Greatest of All-Time PRE-Jordan?

[plowking]

yes, ofcourse basketball is about winning. but basketball is a team sport, if your team is not good enough you will not win, its that simple. unfortunately for wilt, he played in the same era of the greatest dynasty in pro sports history, that being the boston celtics.

wilt couldn't win? 2 championships, and 11 conference finals appearances say otherwise

a night. 1 night. nobody in nba history could take the beatings wilt took and play the minutes he played night, night out. you think just because someone does it 1 night he could do it for 82 games? pathetic.

this was the teams only chance at winning games.

how many hall of famers on one team did jordan have to go through?

check where wilt played his most playoff games - after he stopped scoring and started concentrated on defense and rebounding - which obviously brings his career playoff numbers down from his career regular season numbers.

russell deserved 1 mvp, and that was 2 years before wilt had stepped onto a nba court

You said it yourself. Once Wilt stopped caring about scoring, that's when he started to win.

No, scoring 50 a game is not the way to get your team to win. Jordan, Bird, Magic and so on made their teammates better.

[Shep]

You said it yourself. Once Wilt stopped caring about scoring, that's when he started to win.

wilt always cared about winning, its just that wilt could score better than anyone in nba history, and that was his teams best chance of winning early in his career. later in his career he was surrounded with alot of scorers, so he didn't have to do alot of scoring and he could concentrate on other things.

No, scoring 50 a game is not the way to get your team to win. Jordan, Bird, Magic and so on made their teammates better.

wilt didn't make his teammates better? the question should rather be which of wilts teammates didn't benefit from having wilt there

[cdbleb]

how many hall of famers on one team did jordan have to go through?

Cant really say for sure...Not all players from Jordans era who will make the Hall of Fame have been inducted yet. For example, if Dennis Rodman makes it then that would make 3 on the Pistons who Jordan had to go through. Theres also Indiana who had Chris Mullin, Reggie Miller and Mark Jackson in 97/98 who could all possibly have a case to get in. Youre comparing players who have had 30+ years to get in with some guys who have been out of the league for less than 10. In the late 80s the Knicks had Ewing, Mark Jackson, Kiki Vandewegh (sp?) and Rod Strickland (I know they wont all make it but none of them can be 100% counted out yet either). Theres no telling what the voters might do in 20-30 years...Atlanta from either 96 or 97 might have had 4 if the voters feel generous HIGHLY doubtful but Steve Smith, Mookie Blaylock, Christian Laettner, and Dikembe Mutombo. I know thats a HUGE stretch but really, is it even worth asking when theres a 20+ year difference between the players and some of the guys Jordan faced are still in the league?

If anything your question gives Jordan the advantage because of the possibilities of players who MIGHT get in. Youre asking that question about 15 years too early.

[bruceblitz]

I definitely would have to go with Kareem!

KAREEM ABDUL JABBAR
6 MVP awards, won championships with both Oscar Robertson and Magic Johnson, member of 6 championship teams, 2 Finals MVP's, 2 time scoring champ, 19 time all-star, all time NBA leading scorer for total points, 34.8ppg career high in the 71-72 season (also averaged 4.6 assists and 16.6 rebounds that year), averaged 5 assists per game or more for 3 seasons, averaged 16 rebounds or more for 4 seasons, made 56% of his shots for his career, the sky hook was UNSTOPPABLE! Kareem averaged 32ppg, 17reb, 4ast, on 50% shooting in the playoffs in his prime.


With Wilt right behind him. Not by much.
WILT CHAMBERLAIN
7'1" 275lbs of pure beast, had a season averaging 24.3ppg, 23.8reb, 8.6ast in 1967-68, averaged over 20 rebounds per game for 11 seasons of his career, peaked out at 27.2 rebounds per game in 1960-61 while scoring 38.4ppg, averaged 50.4ppg on 50.6% shooting in the 1961-62 season, averaged 30.10 for his career on 54% shooting, made 72.7 of his shots in his final season in the NBA, his skill-set was amazing, featuring a fadeaway that was unstoppable along with his power moves in the post. The NBA did not record steals and blocks in that era. Wilt also won 7 scoring titles. Wilt averaged 35ppg, 25reb, 3ast, on 49% shooting in the playoffs in his prime.

[White Chocolate]

The scary part is Wilt is around 50 years old in that pic and is still f*ckin jacked.

[Shep]

cdbleb

you're comparing the atlanta hawks to the dynasty celtics? thats about enough out of you.

[Silverbullit]

check where wilt played his most playoff games - after he stopped scoring and started concentrated on defense and rebounding - which obviously brings his career playoff numbers down from his career regular season numbers.

