NBA General Discussions | Lakers Trade Ideas/FA Discussions

[tamaraw08]

I don't understand why you still don't get this. Let's say for example, the Lakers did have interest in Greg Monroe. Let's say they offered him a contract. If he accepted it, the Pistons would match and Monroe would be stuck there. Right now it doesn't look like he wants to stay so he would have been stuck in Detroit. So it would have taken a sign and trade. The Lakers have nobody Detroit wants. It's very simple. They weren't going to let him just walk this past off season. They were willing to let him become completely unrestricted this off season since they are still the team that can offer him the most.

Detroit already had a 59 million payroll before making that measly 5.4 million offer to Monroe, I just can't imagine them easily matching a let's say 12mil/yr offer from the Lakers. But enough of all these conjectures.
Let's talk facts.
1. By not even offering anything to Monroe, Lakers had ZERO/ZILCH CHANCE of getting him last summer. As in nothing, nada etc etc.
2. Even if Detroit matched any offer, Lakers can keep the money or preferably used that money on OTHER WORTHY free agents. It's not like the end of the world for the Lakers if Detroit locks up ONE player. Just like When Jerry West made the first offer to Shaq, Magic matched, then finalized one more to get Shaq.
Riley tendered an offer sheet to Elton Brand, Clips matched but Riley tried again and signed Odom. Eventually he used Odom as a major trading piece to get Shaq.
Dallas tried to sign Deron Will and later on Dwight but failed, instead of saying that's ok, we will try to seduce the next superstar next summer/s, they collected pieces with reasonable salaries so later on they can use them either for their own success or as trade pieces.

[ihatetimthomas]

A bit off the flow of the convo, but did the Lakers even have any interest in Monroe? 12+ million is a lot of money to tie up in their cap. The Lakers are not even guaranteed a first round pick this draft. Why would they want to use up their biggest asset, their cap space? Especially when you might not get a pick. If they signed Monroe to big money and Det didn't match, they are handcuffed next year. The cap space gives them better flexibility. The Lakers will also have another opportunity to sign him next year, and probably have an even better chance as he will be unrestricted. I'm thinking they would want to feel out how this season went and how this years free agency starts before they tie up a lot of money on a non superstar like Monroe. I believe he is looking for max money.

[$LakerGold]

Let's say there's 14 Jeremy Lin w/ the same skillsets & 1 Kobe Bryant on the roster.

Lin
Kobe
Lin
Lin
Lin

Bench:
Lin
Lin
Lin
Lin
Lin
Lin
Lin
Lin
Lin
Lin

This is probably going to be terrible analogy, but ima go through with it. haha

Let's face it, Jeremy Lin is not a great player right now & no team wants him even if there's 3, 4 or 5 of him heading to their team. The only players that probably has a trade value right now aside from Kobe is Jordan Hill & Nick Young, but what are the Lakers going to get from that? 1 Jordan Hill isn't enough to get a player like Rondo. So, get more Jordan Hills in different positions so we can ship them in a package for a player like Rondo. & I think that's what happened with the Mavs. 3 for 1 trades. Jameer is done, but I think he only had 1 year in his contract when the Mavs signed him, so that's why Boston took him.

You can't have a roster full of Lins & a Kobe & Melo/Monroe, that's a 10th seed team. This Lakers team right now is full of Lins & a Kobe, Nick Young & Jordan Hill.

With this formula, I think this is exactly what the Mavs did & look at them now, getting players like Rondo. Rebuilt the team in a span of 4 years. Although, the players the Boston received from the Mavs aren't that great. Never thought they were valuable enough to acquire players like Rondo, I thought it would take a player like Eric Gordon, Jrue Holiday or Mason Plumlee to trade for a player like Rondo - Brandan Wright, Jameer & Crowder. But also, I know they included a first rounder, but that's going to land around pick 25? Idk.

I hope this is pretty clear enough.

[$LakerGold]

If Al Jefferson declines his player option & is willing to take a paycut. Go for it, Lakers.

Okay, this is my last post about Al Jefferson.

