Yes. I don't know what you're getting at here. Putting on a Laker uniform doesn't guarantee titles.
I agree a jersey doesn't guarantee titles. but a great franchise like the Lakers in a big market will always build great teams centering around a certain player with the franchise "Tag". Its a formula that's worked well with them for decades. No NBA drafts needed if you can buy yourself a great team. The "luck" factor comes in on how many chances a franchise player can succeed in an organization like that.
This response isn't to belittle someone like Kobe, he going to the Hall of Fame because he served the Lakers extremely well. Anyways, about Vince Carter, StateofMind12 said it best, he plays hard, but wasn't always motivated nor did Vince keep his skills up. Had he'd done that he would still be in New Jersey or even Toronto if the Raptors weren't so shitty.
Kobe is 100 proof. Stop lying to yourself calling it luck. You MAKE your own luck. Kobe had all te pressure on him to win titles after Shaq left and went back to back no less with a team built around him. /Thread
Even ith Kobe's work ethic, he's still not better than Kobe. I'd say a top 30 though
Better three point shooter, attacked the hoop at will, more athletic, a bit below him defensively but able to block shots. Add Kobe's work ethic, there's no reason to think Vince couldn't push top 10 all-time. The physical gifts were there from day 1.
Vince had a polished game from the start, at least offensively. Even with a work ethic as great as Kobe's is, does this translate in Vince playing better defense ?
He'd certainly would be better and I'm pretty sure he wouldn't be taking nights off the court. Probably would have more individual accolades and awards. As for team accomplishments and how he performs in the playoffs... like any good/great wing player, he would have a solid low post big man to help take some pressure of him. I thought what his teams lacked on the Toronto and New Jersey teams in his prime was no solid post presence.
So, I definitely think he would be much higher ranked, especially if he won multiple titles in a city like Toronto, which didn't have titles to begin. There's always something special about bringing the first set of title(s) to a franchise that didn't have NBA Title history or playoff success to begin with.
He had a naturally slow lateral movement that couldn't be corrected with any sort of work ethic which is a glaring flaw to have in your defensive game. Yes he was more offensively talented than Kobe but not defensively. Still as far as natural talent goes, I would put him in Top 5 for SG/SF's.
Work-ethic won't give him Kobe's ball-handling and play-making ability.
Or his lateral quickness.
Or his body control.
Or his focus.
Man it's crazy how much people overrate the " natural talent" of guys like Carter/T-Mac.
Agreed. It's like people got suckered into thinking jumping ability is of upmost importance in basketball after watching Jordan, but Jordan wasn't just good because he jumped high. He was good for the very same reasons Kobe is so good, he was all-around talented at everything. Lateral quickness is more important than jumping ability, but people seem to not give much of a ****.
T-Mac, however, was a huge talent. He just was injury prone, had a weak work-ethic (hence the injuries) and some bad luck. Vince was also very talented, but I wouldn't put him on the same level. His handle never compared to other shooting guards and, as was mentioned, his lateral quickness sucks.
And whoever said Vince would have been the greatest dunker of all time...how is he not the greatest already? The guys 100th best dunk would be anyone's 1st...cmon now, the man had video game type dunks...not NBA2k or live, like NBASTREET shit...cmon now.