Just remember when comparing Lebron to Jordan

[Steven Kerry]

Please. This is a thread for facts only.

Those were facts.

[Im Still Ballin]

Cleveland in 2011 had the worst record in the league even prior to their injury issues. Just look it up. They were in the midst of their record-setting losing streak when Varejao and 'Mo Williams went down. Completely disingenuous to pretend injuries is what led to their downfall. They had already started to suck on epic levels even with the team fully healthy. And yes, they did lose Shaq, Big Z and West in the offseason, but gained Jamison, Powe and Sessions. And mind you, Shaq and Big Z both retired after 2011. They were done.

Miami, with the exact same roster + valuable additions(Deng, Dragic, Whiteside) that went to the 2014 NBA Finals, couldn't even make the freaking playoffs in the supposed "worst conference ever" last season. They didn't have a .500 record even when both Wade and Bosh played, for those pointing at Bosh's injury for the reason why they missed the playoffs. Pat Riley basically had to do a complete roster overhaul sans Wade for them to have the current season that they did.

Pretty much this.

[AirBonner]

Explain why he couldn't win on his own until he joined Wade and Bosh? And he hasn't won shit without them since? LOL you fvcking dumbshit

Did you see the roster he dragged to the finals last year? They were missing Kyrie and Love (which people argue are better than LeBron these playoffs) So the 3rd best player on the team beat a 60 win team to get them to the finals and won 2 games against a GOAT team despite all odds.

[3ball]

they did lose Shaq, Big Z and West in the offseason, but gained Jamison, Powe and Sessions. And mind you, Shaq and Big Z both retired after 2011. They were done.

Oh, I get it - the Cavs and Heat had a completely different roster OUTSIDE of losing Lebron, yet you want to attribute their drop-off entirely to Lebron?

Nice logic and objectivity..

But here are the facts - in 2011, the Cavs lost 52 ppg of their scoring OUTSIDE of Lebron (Shaq, Mo Williams, Varejao, Delonte, Zydrunas) - this was over half their scoring... In 2015, the Heat roster was completely different as well, while Wade and Bosh were injured and past their prime.

So again, we've never seen a team lose JUST Lebron with everyone else healthy and in their prime.. Each time the rosters were completely different, there were major injuries, and the star players were past their prime... [COLOR="DarkRed"]That's what happens when you're a team-hopper/colluder.[/COLOR]
.

[AirBonner]

Oh, I get it - the Cavs and Heat had a completely different roster OUTSIDE of losing Lebron, yet you want to attribute their drop-off entirely to Lebron?

Nice logic and objectivity..

But here are the facts - in 2011, the Cavs lost 52 ppg of their scoring OUTSIDE of Lebron (Shaq, Mo Williams, Varejao, Delonte, Zydrunas) - this was over half their scoring... In 2015, the Heat roster was completely different as well, while Wade and Bosh were injured and past their prime.

So again, we've never seen a team lose JUST Lebron with everyone else healthy and in their prime.. Each time the rosters were completely different, there were major injuries, and the star players were past their prime... [COLOR="DarkRed"]That's what happens when you're a team-hopper/colluder.[/COLOR]

STFU Shaq was old as fvck and the rest of those guys were only decent BECUASE of Lebron. To assume that they would still have that kind of success without him is just dumb and retarded.

[3ball]

Miami, with the exact same roster + valuable additions(Deng, Dragic, Whiteside) that went to the 2014 NBA Finals, couldn't even make the freaking playoffs in the supposed "worst conference ever" last season. They didn't have a .500 record even when both Wade and Bosh played, for those pointing at Bosh's injury for the reason why they missed the playoffs. Pat Riley basically had to do a complete roster overhaul sans Wade for them to have the current season that they did.

They didn't have the exact same roster.

But more importantly, the Wade and Bosh were well past their primes - the 2014 Finals showed us how broken down and garbage they were - they were a shell of themselves and injury-prone.

So again, we've never seen a team lose JUST Lebron with everyone else healthy and in their prime.

Each time the rosters were completely different, there were major injuries, and the star players were past their prime... [I]That's what happens when you're a team-hopper/colluder.

[Steven Kerry]

STFU Shaq was old as fvck and the rest of those guys were only decent BECUASE of Lebron. To assume that they would still have that kind of success without him is just dumb and retarded.

Meltdown.

[AirBonner]

They didn't have the exact same roster.

