Kobe Bryant's All Time Winshare Problem

[plowking]

The arguments against Bryant are so terrible and hypocritical. It's like these idiots act like Bryant is the only all-timer that you can make these silly arguments for. Think about Bird. Overwhelming consensus top 5-10 player ever and his advanced stats certainly don't have him on that level. Hell, he doesn't even look better than Dirk going by those all-in-one stats, which just goes to show you how worthless they are. Think about Magic. Consensus top 5 player ever. He doesn't even look like the best player at his position with these numbers. CP3 is easily superior. It's so easy to take certain numbers and try to paint certain narratives with no real regard for context.

Bird has 3 MVP's... Magic does too...

Both have either led the league at some point in PER or winshares. This trend continues in the playoffs too. Not so much for Kobe.

The only time Kobe has ever led any type of advanced metric is WS in the playoffs in 2001 I think.

Not just that, but the raw stats don't really hold up to other all time greats. Well they do, but he is slightly off. Hence why 10th or just outside is a very reasonable and fair ranking.

[jstern]

So how does Kobe compared to his peers. Like Tracy McGrady, Iverson, Vince Carter, Wade, Etc?

[knicksman]

In the end, what players and coaches think is what matters most. They all respect kobe more than bran. As bird have said, if i want to win, ill take kobe over brAn.

[AirBonner]

In the end, what players and coaches think is what matters most. They all respect kobe more than bran. As bird have said, if i want to win, ill take kobe over brAn.

As good as Kobe is I feel like his poverty stricken hairline holds him back. I think with some growth we would see the surge of confidence again.

[knicksman]

As good as Kobe is I feel like his poverty stricken hairline holds him back. I think with some growth we would see the surge of confidence again.

You are so funny brah.

[pastis]

win shares career leader (http://www.basketball-reference.com/...ws_career.html)

Rank Player WS
1. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar* 273.41
2. Wilt Chamberlain* 247.26
3. Karl Malone* 234.63
4. Michael Jordan* 214.02
5. John Stockton* 207.70
6. Tim Duncan 204.79
7. Dirk Nowitzki 196.54
8. Kevin Garnett 191.50
9. Oscar Robertson* 189.21
10. LeBron James 187.33
11. Shaquille O'Neal 181.71
12. David Robinson* 178.67
13. Charles Barkley* 177.21
14. Reggie Miller* 174.40
15. Kobe Bryant 172.73
16. Moses Malone* 167.07
17. Bill Russell* 163.51
18. Hakeem Olajuwon* 162.77
19. Jerry West* 162.58
20. Magic Johnson* 155.79
21. Paul Pierce 149.64
22. Robert Parish* 147.00
23. Larry Bird* 145.83
24. Gary Payton* 145.53
25. Ray Allen 145.08

defensive win shares career leader (http://www.basketball-reference.com/..._career.html):

NBA
Rank Player DWS
1. Bill Russell* 133.64
2. Tim Duncan 105.20
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar* 94.49
4. Hakeem Olajuwon* 94.47
5. Wilt Chamberlain* 93.92
6. Karl Malone* 92.41
7. Kevin Garnett 91.52
8. Elvin Hayes* 83.65
9. Patrick Ewing* 81.42
10. David Robinson* 80.14
11. Jason Kidd 75.14
12. John Havlicek* 74.09
13. Robert Parish* 72.98
14. Ben Wallace 70.58
15. Dikembe Mutombo* 68.53
16. Scottie Pippen* 67.29
17. Shaquille O'Neal 66.36
18. John Stockton* 64.93
19. Michael Jordan* 64.13
20. Wes Unseld* 64.11
21. Charles Oakley 63.34
22. Paul Pierce 62.31
23. Nate Thurmond* 62.23
24. Buck Williams 61.79
25. Shawn Marion 61.27
26. Jack Sikma 60.69
27. Dwight Howard 59.66
28. Larry Bird* 59.03
29. LeBron James 57.14
30. Rasheed Wallace 57.12
31. Dirk Nowitzki 56.89
32. Dolph Schayes* 56.15
33. Clifford Robinson 55.89
34. Dave Cowens* 55.83
35. Marcus Camby 54.89
36. Dennis Rodman* 54.46
37. Moses Malone* 54.36
38. Charles Barkley* 53.91
39. Vlade Divac 52.90
40. Shawn Kemp 52.17
41. Paul Silas 51.74
42. Kobe Bryant 50.53

[KOBE143]

Advance stats are for nerds.. GOAT list should be base on eye test only..

Base on eye test Kobe is easily in the top 5 all time and he's cute too like Curry..

[pastis]

Advance stats are for nerds.. GOAT list should be base on eye test only..

Base on eye test Kobe is easily in the top 5 all time and he's cute too like Curry..

eye test has def. to be considered. but this Dirk Nowitzki hate from navy and pointguard should just stop. its embarassing. they are hating on Dirk, but he is just a top15-17 player all time. eye test, success, stats.

i hate those two biatches for ever

[KOBE143]

you are right. but this Dirk Nowitzki hate from navy and pointguard should just stop. its embarassing. they are hating on Dirk, but he is just a top15-17 player all time. eye test, success, stats.

i hate those two biatches for ever

TBH Dirk is also kinda cute too..

[ImKobe]

eye test has def. to be considered. but this Dirk Nowitzki hate from navy and pointguard should just stop. its embarassing. they are hating on Dirk, but he is just a top15-17 player all time. eye test, success, stats.

i hate those two biatches for ever

Dirk is definitely in that range all-time with his consistency and the 2011 PO run.

[pastis]

Dirk is definitely in that range all-time with his consistency and the 2011 PO run.

exactly. you know, im not saying that dirk is better than KG. Both have advantages and desadvantages. For me, i would take the offensive power and variety of dirk offensive game over KG as a franchise player. and other would agree. other not. thats all. Both are in the rank 14-17 range for me.
but to consistently hate on dirk and question all of his succes and his game, despite the fact never watched it closely is just a fvcking agenda.

hate those two ghetto biatches

[Lebron23]

TBH Dirk is also kinda cute too..

[pastis]

[Lebron23]

I'm laughing because it sounded gay. Kobe143 is a gimmick account.

[pastis]

I'm laughing because it sounded gay. Kobe143 is a gimmick account.

like warriorfan