Year/Regular Season/Playoffs/Difference

1959-60 / 37.6 / 33.2 / -4.4
1960-61 / 38.4 / 37.0 / -1.4
1961-62 / 50.4 / 35.0 / -15.4
1962-63 / 44.8
1963-64 / 36.9 / 34.7 / -2.2
1964-65 / 34.7 / 29.3 / -5.4
1965-66 / 33.5 / 28.0 / -5.5
1966-67 / 24.1 / 21.7 / -2.4
1967-68 / 24.3 / 23.7 / -0.6
1968-69 / 20.5 / 13.9 / -6.6
1969-70 / 27.3 / 22.1 / -5.2
1970-71 / 20.7 / 18.3 / -2.4
1971-72 / 14.8 / 14.7 / -0.1
1972-73 / 13.2 / 10.4 / -2.8

Wilt's scoring playoff numbers dropped in every single year of his career, compared to regular season.

[JtotheIzzo]

Chamberlain isn't even a top 5 player of all time.

Bird is the correct answer.

how do you sleep at night?

[JtotheIzzo]

Year/Regular Season/Playoffs/Difference

1959-60 / 37.6 / 33.2 / -4.4
1960-61 / 38.4 / 37.0 / -1.4
1961-62 / 50.4 / 35.0 / -15.4
1962-63 / 44.8
1963-64 / 36.9 / 34.7 / -2.2
1964-65 / 34.7 / 29.3 / -5.4
1965-66 / 33.5 / 28.0 / -5.5
1966-67 / 24.1 / 21.7 / -2.4
1967-68 / 24.3 / 23.7 / -0.6
1968-69 / 20.5 / 13.9 / -6.6
1969-70 / 27.3 / 22.1 / -5.2
1970-71 / 20.7 / 18.3 / -2.4
1971-72 / 14.8 / 14.7 / -0.1
1972-73 / 13.2 / 10.4 / -2.8

Wilt's scoring playoff numbers dropped in every single year of his career, compared to regular season.

there are many reasons why this stat can be misinterpreted

[Johnni Gade]

Kareem's skyhook, oh yes. Those were the days.

[cdbleb]

you're comparing the atlanta hawks to the dynasty celtics? thats about enough out of you.

Is that what I did there? I guess I missed it because I thought I was merely answering your question.

You asked how many HoF players did Jordan have to go through on one team, right? By mentioning the possibility of the Hawks having multiple HoFers I guess I didnt realize that meant they would be right up there next to the Celtics dynasty.

Next time try to remember where the conversation stemmed from before you make assumptions..."Thats about enough out of you."

[Shep]

Wilt's scoring playoff numbers dropped in every single year of his career, compared to regular season.

i've already destroyed this. playoff games after he chose to stop scoring = 108. playoff gamed before he choose to stop scoring = 52. wilt averaged 33ppg in the playoff during the years when he chose to be the main scorer.

Is that what I did there? I guess I missed it because I thought I was merely answering your question.

see thats where you are mistaken. first of all i do not ask questions, because i know all the answers, so there is no need for me to be asking questions. that should've been your first query as to "is this a real question"? and secondly, the question i proposed was of the rhetorical nature, for obvious reasons. for example: none of those teams michael jordan faced will ever have close to as many people in the hall of fame as those celtics had.

You asked how many HoF players did Jordan have to go through on one team, right? By mentioning the possibility of the Hawks having multiple HoFers I guess I didnt realize that meant they would be right up there next to the Celtics dynasty.

destroyed

Next time try to remember where the conversation stemmed from before you make assumptions

i don't make assumptions, i don't assume anything, and i don't make mistakes. i see you're new around here..well i'll give you the heads up - if you see me post, from now on you will know that it is pure fact. nothing more.

..."Thats about enough out of you."

destroyed

[cdbleb]

i've already destroyed this. playoff games after he chose to stop scoring = 108. playoff gamed before he choose to stop scoring = 52. wilt averaged 33ppg in the playoff during the years when he chose to be the main scorer.

see thats where you are mistaken. first of all i do not ask questions, because i know all the answers, so there is no need for me to be asking questions. that should've been your first query as to "is this a real question"? and secondly, the question i proposed was of the rhetorical nature, for obvious reasons. for example: none of those teams michael jordan faced will ever have close to as many people in the hall of fame as those celtics had.

destroyed

i don't make assumptions, i don't assume anything, and i don't make mistakes. i see you're new around here..well i'll give you the heads up - if you see me post, from now on you will know that it is pure fact. nothing more.

destroyed

Ok so allow me to make sure I got this right...You dont ask questions, you dont make assumptions, and you only post fact, right?

How is it posting "fact" by quoting something I said then simply responding with "destroyed"? The FACT that you just responded with nothing on topic and only wanted to ASSUME that anything you were saying was worth while just further proved my initial thought that you are full of sh*t.

[Shep]

Ok so allow me to make sure I got this right...You dont ask questions, you dont make assumptions, and you only post fact, right?

this is correct

How is it posting "fact" by quoting something I said then simply responding with "destroyed"? The FACT that you just responded with nothing on topic and only wanted to ASSUME that anything you were saying was worth while just further proved my initial thought that you are full of sh*t.

how am i responding with nothing on topic? every one of my posts has been on topic. i responded to one of your quotes with "destroyed" because those details had already been dealt with accordingly in the previous paragraph.

[Rasheed1]

Wilt Chamberlain