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Old 02-27-2013, 06:25 PM   #46
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

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Originally Posted by Droid101
What, you don't have Neil Johnston in your top 10 all time?

That's YOUR bad.
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Old 02-27-2013, 06:27 PM   #47
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

Quote:
Originally Posted by chazzy
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/sho...72&postcount=4

It's different when it's Lebron though, right?
uh oh, are we still awaiting Pauks response?
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Old 02-27-2013, 07:00 PM   #48
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

Pauk just wrote a 2000 word essay, and is desperately trying not to hit submit in order to avoid further shame and embarrassment.
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Old 02-27-2013, 07:07 PM   #49
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundMoundOfReb
Blocks/steals weren't tracked when wilt played so he'd likely be quite a bit higher.
They didn't track TOs either, and Wilt was undoubtedly a high TO player.
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Old 02-27-2013, 07:08 PM   #50
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

I don't understand how LeBron can still have haters despite the fact that he's playing at a Legendary Level most of us haven't seen before. When LeBron's career is over there will be numerous debates on who's the GOAT: MJ or LeBron. LeBron's been improving every season since his rookie year and I can't imagine what he's going to be doing next season.
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Old 02-27-2013, 07:16 PM   #51
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

Absolutely no one gives a shit about PER.
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Old 02-27-2013, 07:24 PM   #52
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

Quote:
Originally Posted by che guevara
They didn't track TOs either, and Wilt was undoubtedly a high TO player.





The game footage from his prime years actually indicates the opposite.



1967 Playoffs vs Celtics (2nd Half)

24 Halfcourt Touches for Wilt
4 assists for Wilt
1 turnover for Wilt
56 offensive possessions for team


By all accounts this (Gm. 4) was a very lethargic & inefficient game played by the Sixers compared to their usual standard. Even if we assume that they played their worst game for every single night of the season, the above stats suggest that Wilt averaged roughly 8 assists per game that year (which is true), & only 2 turnovers. An average of 8 assists & only 2 turnovers is excellent for a big man.



1964 Finals vs. Celtics (2nd Half)

-16 Halfcourt Touches for Wilt

-1 assist for Wilt

-1* turnover for Wilt (which came from what was clearly an incorrect traveling call, even by the textbook 60's standards)

-52 offensive possessions for team



Keep in mind this is against the '64 Celtics, perhaps the top defensive team ever, from KC Jones on down to their MVP Big Bill Russell. They featured aggressive full court pressing and swarmed Wilt in the half court denying him the ball.
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Old 02-27-2013, 07:53 PM   #53
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

Quote:
Originally Posted by PHILA



The game footage from his prime years actually indicates the opposite.



1967 Playoffs vs Celtics (2nd Half)

24 Halfcourt Touches for Wilt
4 assists for Wilt
1 turnover for Wilt
56 offensive possessions for team


By all accounts this (Gm. 4) was a very lethargic & inefficient game played by the Sixers compared to their usual standard. Even if we assume that they played their worst game for every single night of the season, the above stats suggest that Wilt averaged roughly 8 assists per game that year (which is true), & only 2 turnovers. An average of 8 assists & only 2 turnovers is excellent for a big man.



1964 Finals vs. Celtics (2nd Half)

-16 Halfcourt Touches for Wilt

-1 assist for Wilt

-1* turnover for Wilt (which came from what was clearly an incorrect traveling call, even by the textbook 60's standards)

-52 offensive possessions for team



Keep in mind this is against the '64 Celtics, perhaps the top defensive team ever, from KC Jones on down to their MVP Big Bill Russell. They featured aggressive full court pressing and swarmed Wilt in the half court denying him the ball.
based on footage why would anyone even assume Wilt was turnover prone? I've never seen one game during or after his prime - or even in college - that suggested he had "high turnovers" - it's literally just a baseless accusation
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Old 02-27-2013, 08:58 PM   #54
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundMoundOfReb
PER is a self adjusting stat. That's actually the best thing about it. Since the league avg is always set at 15 it automatically adjusts to pace/era and rule changes.
No.

PER has a very singular problem that has no solution.

It's true that it is self adjusting, but it's truly warped to say that all players before 1974 get a 0 for blocked shots, and a 0 for steals. Just to even things out. Well things weren't even then just like they are not even today.
Bill Russell gets the same 0 for blocked shots as Jerry Sloan? And turning that around, Bill Russell gets the same 0 for steals as Jerry Sloan - who was a phenomenal thief.

Players can be measured BEFORE 1974, or AFTER 1974, and whatever value PER holds will stand true.
But crossing the 1974 rules line is folly.

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LeBron is achieving things that have been seen very very few times in the whole history of the league. He is incredible !!
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Old 02-27-2013, 08:59 PM   #55
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

Quote:
Originally Posted by che guevara
They didn't track TOs either, and Wilt was undoubtedly a high TO player.
really? what do you base that on?
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Old 02-27-2013, 09:06 PM   #56
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

Quote:
Originally Posted by CavaliersFTW
based on footage why would anyone even assume Wilt was turnover prone? I've never seen one game during or after his prime - or even in college - that suggested he had "high turnovers" - it's literally just a baseless accusation

On certain other NBA forums it is actually treated as a historical fact. Again, based on nothing.
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Old 02-27-2013, 10:39 PM   #57
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Default Re: Highest single-season PER on record:

just goes to show that stats doesnt mean everything. Its not good to compare lebron to wilt who is another underachiever. Just like lebron to oscar.
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