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Old 01-07-2012, 09:30 PM   #16
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

We run the Read & React. Easy to modify, put the layers in you want, play to your team's strengths, etc. I also feel it teaches the kids to really be basketball players. They learn the right habits through this offense. Just my 2 .
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Old 01-07-2012, 10:32 PM   #17
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by StateProperty
Yeah, that's what I was doing but with pushups instead. It worked during the drill but by the time they got to the game they always lost that motivation. I'd threaten them with "if we give up 1 more rebound on defense you're doing blah blah blah next practice...GOT THAT?!"....which worked. But it'd start all over the next game.

The team I took over hadn't won a game in 3 years (literally 0-30) and we went 4-6 that year. I was pretty proud. But damnit I wanted .500!
I run the same drill.

Oh man, the first club I took over win was winless in 7th grade (A & B teams). After I took over. . .they went winless in 8th grade too. I stuck with them though. They loved the game. I'd work with them every summer, we'd play ball at the park all day, I'd coach them throughout high school until eventually. . .their senior year. . .in the district championship game. . .in overtime. . .against a team that'd beaten them by 30 earlier in the season. . .in our own gym. . .seven seconds left. . .down by one. . .magic:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7wp6HrGqoU

News Footage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaMiP...eature=related

Proudest moment of my life. Just like teaching, it's moments like this that make it all worth it.
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Old 01-07-2012, 10:40 PM   #18
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rake2204
I run the same drill.

Oh man, the first club I took over win was winless in 7th grade (A & B teams). After I took over. . .they went winless in 8th grade too. I stuck with them though. They loved the game. I'd work with them every summer, we'd play ball at the park all day, I'd coach them throughout high school until eventually. . .their senior year. . .in the district championship game. . .in overtime. . .against a team that'd beaten them by 30 earlier in the season. . .in our own gym. . .seven seconds left. . .down by one. . .magic:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7wp6HrGqoU

News Footage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaMiP...eature=related

Proudest moment of my life. Just like teaching, it's moments like this that make it all worth it.

Seeing players you've helped in any capacity improve and have success is the absolute most rewarding thing I've ever done, e.g. beating a team that has been a rival and besting them for most of their careers, especially in the most important games; winning a championship; just playing so damn well, etc. I always feel so happy for the players. On the other side of things, the worst is when they work so damn hard and fall just short of winning the Provincial Championship (our equivalent of your State tourney). They put so much time in, and then it's over. It makes you realize how every little thing has to lineup for you to be the last team standing at the end of the season. It also makes you realize sports are a cruel b*tch at times.

Kudos to you and your players on the District Championship and that amazing moment.

Last edited by skan72 : 01-07-2012 at 10:43 PM.
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Old 01-07-2012, 10:52 PM   #19
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by skan72
Seeing players you've helped in any capacity improve and have success is the absolute most rewarding thing I've ever done, e.g. beating a team that has been a rival and besting them for most of their careers, especially in the most important games; winning a championship; just playing so damn well, etc. I always feel so happy for the players. On the other side of things, the worst is when they work so damn hard and fall just short of winning the Provincial Championship (our equivalent of your State tourney). They put so much time in, and then it's over. It makes you realize how every little thing has to lineup for you to be the last team standing at the end of the season. It also makes you realize sports are a cruel b*tch at times.

Kudos to you and your players on the District Championship and that amazing moment.
Well stated. I've had a hard time finding a group I connected with like I did that first one. But it's always great to see that growth and development; to know I was able to play a part in the progression of their growth.

Meanwhile, could you elaborate on your read & react offense?
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Old 01-07-2012, 11:23 PM   #20
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rake2204
That's interesting. It's been the complete opposite in the region I coach (western Michigan). We'll see a zone a couple times a year, but more times than not, it's a man-to-man situation. I'm actually a big disbeliever in running zones exclusively in middle school. I find my player's skill levels to be too limited (due to age as well as ability) and I see little redeeming quality in terms of developing defensive fundamentals. My "B" team coach tried utilize a 2-3 zone but his players would literally stand still like telephone poles so I stomped that out real quick, even though it was mildly effective (therein lies the issue).