[tamaraw08]

A bit off the flow of the convo, but did the Lakers even have any interest in Monroe? 12+ million is a lot of money to tie up in their cap. The Lakers are not even guaranteed a first round pick this draft. Why would they want to use up their biggest asset, their cap space? Especially when you might not get a pick. If they signed Monroe to big money and Det didn't match, they are handcuffed next year. The cap space gives them better flexibility. The Lakers will also have another opportunity to sign him next year, and probably have an even better chance as he will be unrestricted. I'm thinking they would want to feel out how this season went and how this years free agency starts before they tie up a lot of money on a non superstar like Monroe. I believe he is looking for max money.

The irony is that it was DD who really wanted Monroe. I preferred Lowry bec I felt the Lakers badly need a PG. Then I said, ok, if Monroe is really that good, then tender an offer sheet so atleast you have a chance to get him....but I see what you are saying but Im afraid you are missing my point. Ok 12 Mil for Monroe might be too much, wether it's 10 mil or 8 mil, the fact that Lakers didn't tender ANY offer sheets to anyone gave them zero chance.
I like Dallas' idea of collecting assets that are reasonably priced. It gave me the impression that they are ONLY targetting superstars and that they think these free agent superstars are DYING to come here even willing to take discounts etc. I don't know Shaq but I strongly believe that when he came here, he was pleased with the current Laker lineup. They have the pieces etc. Free agents now are taking this as an important consideration.

[$LakerGold]

Btw, why did the Lakers trade Radmanovic for Ammo & Shannon Brown? Did the Lakers initially want Adam Morrison? & Shannon Brown was just a player that they didn't expect to shine?

[COLOR="White"]Sry, so much pssy to remember. :)))[/COLOR]

[tamaraw08]

If Al Jefferson declines his player option & is willing to take a paycut. Go for it, Lakers.

Okay, this is my last post about Al Jefferson.

I like Jefferson too but it seems like productive centers are at the mercy of a good PG to maximize their abilities. If the Lakers don't get one, it'll be the same situation in Charlotte and Utah.
There seems to be a trend of finding serviceable and cheap centers. Plumlee, Lopez, Kantner etc etc

[ihatetimthomas]

The irony is that it was DD who really wanted Monroe. I preferred Lowry bec I felt the Lakers badly need a PG. Then I said, ok, if Monroe is really that good, then tender an offer sheet so atleast you have a chance to get him....but I see what you are saying but Im afraid you are missing my point. Ok 12 Mil for Monroe might be too much, wether it's 10 mil or 8 mil, the fact that Lakers didn't tender ANY offer sheets to anyone gave them zero chance.
I like Dallas' idea of collecting assets that are reasonably priced. It gave me the impression that they are ONLY targetting superstars and that they think these free agent superstars are DYING to come here even willing to take discounts etc. I don't know Shaq but I strongly believe that when he came here, he was pleased with the current Laker lineup. They have the pieces etc. Free agents now are taking this as an important consideration.

No actually my point is that maybe the Lakers just had no interest in tying up money on him this season based on the reasons I stated above. I am not trying to get into the debate you and dd24 are having. I believe it is better off to wait and see this year esp if they might not get a pick. I get that they had 0 chance of getting him without offering him any deal but its been pretty clear that he would not be accepting 8mil/year. Lakers obv have more inside intel, if they could get him extremely cheap, I am sure they would have. What I think is that they know how much he wants and simply are not willing to pay up, at least for this year.

Dallas did a good job acquiring assets at a low price, but that would not have been the case with Monroe as he would have come at a high price, even if Det didnt decide to match (which I believe they would have).

[gts]

A bit off the flow of the convo, but did the Lakers even have any interest in Monroe?

no... they were already heavy with power forwards

added even if they did need another PF they don't want long term contracts at this time.. they purposely have avoided taking on contracts that tie their hands to keep cap space clear for a couple summers so any signings that will cut into that are going to be for a player they really feel will change things for the better long term..

not saying if it's a good or bad plan but it's the plan they have staked out and to do anything that would deviate from it would be dumb at this time.. even bad plans need a chance to prove themselves as actually being a bad idea

We're one year into a ground up rebuild, it's going to take time under the current climate created by the CBA but it is what it is....

the old way of doing business is done and gone, they can't just go signing guys and jettisoning them if they don't work out. the price of even a couple bad mid range contracts is way too high...

