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Old 08-03-2014, 01:24 AM   #16
stalkerforlife
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Translation - "I made a top 10 list and left Kobe out to get some attention because i'm a lonely, miserable little guy."
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Old 08-03-2014, 01:42 AM   #17
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

hey uh how come no one else is making a top 10 list


Quote:
Originally Posted by stalkerforlife
Translation - "I made a top 10 list and left Kobe out to get some attention because i'm a lonely, miserable little guy."




Then why would i put Kobe over Shaq/Bird/Lebron/Hakeem on the top 10 GOAT list, you claff.


Basketball's been around for over 50 years, and there've been countless greats. Appreciate the history and contribute, or get the **** out with your useless drivel.
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Old 08-03-2014, 01:43 AM   #18
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Good list.
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Old 08-03-2014, 01:45 AM   #19
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Quote:
Originally Posted by played0ut
hey uh how come no one else is making a top 10 list







Then why would i put Kobe over Shaq/Bird/Lebron/Hakeem on the top 10 GOAT list, you claff.


Basketball's been around for over 50 years, and there've been countless greats. Appreciate the history and contribute, or get the **** out with your useless drivel.

Translation - "I'm a passive-aggressive Kobe hater."
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Old 08-03-2014, 01:54 AM   #20
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

No Kobe?

Finally a good thread.
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:05 AM   #21
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Can you explain why Wilt is so high up? I'm genuinely asking. Because yes he has great stats, but how big was his impact really? Also about his competitive drive; I heard that he would stop trying to defend or block when he had 5 fouls, so he wouldn't foul out.
I'm not saying you're wrong, I just want to understand.
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:15 AM   #22
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Quote:
Originally Posted by That_Admiral
Can you explain why Wilt is so high up? I'm genuinely asking. Because yes he has great stats, but how big was his impact really? Also about his competitive drive; I heard that he would stop trying to defend or block when he had 5 fouls, so he wouldn't foul out.
I'm not saying you're wrong, I just want to understand.


That MYTH was blown away a long time ago. There are articles in which a Chamberlain, saddled with five fouls, was blocking multiple shots to save a key playoff game. In fact, I can't find any articles which claim that he did stop defending. Only a couple of player quotes, and mostly Celtic loyalists.

Secondly, Wilt AVERAGED 2.0 PFs in his regular season career, and playing 46 mpg. And in his post-season career, covering 160 games, and in which he averaged 47.2 mpg, he AVERAGED 2.5 PF's per game. He was seldom even playing with three fouls, much less five.
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:18 AM   #23
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Wilt is so overrated. What did he do in the playoffs besides have his ppg drop significantly?

So much impact that he was a 5th option on a championship team. Never matched his regular season production in the playoffs.. The ultimate stat padder
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:28 AM   #24
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAZERUSS
That MYTH was blown away a long time ago. There are articles in which a Chamberlain, saddled with five fouls, was blocking multiple shots to save a key playoff game. In fact, I can't find any articles which claim that he did stop defending. Only a couple of player quotes, and mostly Celtic loyalists.

Secondly, Wilt AVERAGED 2.0 PFs in his regular season career, and playing 46 mpg. And in his post-season career, covering 160 games, and in which he averaged 47.2 mpg, he AVERAGED 2.5 PF's per game. He was seldom even playing with three fouls, much less five.
Ok thank you for clearing that up, however I still wouldn't have him that high in rankings impact wise. My opinion.
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:28 AM   #25
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Quote:
Originally Posted by stalkerforlife
Translation - "I'm a passive-aggressive Kobe hater."

^

Translation - none necessary. Everyone already thinks you're an idiot. Congrats, I just joined their ranks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by That_Admiral
Can you explain why Wilt is so high up? I'm genuinely asking. Because yes he has great stats, but how big was his impact really? Also about his competitive drive; I heard that he would stop trying to defend or block when he had 5 fouls, so he wouldn't foul out.
I'm not saying you're wrong, I just want to understand.

His ungodly numbers. And his talent was above all others, imo. That shows he could dominate the league in a way no one else could. Also on his impact on his team. He carried the bulk of the burden of scoring, rebounding, and defense for his entire team. He didn't have great players like Bill Russell who could share some of the burden.

Essentially, he singlehandedly carried his team deep into the playoffs more than any player in NBA history since. (There are quotes where his teammates said that Wilt was the only reason why they went so far).

I don't think Nate Thurmond or Bill Russell could've done that. Bill had more of winner's mindset (knows exactly what he should/shouldn't do to win) and was more competitive, but raw talent wise he wasn't at Wilt's level.



As for his competitive drive, you're right. He was competitive, yes (every NBA player was competitive) but he wasn't as competitive as some of the others. Jerry West recently spoke about the ruthless competitiveness that makes players great. He named these people,

Himself, Bill Russell, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, Kobe Bryant, and Michael Jordan as a group above the rest. (Keep in mind also that Jerry West was also a teammate of Wilt and left him out).