Of course, skill levels change quickly and you may be discussing AAU or another sort of select league. Zones in middle school are much more common here (and much more breakable) in those leagues. But for school teams, where most squads are just looking for 5 guys who can make layups on a semi-consistent basis, it's not something we run into a lot. Though, I loved facing a packed 2-3 zone when I was coaching a 7th grade girls "B" team. Nothing like trying to beat a team from the outside with girls not strong enough to hit seven footers.


I completely agree. I really dislike the sitting in a sagging zone. It's just not helping anyone long term. But I do see a ton of it. I coach a parish middle school team. There's a ton of leagues around here, and we'll play 3-4 games a weekend by playing in a couple of leagues. But the leagues aren't strictly parish. There's a lot of travelling all star type teams who need funding that aren't related to a church. I find that a lot of the parish teams play a lot of zone, and particularly soft zones. The all star teams that are more "ahem" urban, tend to play much more aggressive, and even if it is a zone, it's a trapping zone of some kind.
I run a lot of defenses. I base out of a man to man, and teach a ton of man to man principals. Ball line mid line man technique is gone over in a shell in every practice. But I do run three variations of a 3-2, one that's somewhat soft, in that it doesn't trap, but it does rotate. I also run one that's kind of a gimmick, I call it an amoeba, but it's really a box and one where the one keeps switching. If the ball is entered into your zone, you step out and pick it up man, and the guy who had the ball falls in, and we rotate to fill in the box.
All of the defenses I run I teach as a reaction to an opponents approach. For example I run a 1-2-1-1 press that traps up front like any typical. But then we run a variation where their is no trap, and the point man dives up the gut, cutting off that weak spot in the middle, and the weak wing cuts over to the inbounder. The idea is to get the kids to recognize that there's a weak spot in our press, but we can counter that counter but recognizing it and make teams uncomfortable like they're being pressed but not actually be trapping.

I try to teach a little read and react principal offensively too. My zone offense for example is not a set in stone series of cuts and passes. But a way to set up ideas about where to attack. Then we may run forced sets out of it, but I want the kids to go through progressions from the spots they're in. One of the things I really try to teach them is to recognize who's guarding them in the zone. If it's a high defender, take him low, a low defender, take him high. It's about stretching the zones to create bigger holes. And it's not just the guy with the ball I want making those reads. The cutters too need to recognize what the ball is doing so they know where the holes are being made for them to flash too.

Watching the kids develop is incredibly rewarding. A few years ago I got a request for a college recommendation letter from a kid who I stayed pretty close with, which was just a bizarre but rewarding feeling. And a kid from my first team got drafted by the Seattle Mariners in this past MLB draft.
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Old 01-08-2012, 02:50 AM   #21
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rake2204
Well stated. I've had a hard time finding a group I connected with like I did that first one. But it's always great to see that growth and development; to know I was able to play a part in the progression of their growth.

Meanwhile, could you elaborate on your read & react offense?

Thanks.

I'll try:

So the Read & React (R&R) is based on ingraining habits in the players so they become instinctive things. The idea is that the R&R is not an offense, but it is offense, putting all principles of offense together into a living, evolving thing. The best thing is that you can modify it to whatever your strengths are. I think Iowa or Iowa State women's team runs it.

You can set up 5-out, 4-out-1-in, 3-out-2-in, whatever you like really. The first layer is Pass and Cut. Every single time you make a pass to a player in a position one pass away, you must cut to the hoop and the players who are now left 2 or more passes away from the ball need to fill over to the ball. Also for Layer 1, if a player is one pass away from the ball and his/her check is above the read line (the 3 point line is the read line, we have all players set up at NBA range to really space out the floor) then he/she must cut back door. All players fill over to the ball based on same principles I explained for filling after a player passes and cuts. Layer 2 is when you pass to the post you must laker cut high or low around him/her. Posts must post up above the block in low/mid/high post. Layer 3 is Dribble-at, where if a player is dribbled at he/she must go back door. Layer 4 is Dribble Penetration. If the ballhandler goes around his/her check to the right/left then every other player must rotate, low with speed and hands up ready to catch, one spot right/left. There are many other layers involving ball screen reactions, back screens, post reactions to dribble penetration, etc. I've coached quite a few teams that have just been successful using this offense with only the first 4 or so layers. It's really incredible.