[$LakerGold]

I like Jefferson too but it seems like productive centers are at the mercy of a good PG to maximize their abilities. If the Lakers don't get one, it'll be the same situation in Charlotte and Utah.
There seems to be a trend of finding serviceable and cheap centers. Plumlee, Lopez, Kantner etc etc

But that's always been Kobe's bread and butter. People say the Lakers needed a PG, despite having a different coach--they did get one in Ramon Sessions & everything turned into a sh*thole. On the side, it was always Kobe running P&R's with Pau, it's that balance in the lineup & both of them loved that.

You may not be able to put Kobe in all that work, but I think it'll take a star to get Kobe to really change his game & to be able to run smoothly with a PG on the court. Steve Nash & Sessions didn't do anything for him.

I think Kobe's not taking part of this new school system/trend, it looks like, & with that, I'm a huge fan of a SG & a PF/C working together, it's nostalgic, like real stars, real players who knows how to work the post, so that's why I want the Lakers to sign solid high/low post players. I really do think that Kobe will thrive off of this. I mean, why go for cheap centers when you can get a big Al this offseason? He's a post player, he'll be fine with Kobe.

@tamaraw, if everything goes perfectly for you, what would your roster look like in a year or two?

[tamaraw08]

But that's always been Kobe's bread and butter. People say the Lakers needed a PG, despite having a different coach--they did get one in Ramon Sessions & everything turned into a sh*thole. On the side, it was always Kobe running P&R's with Pau, it's that balance in the lineup & both of them loved that.

You may not be able to put Kobe in all that work, but I think it'll take a star to get Kobe to really change his game & to be able to run smoothly with a PG on the court. Steve Nash & Sessions didn't do anything for him.

I think Kobe's not taking part of this new school system/trend, it looks like, & with that, I'm a huge fan of a SG & a PF/C working together, it's nostalgic, like real stars, real players who knows how to work the post, so that's why I want the Lakers to sign solid high/low post players. I really do think that Kobe will thrive off of this. I mean, why go for cheap centers when you can get a big Al this offseason? He's a post player, he'll be fine with Kobe.

@tamaraw, if everything goes perfectly for you, what would your roster look like in a year or two?

I will ALWAYS be grateful to Kobe for the 5 rings but I think the Lakers should start planning beyond Kobe esp in 2 years. The Kobe-Pau combo was great esp under Phil but that was then..plus the Pau/Kobe combo was not that great under Mike Brown and MDA and quite frankly, I don't see much difference bet them and Byron Scott....hear that DK! , maybe you could come out of your shell now and yell at me
Teams that are having success right now relies a ton on talented/reliable PGs, from the Warriors, Raptors, Portland etc etc, the ones that have very good talented Centers are barely getting by (Charlotte, Brooklyn)..maybe except for the Bulls but then again they were solid without him last year.
Houston barely missed Dwight when he got injured.
btw, I wouldn't consider Sessions as a good PG, Heck he is playing as back up pg right now.
So for me, Im not against acquiring Al Jeff but I just feel he needs a good PG to feed him the ball and help out in the scoring and set up other teammates.

[longtime lurker]

If the cap goes up 12 million for Monroe would be an absolute steal. Hell 14 million for Monroe is still a steal. Too many people focused on the negatives, it's entirely possible that we could have signed Monroe and he'd play like an all star.

[tamaraw08]

If the cap goes up 12 million for Monroe would be an absolute steal. Hell 14 million for Monroe is still a steal. Too many people focused on the negatives, it's entirely possible that we could have signed Monroe and he'd play like an all star.

Im not sure if want to give that much money on Monroe, yes, the guy looked really good esp the last 3 games.
Interesting discussion at crosstalk-espn 710 radio.
Mychal Thompson says it's more likely that superstar freeagents will stay with their respective teams and that the Lakers should be realistic and go after Class B players and build on them.
not sure if it was Mason who said it seemed like the Lakers just wanted to go after superstars.
Ireland said they should go a different route like how they got Pau Gasol, to look for very good players in a team that are already tied/deeply committed already with their stars, He likes Reggie Jackson.
Sounds logical to me. I like Reggie too, and/or Jimmy Butler or a Dragic etc.
Personally I will go after a PG like Dragic first.

