Is Kevin Durant above Tracy McGrady in the all-time list?

[k0kakw0rld]

Kobe>LeBron because of winning, but McGrady>Durant because of stats. And McGrady doesn't even have better stats than Durant, his stats are worse if you include his entire prime. The guy had ONE great season and is overrated because of his playing style. Just like Iverson

ALLEN IVERSON IS THE GREATEST POINT GUARD TO EVER PLAY THE GAME. Only one good season? Let me educate you:

Number one Pick Overall 96
Rookie of the Year 1997.
Rookie All-star game MVP in 1997.
11 time NBA All Star
All Star Game MVP 2001 and 2005
NBA MVP 2000-01.
All NBA First Team 1999, 2000, 2001.
Led 76ers to the NBA finals with Scrubs Eric Snow? Really?
4 time Avg more than 30.0 PPG in the playoffs 5 time during regular season so only one good Season? Really?


Durant has an All Star With him Westbrick...A decent Center and Power Forward both playing amazing D.

[FindingTim]

Durant greater player all-time than McGrady? hell no. T-Mac is one of the most unstoppable, well-rounded players to ever play the game. He was every bit as explosive a scorer as Durant, with terrific ball-handling and great court vision/passing. McGrady, at his peak, was one of the best ever. That might sound absurd, but his playoff "failures" blind people to his greatness.

[lilgodfather1]

If this is the first season you ever watched then yeah Durant is clearly better, but if you watched more than 5 yearsthen TMac is clearly the better player. Simply unstoppable, too bad he ot so many injuries. Derailed, and robbed us of seeing a great player.

[Dizzle-2k7]

both incredible players but prime tmac was a monster and clearly better...

however if you compare careers then imo durant has already surpassed him by getting to the WCF last year.

[L.Kizzle]

When you factor in Durant's playoff success, yet which is sad because McGrady was in the league for 14 years

No not yet and what playoff success? A guy who in four years made the playoffs twice has now "playoff success?" Damn, I guess Baron Davis is a playoff legend then.

[StateOfMind12]

No not yet and what playoff success? A guy who in four years made the playoffs twice has now "playoff success?" Damn, I guess Baron Davis is a playoff legend then.

I'm pretty sure a player who makes it to the Conference finals is more successful in the post-season than a player who never made it past the 1st round. Noamsayin?

'01-'04 was a tougher defense era, no way Durant is getting to the line at the comical rate he did in '10 back then.

Maybe, maybe not but Durant is an elite FT shooter whereas Tmac is actually below average FT shooter for a player of his position. That affects your TS% by a lot. Players like Shaq still have a wrong TS% because they have such a high FG%. It's almost like if you have a shitty FG%, you can make it up by draining a lot of 3s efficiently and/or making your FTs at a high clip.

Chauncey Billups is the perfect example of this. Billups always shoots a low FG% every season. He shoots a FG% in the 40% range year in and year out, yet if you look at his TS% he shoots a TS% in the 60% range year in and year out which is remarkable/elite.

Durant would have a higher TS% than Tmac in almost any era really...

T-Mac's advantage as a passer and playmaker is huge and he was a better defender when motivated(usually in the playoffs), aside from pure shooting, prime T-Mac was as good at everything, imo and at least as good of a streak shooter, if not better.

While I do think was a better passer/playmaker, Durant has been closing the gap and you would know what I am talking about if you have been watching Durant this season. His handles have definitely improved, they may not be as good as prime McGrady's but they are certainly very good.

Defense belongs to Durant because he is more consistent on that end. This season Durant has improved to be a great defensive player. It wouldn't even surprise me if Durant headlines the All-NBA defensive team this season because that is how good he has been.

There is a reason why a lot of people are starting to believe Durant is the best player in the league now. Some of it has to do with spitting Lebron James and his fans but a lot of other people also believe it because of his improvement in his all-around game.

[L.Kizzle]

I'm pretty sure a player who makes it to the Conference finals is more successful in the post-season than a player who never made it past the 1st round. Noamsayin?

He has 2 post season appearances, not like he has a Steve Nash post season record.

Baron Davis > T-Mac right?
Arenas > T-Mac?
Allan Houston > T-Mac. He made the Finals.

[StateOfMind12]

He has 2 post season appearances, not like he has a Steve Nash post season record.

Baron Davis > T-Mac right?
Arenas > T-Mac?
Allan Houston > T-Mac. He made the Finals.

Baron Davis? I would honestly say so even though I think pretty lowly of both Davis and Tmac
Arenas? I am not too sure but probably.
Houston? He wasn't the best player when his team made the finals so that is invalid.