However, like any offense, if you don't buy into it, don't teach it because the players will be able to tell you don't genuinely believe in it. I do believe in it, which is a small part of the reason it works. If, after reading my garbled explanation, your interest was actually piqued, I'd suggest reading this link from coachesclipboard:

http://www.coachesclipboard.net/Read...enseNotes.html

Then, if you're somehow still interested, read this link, which has really helped me change how I've been coaching the R&R Offense:

http://basketballogy.com/2011/the-rg...e-part-1-of-5/
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Old 01-08-2012, 12:59 PM   #22
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

In the under 22 team that i play when i don't have games for my team, we run 3 different offenses .. i will try to explain.

HORNS:

- The post players come outside the 3 point line, and i choose which side i will take advantage.
- If there's advantage for me in the pick and roll, i go to the basket or pass to the roller.
- If there isn't we got 2 options
a) - Do the triangle between me, the other post guy and the roller to get an open basket.
b) The other guy on the side that i choose (2 or 3 player) have a stagger cut for the opposite side to shoot (the roller and the other guard do that) and most of the times we got a shooter on the other side by himself.

FLEX (UCLA cut)

- You all know that system, it's obvious.


TRANSITION OFFENSE

1 PG, 2 guys as guards/forwards, 2 guys in the low block near the basket.

- I start the offense passing the ball to one of the guards.
- Then i give a block to the post player on the other side to cut and receive the ball at the PG spot.
- The guard who had the ball pass to that Center that now is in the PG position.
- I (PG) in the low block, receive a block from the other guard in the same side to go to his spot (i become a guard/forward) and the guy who blocked me it's now a (center, who was a guard/forward).
- The big guy who as the ball in the PG spot pass me the ball and we run a pick and roll.


Was it clear for you guys?
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Old 01-08-2012, 05:06 PM   #23
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by skan72
Thanks.

I'll try:

So the Read & React (R&R) is based on ingraining habits in the players so they become instinctive things. The idea is that the R&R is not an offense, but it is offense, putting all principles of offense together into a living, evolving thing. The best thing is that you can modify it to whatever your strengths are. I think Iowa or Iowa State women's team runs it.

You can set up 5-out, 4-out-1-in, 3-out-2-in, whatever you like really. The first layer is Pass and Cut. Every single time you make a pass to a player in a position one pass away, you must cut to the hoop and the players who are now left 2 or more passes away from the ball need to fill over to the ball. Also for Layer 1, if a player is one pass away from the ball and his/her check is above the read line (the 3 point line is the read line, we have all players set up at NBA range to really space out the floor) then he/she must cut back door. All players fill over to the ball based on same principles I explained for filling after a player passes and cuts. Layer 2 is when you pass to the post you must laker cut high or low around him/her. Posts must post up above the block in low/mid/high post. Layer 3 is Dribble-at, where if a player is dribbled at he/she must go back door. Layer 4 is Dribble Penetration. If the ballhandler goes around his/her check to the right/left then every other player must rotate, low with speed and hands up ready to catch, one spot right/left. There are many other layers involving ball screen reactions, back screens, post reactions to dribble penetration, etc. I've coached quite a few teams that have just been successful using this offense with only the first 4 or so layers. It's really incredible.

However, like any offense, if you don't buy into it, don't teach it because the players will be able to tell you don't genuinely believe in it. I do believe in it, which is a small part of the reason it works. If, after reading my garbled explanation, your interest was actually piqued, I'd suggest reading this link from coachesclipboard:

http://www.coachesclipboard.net/Read...enseNotes.html

Then, if you're somehow still interested, read this link, which has really helped me change how I've been coaching the R&R Offense:

http://basketballogy.com/2011/the-rg...e-part-1-of-5/

does this offense work well against zone defenses?
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Old 01-08-2012, 05:15 PM   #24
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by amin89
does this offense work well against zone defenses?

