was to be assumed it was both.

No one really talked about it until AFTER Jimmy was fired...then that is when questions started popping up



me, I am old enough to remember it all, and I had just assumed that Jimmy was sick of never being able to draft the players he wanted...he was fed up with it, and that is when disputes started.
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:16 PM   #36
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

Quote:
Originally Posted by niko
No, they said Jimmy was responsibly for drafting. He was always given credit. The Cowboys were the big story. The ring they won 2 years later was with the same coach. How much credit did they give JJ for Barry winning?

Sometimes i think the Cowboy fans on this board either didn't watch games way back when, or think none of the rest of us do. Jerry's revisionist history after Jimmy left that he made all the picks is just that, revisionist history.

Knowing what you do of Jimmy Johnson, and how the years after the falloff in the cowboys from winning what felt like every year to not at all, you think Jimmy wasn't choosing the players?

You're full of it. You defend on reflex. I guess we agree, we both hope Jerry stays on as GM.
FIRST OF ALL...Jerry gets the credit regardless of who made the picks

HE PICKED JIMMY!

If Jerry gets the blame for Garrett (and other bad coaches) then he gets the cred for Jimmy or anyone else that did "good"

second, wtf does "watching the games" have to do with this issue?...I watched them all, is that supposed to clue me in on who picked the players? lol



I am just saying I what I remember...Jerry gets cred either way, that doesn't change in this debate
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:19 PM   #37
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

Cowboy hater way of thinking:

coach does bad = Jerry's fault for hiring that coach
coach does good = GOOD JOB COACH!!!, YOU DID IT!!!, who is Jerry?

ALSO

player drafted is a bust = Jerry pick obviously, stupid pick
player turns out to be stud = must have been drafted by Jimmy or Parcells or someone else other than Jerry
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:26 PM   #38
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM





^^^ this is what we would see on draft days...the two of them together in the draft room, talking to each other as though they are figuring out who to draft together...

it's not like the media would say "Jimmy is making these picks not Jerry" during the draft lol
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:56 PM   #39
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
Cowboy hater way of thinking:

coach does bad = Jerry's fault for hiring that coach
coach does good = GOOD JOB COACH!!!, YOU DID IT!!!, who is Jerry?

ALSO

player drafted is a bust = Jerry pick obviously, stupid pick
player turns out to be stud = must have been drafted by Jimmy or Parcells or someone else other than Jerry

Not at all. Jerry's clearly did a lot of good at GM, i've said many times i think Dallas has a lot of talent. (Note: you tend to argue the opposite. But i guess right now that's not something you are going to say.) They also have a lot of holes, tend to be too quick to trade draft picks (Roy Williams anyone?) and the choice of coaches has been, what's a good word? Horrible?

The NFL is built on accountability and the owner being the GM removes that accountability from the two most important layers of your organization, because if the owner likes the coach, then the GM and the coach are fixtures forever.

It also blocks you from hiring and good GM/Coach candidates like Gruden, etc. because they won't take the job.

Last edited by niko : 11-07-2012 at 02:59 PM.
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:22 PM   #40
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

Quote:
Originally Posted by niko
Not at all. Jerry's clearly did a lot of good at GM, i've said many times i think Dallas has a lot of talent. (Note: you tend to argue the opposite. But i guess right now that's not something you are going to say.) They also have a lot of holes, tend to be too quick to trade draft picks (Roy Williams anyone?) and the choice of coaches has been, what's a good word? Horrible?

The NFL is built on accountability and the owner being the GM removes that accountability from the two most important layers of your organization, because if the owner likes the coach, then the GM and the coach are fixtures forever.

It also blocks you from hiring and good GM/Coach candidates like Gruden, etc. because they won't take the job.
what? Gruden would LOVE to coach in Dallas and has made that clear

really I don't think there is a single available coach out there that Jerry couldn't get if he wanted...
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Old 11-07-2012, 05:29 PM   #41
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
what? Gruden would LOVE to coach in Dallas and has made that clear

really I don't think there is a single available coach out there that Jerry couldn't get if he wanted...

Gruden is not going anywhere he can't make personel decisions. Jerry would have to give it to him. Gruden is a total control freak. He left the Raiders because he disagreed on how they ran things. Do you watch football?

A tweet from just now.

Chris Mortensen ‏@mortreport

As I recollect dynamics of Jerry Jones/Jimmy Johnson, it was clear @JimmyJohnson built team. Jerry was building business. #NFL32 ESPN2

He must be confused too...
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Old 11-07-2012, 06:05 PM   #42
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

strange Jimmy was just on ESPN just now saying that he built the team and that Jerry takes credit for it...

Barry Switzer was also on and claimed not to know...

Chris Mortensen doesn't know shit lol...

I'm sure Jimmy had his input...but no one knows how much except him and Jerry, and like I said many of the pieces (like Irvin) were there before Jimmy was a coach.
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Old 11-07-2012, 06:09 PM   #43
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
FIRST OF ALL...Jerry gets the credit regardless of who made the picks

HE PICKED JIMMY!



All I'm saying is he ruined a good thing.

It would almost be like Mark Cuban getting rid of Rick Carlisle after he won the Finals... but it's way worse.

He got rid of the head coach after he won back to back super bowls?
How the f*ck does that happen???


GREATEST COWBOYS COMMERCIAL EVER!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrmsLmujfUE
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Old 11-07-2012, 06:10 PM   #44
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

and Gruden has hinted 100 times that he would coach in Dallas...honestly I don't even want him, he got burnt out and was fired...another has been

here you go:

Archer: Jon Gruden would coach the Cowboys in a second

Jerry got Parcells here of all people, finding a coach isn't an issue for Jerry, never has been, it's the Dallas Cowboys
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Old 11-07-2012, 06:12 PM   #45
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Default Re: Jerry Jones promises he will always be GM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riddler
All I'm saying is he ruined a good thing.

It would almost be like Mark Cuban getting rid of Rick Carlisle after he won the Finals... but it's way worse.

He got rid of the head coach after he won back to back super bowls?
How the f*ck does that happen???


GREATEST COWBOYS COMMERCIAL EVER!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrmsLmujfUE
HA...Apex shoes?...that failed

forgot about that commercial
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