I honestly hate to use winning/losing as the tale end to everything, but with Tmac it actually does matter since the guy was just a flat out loser. Prime Tmac was probably a better individual and more talented player than all of the players you listed, but as far as careers are concerned? He is probably below 2 of the 3 you listed.

[Kevin_Gamble]

T-Mac was so unstoppable in his prime that he shot almost 46% twice.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Maybe, maybe not but Durant is an elite FT shooter whereas Tmac is actually below average FT shooter for a player of his position. That affects your TS% by a lot. Players like Shaq still have a wrong TS% because they have such a high FG%. It's almost like if you have a shitty FG%, you can make it up by draining a lot of 3s efficiently and/or making your FTs at a high clip.

Chauncey Billups is the perfect example of this. Billups always shoots a low FG% every season. He shoots a FG% in the 40% range year in and year out, yet if you look at his TS% he shoots a TS% in the 60% range year in and year out which is remarkable/elite.

Durant would have a higher TS% than Tmac in almost any era really.

Oh, I'm not saying that Durant wouldn't have a higher TS%, I'm saying that the difference probably wouldn't be as a big. League average back then was always 52%(rounded, give or take a few percentage points) while it's been 54%+ since during Durant's era.

If you look at Durant's FTA per FGA in the '10 season, it's hard to imagine him getting the same amount in the early 2000s. He averaged 10.2 FTA with 20.3 FGA. To put that in perspective peak Shaq in 2000 averaged 10.4 FTA with 21.1 FGA. So he was getting to the line at a better rate than a player whose game was primarily power around the basket and a player who was already getting fouled intentionally with the hack-a-Shaq strategy at times.

But again, ppg+TS% don't sum up everything(as you yourself said in the LBJ scoring thread). Durant wasn't really any worse in '11 than '10 when he averaged 27.7 on 59 TS% vs 30.1 on 61 TS%.

While I do think was a better passer/playmaker, Durant has been closing the gap and you would know what I am talking about if you have been watching Durant this season. His handles have definitely improved, they may not be as good as prime McGrady's but they are certainly very good.

I haven't watched enough OKC games yet this season to judge fairly how significant his improvements are, he has looked better in this area so far, I agree with that, but T-Mac was among the absolute best SG/SF in recent years in this area.

Defense belongs to Durant because he is more consistent on that end. This season Durant has improved to be a great defensive player. It wouldn't even surprise me if Durant headlines the All-NBA defensive team this season because that is how good he has been.

Well, if he keeps it up. Durant is a guy who in the past has shown the potential at that end as well, but then again, so did T-Mac.

There is a reason why a lot of people are starting to believe Durant is the best player in the league now. Some of it has to do with spitting Lebron James and his fans but a lot of other people also believe it because of his improvement in his all-around game.

Well, this is a discussion that I personally won't take a stance on early in this season except for saying that if we were to judge the best player over the first 6-10 games or whatever, then Lebron has clearly had the best start. But it's too early, I've seen many players start out looking like they added something to their game, but doing it consistently throughout a season is different to me.

[Duncan21formvp]

Well if both players careers ended today, Mcgrady would get into the Hall of Fame while Durant would not.

[rodman91]

ALLEN IVERSON IS THE GREATEST POINT GUARD TO EVER PLAY THE GAME. Only one good season? Let me educate you:

Number one Pick Overall 96
Rookie of the Year 1997.
Rookie All-star game MVP in 1997.
11 time NBA All Star
All Star Game MVP 2001 and 2005
NBA MVP 2000-01.
All NBA First Team 1999, 2000, 2001.
Led 76ers to the NBA finals with Scrubs Eric Snow? Really?
4 time Avg more than 30.0 PPG in the playoffs 5 time during regular season so only one good Season? Really?


Durant has an All Star With him Westbrick...A decent Center and Power Forward both playing amazing D.

Also:

6th most ppg in season history.
2nd most ppg in playoff's history.
3rd most scoring titles in season history.(tied with Gervin)
3rd most 50 point game in playoff's history.
3 time stealing leader (most,tied)

[pauk]

hell NO

[RRR3]

hell NO

OP Is Swagg3r

[StateOfMind12]

T-Mac was so unstoppable in his prime that he shot almost 46% twice.

I would say Tmac was so unstoppable that his career TS% in the post-season was 51.7% McGrady is one of the most overrated playoff performers of all-time. People love to talk about how he is a good playoff performer because of his high playoff ppg career average, yet most people don't realize that he hasn't played any games (never got past the 1st round) and was shooting horribly inefficient in each of those playoff series for the most part