I think so! There is actually a layer that addresses the different ways to modify your R&R Offense against zones. You still follow all the same principles, just slight modifications to each. Like cutting through gaps instead of to the basket after every pass, and cutting through and stopping at the short corner sometimes instead of filling all the way out to outside the 3, or having 2 post players in, etc. Also, the Pin & Skip, a layer of the R&R - although a layer that doesn't really follow with the building habits theme as it seems like more of a very simple, but effective, set - is great when facing a zone. Essentially, skip the ball, then have one of the weakside guards/posts screen down on the zone, and a shooter rotates up to get a skip pass back for an open shot, if zone closes out, you have guard/post who just screened posting up 1-on-1 or sometimes 1-on-0 if communication was sloppy.
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Old 01-10-2012, 01:50 AM   #25
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Any coaches want to share their tips on how they run subs efficiently and smartly, i.e. there is always a ballhandler on the floor, defender, scorer, etc.? I don't usually do the subbing for my team, get my asst's to do so, but I've had to do it a few times and... I'm not very good at it. I know it sounds silly, but subbing seems to me to be an art form. A good sub(s) can really help, a bad sub(s) can do the opposite and cost you a game... which is what I feel cost my team the game tonight, my poor coaching decisions.
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Old 01-10-2012, 07:31 AM   #26
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by skan72
Any coaches want to share their tips on how they run subs efficiently and smartly, i.e. there is always a ballhandler on the floor, defender, scorer, etc.? I don't usually do the subbing for my team, get my asst's to do so, but I've had to do it a few times and... I'm not very good at it. I know it sounds silly, but subbing seems to me to be an art form. A good sub(s) can really help, a bad sub(s) can do the opposite and cost you a game... which is what I feel cost my team the game tonight, my poor coaching decisions.

I state outright at the start of the season that we're in a competitive league, and we're going to play competitively, and there will be games in which kids won't play at all, or more usually play very limitedly. I also coach first level pop warner, and that's different at that age. I get everyone in for at least a quarter in that. But at the level I coach basketball, middle school, things really begin to seperate.
But one of the things I do do to ensure I'm getting everyone some time, is some of my worst players I'll create a specific defensive scheme around. I may run a full denial of the other teams best player. Or I may run a hectic trap where he ignores his guy completely and just chases the ball full time. Or a specific trap where if a certain guy gets it he immediately doubles him. Or if the ball goes to a specific corner he comes to double.
We're only playing 6 minute quarters, so it's hard to get anyone substantial time. But I can run that stuff for three minutes and get anyone in in a role they feel like they're contributing in. Those gimmicks need to be taught in practice though, so the whole team is aware of what we're trying to accomplish, and they're prepared to cover for the weak link when he leaves to double. Otherwise you may end up with a lot of unwanted finger pointing.
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Old 01-15-2012, 01:43 AM   #27
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

What are some competitive drills you guys like running and the players seem to respond well to? It's, to me, very important to have competitive drills throughout every practice, especially ones where the players work their bags off, but they appear to appreciate them more because they worked their bags off and felt they improved.
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Old 01-15-2012, 10:41 AM   #28
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by skan72
What are some competitive drills you guys like running and the players seem to respond well to? It's, to me, very important to have competitive drills throughout every practice, especially ones where the players work their bags off, but they appear to appreciate them more because they worked their bags off and felt they improved.
Historically, our players have always responded well to 11-man, which is essentially a continuous 3 on 2 fast break drill. The setup can be seen here: http://www.coachesclipboard.net/11ManDrill.html

To add some extra grime to the drill, we often would not limit it to one shot per possession. This tends to create some solid fights inside as well as allowing my players to learn how to finish in traffic. The downfall of this drill is it sometimes allows players to run at their own pace.

To fix the pace issue, I also sometimes run a 3-on-2 drill with a defensive trailer. It sets up similar to the 11-man I mentioned. However, instead of four lines, there are only two (on each side of half court). It works like this:

1. Players will be split into two teams. One team will form the line on one side of half court and the other team on the opposite side. Each team will also have two defenders guarding a basket.

2. Three Offensive players begin a fast break toward the two waiting defenders (beginning about 60 feet away from the rim). Once the ball crosses half court, the defending team's line (at half court) will send a player to sprint to the half court circle then become a trailing defender (the sprint to the half-court circle is to not allow the defender to recover too easily).

This creates a 3-on-2 fast break with a third defender recovering from behind. It adds a sense of urgency to the fast break drills. Offensive teams are then pressured to convert quickly and efficiently, while the trailing defender must sprint to recover.