But more importantly, the Wade and Bosh were well past their primes - the 2014 Finals showed us how broken down and garbage they were - they were a shell of themselves and injury-prone.

So again, we've never seen a team lose JUST Lebron with everyone else healthy and in their prime.

Each time the rosters were completely different, there were major injuries, and the star players were past their prime... [I]That's what happens when you're a team-hopper/colluder.

Bosh was 30 and Wade was 32

[3ball]

STFU Shaq was old as fvck and the rest of those guys were only decent BECUASE of Lebron. To assume that they would still have that kind of success without him is just dumb and retarded.

No need to get mad - Jordan scored 5 more ppg in the playoffs and 7 more ppg in Finals, on better efficiency across the board (TS, FG, ORtg).

[COLOR="Navy"]There's never been a player that averaged 5-7 more ppg on better efficiency that wasn't considered the FAR better player.[/COLOR]

Jordan's massive scoring and efficiency edge is worth more than Lebron's 1.0 assist edge (with more turnovers) 2.5 defensive rebound edge (with less offensive rebounds).

Ultimately, Jordan's goat scoring lead, team-leading passing, and best-ever defense at his position is the largest load ever carried.

[3ball]

Bosh was 30 and Wade was 32

the 2014 Finals showed us how broken down and garbage they were - they were a shell of themselves and injury-prone.. Bosh had a fu.cking blod clot in his damn lung

So again, we've never seen a team lose JUST Lebron with everyone else healthy and in their prime.

Each time the rosters were completely different, there were major injuries, and the star players were past their prime... [COLOR="Navy"]That's what happens when you're a team-hopper/colluder.[/COLOR]

STFU Shaq was old as fvck and the rest of those guys were only decent BECUASE of Lebron. To assume that they would still have that kind of success without him is just dumb and retarded.

No need to get mad - Jordan scored 5 more ppg in the playoffs and 7 more ppg in Finals, on better efficiency across the board (TS, FG, ORtg).

[COLOR="Navy"]There's never been a player that averaged 5-7 more ppg on better efficiency that wasn't considered the FAR better player.[/COLOR]

Jordan's massive scoring and efficiency edge is worth more than Lebron's 1.0 assist edge (with more turnovers) 2.5 defensive rebound edge (with less offensive rebounds).

Ultimately, Jordan's goat scoring lead, team-leading passing, and best-ever defense at his position is the largest load ever carried.

[Showtime2001]

Just remember 6/6 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2/6.



GOAT.

[AirBonner]

the 2014 Finals showed us how broken down and garbage they were - they were a shell of themselves and injury-prone.. Bosh had a fu.cking blod clot in his damn lung

So again, we've never seen a team lose JUST Lebron with everyone else healthy and in their prime.

Each time the rosters were completely different, there were major injuries, and the star players were past their prime... [COLOR="Navy"]That's what happens when you're a team-hopper/colluder.[/COLOR]



No need to get mad - Jordan scored 5 more ppg in the playoffs and 7 more ppg in Finals, on better efficiency across the board (TS, FG, ORtg).

[COLOR="Navy"]There's never been a player that averaged 5-7 more ppg on better efficiency that wasn't considered the FAR better player.[/COLOR]

Jordan's massive scoring and efficiency edge is worth more than Lebron's 1.0 assist edge (with more turnovers) 2.5 defensive rebound edge (with less offensive rebounds).

Ultimately, Jordan's goat scoring lead, team-leading passing, and best-ever defense at his position is the largest load ever carried.

Injuries are part of the game. Excuses are not.

[3ball]

Injuries are part of the game. Excuses are not.

again, we've never seen a team lose JUST Lebron with everyone else healthy and in their prime.

each time the rosters were completely different, there were major injuries, and the star players were past their prime...

That's what happens when you're a team-hopper/colluder - a guy that just seeks the best environment with zero loyalty, integrity, or backbone.

[AirBonner]

again, we've never seen a team lose JUST Lebron with everyone else healthy and in their prime.

each time the rosters were completely different, there were major injuries, and the star players were past their prime...

That's what happens when you're a team-hopper/colluder - a guy that just seeks the best environment with zero loyalty, integrity, or backbone.

But the FACTS are they were a LOTTERY team without LeBron. You can get as hypothetical as you want. It is still the facts.

[Steven Kerry]

Bosh was 30 and Wade was 32

Injuries know no age.