[longtime lurker]

Im not sure if want to give that much money on Monroe, yes, the guy looked really good esp the last 3 games.
Interesting discussion at crosstalk-espn 710 radio.
Mychal Thompson says it's more likely that superstar freeagents will stay with their respective teams and that the Lakers should be realistic and go after Class B players and build on them.
not sure if it was Mason who said it seemed like the Lakers just wanted to go after superstars.
Ireland said they should go a different route like how they got Pau Gasol, to look for very good players in a team that are already tied/deeply committed already with their stars, He likes Reggie Jackson.
Sounds logical to me. I like Reggie too, and/or Jimmy Butler or a Dragic etc.
Personally I will go after a PG like Dragic first.

The Lakers need to get off the obsession with superstars and start actually building a team. The key is targeting young, undervalued players that can develop into starters/all stars. I'd pick Reggie over Dragic. Unless we give Dragic a Kyle Lowry type contract, he's about to be on the wrong side of 30 and you don't want to commit 15 million a year to someone like that. Bulls will max out Butler, but Tobias Harris could be interesting although I do see the Magic matching.

[$LakerGold]

I will ALWAYS be grateful to Kobe for the 5 rings but I think the Lakers should start planning beyond Kobe esp in 2 years. The Kobe-Pau combo was great esp under Phil but that was then..plus the Pau/Kobe combo was not that great under Mike Brown and MDA and quite frankly, I don't see much difference bet them and Byron Scott....hear that DK! , maybe you could come out of your shell now and yell at me
Teams that are having success right now relies a ton on talented/reliable PGs, from the Warriors, Raptors, Portland etc etc, the ones that have very good talented Centers are barely getting by (Charlotte, Brooklyn)..maybe except for the Bulls but then again they were solid without him last year.
Houston barely missed Dwight when he got injured.
btw, I wouldn't consider Sessions as a good PG, Heck he is playing as back up pg right now.
So for me, Im not against acquiring Al Jeff but I just feel he needs a good PG to feed him the ball and help out in the scoring and set up other teammates.

That's right. But, how many times you think they ran the PNR post-PJAX?

I think it was just because of Mike Brown's complicated system & everything else just added up to that, you know, the stress of losing streaks, the struggles, Steve Nash & everything else. But even in under different coaches them two can be dangerous. It's just that I think they could never catch a break. Those two or three years being under Mike Brown & MDA was just a mess. Have them play under a different coach that can impact the team in a positive way, spiritually & chemistry-wise, Pau & Kobe could still be great--not 2010 great, but still up there hanging on to a thread.

Anyway, I was only mainly talking about Kobe & Pau PNR.


IMO, Kobe will be around for 5 more years, I can just feel it. I don't think Kobe's going to retire any time soon. So as long as Kobe's wearing a Laker uniform, he's always going to be 1st-borderline-2nd scoring option for the Lakers unless he suffers another season ending injury or what not that's going to hold him back. Yes, I don't think Ramon Session is good-good, but he was okay, really.

You gotta look into their roster though, Brook Lopez has the same impact as Dwight has to a team, but only a bit worse. Obviously, you have to have the right pieces & those two teams are bad examples. I don't think teams are relying on talented guards because they found out that relying heavily on guards are the efficient way to become successful and/or building the system around them, I think it's because there's not much talented centers out there anymore that could play the post efficiently. You can still be successful by having a front court that can work the post with the right pieces, no one says you couldn't, it definitely showed in the past even when the league has evolved. While I do agree that the league is plagued by f*ing overrated guards, but it is what it is.

There's so much more to this, but I know i'll come off as this pretentious little prick to everyone. haha, but really, just look at Chicago & Memphis, I don't think either one of them are going to win a chip unless they acquire a player like a solid 3 or a player like a Tony Parker in any position JUST TO GIVE THEM THAT EDGE FACTOR.

I know that I've probably made obvious statements, but it is that clear & simple.