In this case, the play continues until a defensive rebound or turnover, then the three defenders push the other way and the 3-on-2 situation repeats itself. We usually race to 21, playing by ones. The losing team must then run full-court sprints to account for the difference in scores (if they lost 21-17, they'd run four sprints).
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Old 01-15-2012, 12:44 PM   #29
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

I run the same drill Rake just mentioned at least once during my two practices a week. It's fun, it's great conditioning, and most importantly to me it teaches basic instinct. Scoring with an advantage is an absolute must in basketball. And understanding how to do it is something that can't be explained. You have to give kids a chance to do it, and reinforce on the fly.

I also frequently run a three man weave that falls back into a 2 on 1. The guy who gets the assist on the layup has to backpeddle into a defensive spot while the other two guys come back at him. Again, it's fast and competitive and reinforces instinct.

One drill I do to start every practice is a full court layup routine called the H drill. It's a line in each of the four corners, and two guys at the midcourt circle facing out. The two runners go from under the hoop, passes to the corner, gets it back, passes to midcourt, gets it back, and passes to bottom corner, gets it back ... layup. That last passer follows him and pulls the ball out of the net and starts follows suit. Each passer simply follows his pass to the next spot. I require 25 makes in a row from each hand, that's basically two per kid. When I'm going lighthearted, we'll do all reverses, or lobs, or try fancy passes. That stuff is always fun. But to get it competitive, we sometimes talk about one guy catching the other (the kids have never really figured out that they're all on one circuit, so for some reason one ball catching another is way more exciting than it seems like it should be to me). At the level I coach (again, middle school boys), running hard, catching on the move, good clean crisp passing, and finishing layups on the move at full speed, are legit skills to be worked on.

A couple more competitive drills.
We cut into bigs and smalls usually once a week. And one of the drills we do with our bigs after we go through the fundamentals is something I call the meat grinder. It's three on three in the paint in a triangle, high post and two low posts, and it's a freelance from them to screen for each other in the triangle. Hopefull I have two coaches with them to skip passes and enter the ball.

I also do a two line two on two fundamental set. Bigs on one line, guards on the other. We go through the whole basics of the pick and roll. Pick and pop, roll, slip, guard deek. Then the high hand off sets, that are pretty similar.
Once we go through the basics. We run it competitive, with the ball going out, and the next two guys in line following them out, and we run a quick 2 on 2 off of those principals. No pulling the ball out and dancing around, just run through sets instinctively.
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Old 01-18-2012, 07:58 PM   #30
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Default Re: Basketball coaching discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rake2204
Historically, our players have always responded well to 11-man, which is essentially a continuous 3 on 2 fast break drill. The setup can be seen here: http://www.coachesclipboard.net/11ManDrill.html

To add some extra grime to the drill, we often would not limit it to one shot per possession. This tends to create some solid fights inside as well as allowing my players to learn how to finish in traffic. The downfall of this drill is it sometimes allows players to run at their own pace.

To fix the pace issue, I also sometimes run a 3-on-2 drill with a defensive trailer. It sets up similar to the 11-man I mentioned. However, instead of four lines, there are only two (on each side of half court). It works like this:

1. Players will be split into two teams. One team will form the line on one side of half court and the other team on the opposite side. Each team will also have two defenders guarding a basket.

2. Three Offensive players begin a fast break toward the two waiting defenders (beginning about 60 feet away from the rim). Once the ball crosses half court, the defending team's line (at half court) will send a player to sprint to the half court circle then become a trailing defender (the sprint to the half-court circle is to not allow the defender to recover too easily).

This creates a 3-on-2 fast break with a third defender recovering from behind. It adds a sense of urgency to the fast break drills. Offensive teams are then pressured to convert quickly and efficiently, while the trailing defender must sprint to recover.

In this case, the play continues until a defensive rebound or turnover, then the three defenders push the other way and the 3-on-2 situation repeats itself. We usually race to 21, playing by ones. The losing team must then run full-court sprints to account for the difference in scores (if they lost 21-17, they'd run four sprints).


I ran this drill for the first time today:





If we scored we pick up our full court m2m, and if we missed we used these rules for transition defense: the closest team O player jams a defensive rebounder, another gets back to protect the basket (defensive balance or long safety), the third player is short safety and tries to pick up the team X player who gets the first pass (e.g., an outlet pass), then the long safety takes the player opposite.

It was great and I'm going to run it again tomorrow.
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