Other anecdotes of how his level of competitiveness/work ethic weren't like the others;

-He would go into practice really late and the team would have to accommodate his hours

-He was a nice guy and disliked being seen as a brute-- so he played a game with much more finesse. Nate Thurmond said when comparing Shaq and Wilt, "Wilt would fade away from the basket, while Shaq would come in,"

Consider he was athletic freak (high jump, track and field, stamina). He was bigger, faster, and stronger than Shaq (Shaq only had mass on him). He could've decimated the league if he took full advantage of his size/strength/mass. But he didn't.

-Also said in an interview that him and Russell were friends-- so he didn't go full out when going up against Russell. He said it was a mistake and he should've gone for it.
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:31 AM   #26
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Kobe is not an on-court difference maker in the top 30.


Guys like Stockton, Kidd, KG, Dirk, Barkley, Rodman, McHale, Wade, frankly lots of dudes ahead of him. Fact.
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:31 AM   #27
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Quote:
Originally Posted by MastaKilla
Wilt is so overrated. What did he do in the playoffs besides have his ppg drop significantly?

So much impact that he was a 5th option on a championship team. Never matched his regular season production in the playoffs.. The ultimate stat padder

Lol there's a good explanation. During regular season he was playing against relatively shorter, unathletic players-- of course his numbers would be monstrous.

But come playoffs, when he'd play against REAL HOF talent, his numbers would go down to 'realistic' levels-- as in levels you could expect if he played against top centers in today's league.

tl;dr?

During regular seasons, imagine Shaq vs. Scalabrine.

During playoffs, where Russell and Nate came in, imagine Shaq vs. Olajuwon.

Still crazy numbers. But not ridiculously impossible numbers.
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:39 AM   #28
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Quote:
Originally Posted by played0ut
^

Translation - none necessary. Everyone already thinks you're an idiot. Congrats, I just joined their ranks.




His ungodly numbers. And his talent was above all others, imo. That shows he could dominate the league in a way no one else could. Also on his impact on his team. He carried the bulk of the burden of scoring, rebounding, and defense for his entire team. He didn't have great players like Bill Russell who could share some of the burden.

Essentially, he singlehandedly carried his team deep into the playoffs more than any player in NBA history since. (There are quotes where his teammates said that Wilt was the only reason why they went so far).

I don't think Nate Thurmond or Bill Russell could've done that. Bill had more of winner's mindset (knows exactly what he should/shouldn't do to win) and was more competitive, but raw talent wise he wasn't at Wilt's level.



As for his competitive drive, you're right. He was competitive, yes (every NBA player was competitive) but he wasn't as competitive as some of the others. Jerry West recently spoke about the ruthless competitiveness that makes players great. He named these people,

Himself, Bill Russell, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, Kobe Bryant, and Michael Jordan as a group above the rest. (Keep in mind also that Jerry West was also a teammate of Wilt and left him out).

Other anecdotes of how his level of competitiveness/work ethic weren't like the others;

-He would go into practice really late and the team would have to accommodate his hours

-He was a nice guy and disliked being seen as a brute-- so he played a game with much more finesse. Nate Thurmond said when comparing Shaq and Wilt, "Wilt would fade away from the basket, while Shaq would come in,"

Consider he was athletic freak (high jump, track and field, stamina). He was bigger, faster, and stronger than Shaq (Shaq only had mass on him). He could've decimated the league if he took full advantage of his size/strength/mass. But he didn't.

-Also said in an interview that him and Russell were friends-- so he didn't go full out when going up against Russell. He said it was a mistake and he should've gone for it.

Perfect explanation. It was a huge error on Wilt's part on not going all out. And that's where i feel his 'impact' took a big dive
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:48 AM   #29
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Quote:
Originally Posted by That_Admiral
Perfect explanation. It was a huge error on Wilt's part on not going all out. And that's where i feel his 'impact' took a big dive

And that's why he's not above Bill Russell on my list. But #2 is fitting IMO.

yeh, his impact wasn't as crazy as it 'could' have been. But regardless, he was the most unstoppable force in NBA for the longest time. Look at his 3rd season-- 50.4/25.7. On 48.5 MPG!

The guy (more than anyone else in NBA History) near singlehandedly brought his teams through the playoffs in ways no one else could. He changed entire playsets and NBA rules to counter him. He would dunk from the foul line to shoot free throws. They brought in goaltending calls because of him. Lol that guy's impact was insane.
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:52 AM   #30
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Default Re: Top 10 players IMPACT wise

Quote:
Originally Posted by That_Admiral
Can you explain why Wilt is so high up? I'm genuinely asking. Because yes he has great stats, but how big was his impact really? Also about his competitive drive; I heard that he would stop trying to defend or block when he had 5 fouls, so he wouldn't foul out.
I'm not saying you're wrong, I just want to understand.

The modern rulebook was written to counter Wilt. That and the fact that he holds more records than anyone, means he impacted the game more than anyone.
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