Was Stockton a system player like DWill?

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

Enough time has passed and everyone knows Sloan made DWills career. Was Stockton any different?

[OncePerMonth]

He benefited from it, but he was obviously super crafty offensively and defensively.

[Harison]

There is a massive difference between DWill and Stockton.

DWill was great as a cog in a system suitable to him, i.e. a system player.

Stockton was all-time great by playing intelligent and structured offense, i.e. he is extremely smart and he runs the offense as a well oiled machine. If not one "system" it would be another, but primarily rational and structured. I remember calling him a cyborg - cold-blooded, efficient with lazer-like precision passing and calculating like a machine.

It was different with Magic, who was a master of creating something out of chaos, Stockton couldnt play like that, nor Magic could play efficient offense like John did, they are the opposites. Therefore judging them as PG's you would have to decide whats more important - intelligent game plan run as a Swiss clock, or All-star game style Showtime.

Interesting note, I remember sometimes when Jazz had a clock running out and Sloan was asking Stockton if he needs a time-out for a play, John waved him out, and did perfect play on his own, on the fly.

Bottom line, DWill is a system player, Stockton is the system.

[played0ut]

^

That's a good definition. I remember seeing some clip where old timers would talk. They'd say the Jazz were consistently great but they were just that-- consistent.

And that even though they would lose to the JAzz, they wouldn't exactly 'fear' them the way they did Barkley's Suns (or 76'ers?) in that Barkley's team could explode for a juggernaut of points.

[Nick Young]

There is a massive difference between DWill and Stockton.

DWill was great as a cog in a system suitable to him, i.e. a system player.

Stockton was all-time great by playing intelligent and structured offense, i.e. he is extremely smart and he runs the offense as a well oiled machine. If not one "system" it would be another, but primarily rational and structured. I remember calling him a cyborg - cold-blooded, efficient with lazer-like precision passing and calculating like a machine.

It was different with Magic, who was a master of creating something out of chaos, Stockton couldnt play like that, nor Magic could play efficient offense like John did, they are the opposites. Therefore judging them as PG's you would have to decide whats more important - intelligent game plan run as a Swiss clock, or All-star game style Showtime.

Interesting note, I remember sometimes when Jazz had a clock running out and Sloan was asking Stockton if he needs a time-out for a play, John waved him out, and did perfect play on his own, on the fly.

Bottom line, DWill is a system player, Stockton is the system.

Jerry Sloan called every single play for Stockton every time down the court. With Deron, he allowed him to call his own plays. Does that not imply that Stockton was more of a system player then Deron?

[Harison]

^

That's a good definition. I remember seeing some clip where old timers would talk. They'd say the Jazz were consistently great but they were just that-- consistent.

And that even though they would lose to the JAzz, they wouldn't exactly 'fear' them the way they did Barkley's Suns (or 76'ers?) in that Barkley's team could explode for a juggernaut of points.

Jazz were never stacked, two great players and thats it. It would be enough today, not enough in the Golden era. Nobody feared Bulls either when Jordan was carrying it alone, even though he was putting up insane stats. Barkley's Suns only were feared for a few years when the team was stacked.

[9512]

It will be hard to say if stockton would have played the same way with a different teammate and coach since he played almost his entire career with Malone all but one year (rookie season) and Sloan as his only coach.

[IGOTGAME]

Dwill wasn't a system player.....he got hurt.

[Xiao Yao You]

It will be hard to say if stockton would have played the same way with a different teammate and coach since he played almost his entire career with Malone all but one year (rookie season) and Sloan as his only coach.

He was an all-star under Layden. He and Karl played arguably their best ball in the '88 playoffs by running the ball against the Lakers not settling for pick and roll in the half court like under Sloan.

[navy]

Dwill wasn't a system player.....he got hurt.

This. LOL at people dismissing D Will because of his ankles.

[hawksdogsbraves]

This current idea that D-Will is only a system player that has been going around lately is so dumb.

[HomieWeMajor]

I heard Malone only phucked that 13 year old because Stockon set him up

[JellyBean]

Nope. Stockton was doing the Utah Jazz thing when he was at Gonzaga. It helped to have media exposure.

[Pointguard]

It was different with Magic, who was a master of creating something out of chaos, Stockton couldnt play like that, nor Magic could play efficient offense like John did, they are the opposites. Therefore judging them as PG's you would have to decide whats more important - intelligent game plan run as a Swiss clock, or All-star game style Showtime.

Bottom line, DWill is a system player, Stockton is the system.

I think you got carried away. Riley always ran a system. When Stockton came in for Magic on the Olympic teams, the falloff of play was like an Allstar to regular second unit guy. NOT like another star. Magic was definitely as intelligent and could make up his mind noticeably quicker, with more zip on the ball. Magic could play as efficient offense as any player that every played the game. Stockton was good with two other players (Malone and one key shooter) - Magic was great with the whole team.

By the way you were talking I thought you were talking about Nash, who was indeed the system and was great with all five players as well. Nash is the one who doesn't get his due. Stocton milked that system til you couldn't milk it anymore. He was just more aggressive than DWill and more persistent in running the same play. Malone being a great finisher doesn't get enough attention either.

[lilteapot]

I heard Malone only phucked that 13 year old because Stockon set him up

lmao