Why did people think Grant Hill and Penny Hardaway were so great

[Fawker]

Penny and Tmac's movements were so gracefull. They fall in the same shortcomings. I think TMac was better then Penny tho.

[rlsmooth775]

The same way I see Lebron a little overrated, is the same way you see Penny a little overrated.

It's really a matter of bias here. If you really like Lebron, you won't accept that any player is better than him or on his level.

Put Penny on this Heat team and I see the same success, maybe even another title in 2011.

Penny isn't even better than second season Lebron

[LoveIsMyMessage]

Pistons GHill was a superstar before the ankle injury and the trade to the Orlando Magic. Elite first step, cross, and explosion off the dribble. A complete player. And this was in the 90s' with quality players in their prime. Jordan, Pippen, Kemp, Payton, Alonzo, Ewing, Hardaway, Shaq, Etc. If you saw him play you know he was not overrated. Daily tripple doubles(Was ahead of Kidd at the time in totals Tdubs), sportcenter top 10s'daily, Fila and Sprite commercials were famous. This site is full of 12 year olds.

[poido123]

Penny isn't even better than second season Lebron

Penny never actually reached his prime, this is a speculative thread. As such, we can only assume things...

I would guess that Penny would perform better than Lebron, but not quite have the same talent and overall athleticism of Lebron(including his size).

What I'm saying is, Penny would have the better career, whereas Lebron would have the edge in talent? But not by much, and it's mainly defensively.

[sportjames23]

I see what you did there, tried to sneak Lebron in with the Icons, slow down kid.

Word. OP thinks he's slick.

[sportjames23]

Real talk - current Steph Curry is better than both these player. I can't even imagine the destruction a team with Shaq + Curry would be + those other Orlando shooters. They'd run amok.

[moe94]

Penny never actually reached his prime, this is a speculative thread. As such, we can only assume things...

I would guess that Penny would perform better than Lebron, but not quite have the same talent and overall athleticism of Lebron(including his size).

What I'm saying is, Penny would have the better career, whereas Lebron would have the edge in talent? But not by much, and it's mainly defensively.

Exactly how good do you think Penny could have become? The best he showed was nowhere near LeBron.

[poido123]

Exactly how good do you think Penny could have become? The best he showed was nowhere near LeBron.

A top 10-12 player all time.

But that's around where I'd put Lebron WITHOUT his current superteam playing in a weak Eastern conference.''

If Lebron had of been stuck with the Cavs teams and maybe squeaked out a title? He would not be anywhere near the discussion of top 5 alltime.

I think playing for Miami has also made it easier for him to accumulate MVP's too.


The nowhere near Lebron comment was a little off target.

[sportjames23]

Exactly how good do you think Penny could have become? The best he showed was nowhere near LeBron.

Penny was the truth, man. Before his injuries, I thought he could easily become the next great wing. Penny could score easier than Lebron, IMO, and probably assist better, too. Lebron is a better rebounder than Penny was doe.

[moe94]

A top 10-12 player all time.

But that's around where I'd put Lebron WITHOUT his current superteam playing in a weak Eastern conference.''

If Lebron had of been stuck with the Cavs teams and maybe squeaked out a title? He would not be anywhere near the discussion of top 5 alltime.

I think playing for Miami has also made it easier for him to accumulate MVP's too.


The nowhere near Lebron comment was a little off target.

How? He already won 2 in Cleveland and if he kept dragging teams without great players to great regular seasons with his stats, he'd keep racking them up. Who'd stop him?

The nowhere comment isn't off because LeBron was a better player than Penny at the same ages and it was hardly close, was it? I'm not talking career or legacy or any of that when I asked you because I simply think LeBron was a better individual talent than Penny.

[poido123]

How? He already won 2 in Cleveland and if he kept dragging teams without great players to great regular seasons with his stats, he'd keep racking them up. Who'd stop him?

The nowhere comment isn't off because LeBron was a better player than Penny at the same ages and it was hardly close, was it? I'm not talking career or legacy or any of that when I asked you because I simply think LeBron was a better individual talent than Penny.

I'd argue one of those MVP's should be Chris Paul's, but that's another matter.

There are plenty of talented players out there that don't perform. Means jack. I think Penny would of done more with his talents, than Lebron has. Give Pennjy the same team as Lebron in his prime, and you would likely see the Heat winning 2011 as well.

There is a slight edge to Lebron on talent(mainly due to his size and strength combination), but only slightly because Lebron is a much better defender.

As to who's stopping him? I don't know. A team with a stronger record than Cav's? Possibly Durant last year and this year...

We are speculating what wins Cav's would have over the last 3 years, they could be terrible and only win 40 odd.

[Smoke117]

Grant Hill was never as good as Scottie Pippen, he was just basically allowed to do whatever he wanted under Doug Collins and the other actors he played for because the Pistons didn't have shit. It's no surprise that he left in 2000...the Pistons weren't building or going nowhere. Nobody foresaw that the injury during that season would basically ail him the rest of his career...but people seem to forget that has he scored more his other stats and focus dropped. His career best 25ppg was accompanied by his other stats and attributes fallling.

[bdreason]

Nobody compares them to MJ and Magic. Penny and Grant would have fallen in that 2nd tier, with guys like Kobe and LeBron.

[Amar'e_Juwanna]

Bill Walton would have been an all time top 5 C.

[secund2nun]

Penny and Hill in their prime would form the top 5 players in today's league.

Penny had potential to be as great as Lebron is.

Not even close. Penny is one of the most overrated players. Penny suffered his first major injury in 1997 at the age of 26 early in the season. His play was poor that season up until the injury and the season before he was healthy at age 25 and averaged 20-6-5 and that's with prime Shaq taking up double teas.

Lebron was average 30-9-7 at the age of 25...are you really gonna compare 20-6-5 by Penny at age 25 vs Lebron's 30-9-7 at age 25?

Penny's peak season was in 95 at age 24 when he went 22-7-4....Lebron at age 24 went 28-8-7.

Penny is an example of nostalgia at it's finest...the funny part is that I was around to see Penny so I actually see the classic nostaligia overrating form from scratch right before my eyes. 20 years from now Penny will have 4.1 speed, 7'6 height and was still growing, 55 inch vertical, and carried the Magic to the 95 finals