Who Got Carried more in the finals 2000 kobe or 2006 shaq.

[Dragic4Life]

2000 Shaq > 2006 Wade

Ppl need to debate this shit?

2000 Shaq is the GREATEST PEAK of ANY player in history.

[Im Still Ballin]

Ppl need to debate this shit?

2000 Shaq is the GREATEST PEAK of ANY player in history.

This.

[choppermagic]

Ridiculous question. Even just isolating the Finals, which shows obvious agenda, the refs carried Wade more than any of these options.

Aside from that. Kobe closed out game 4 and stepped up when Shaq fouled out. That was pretty much a breaking point in the series, so in terms of impact, Kobe all the way. He was a bona fide closer for the team, especially given Shaq horrible FT shooting.

And besides, according to all the Kobe haters, if Gasol can have one good game in 2010 Finals and deserve FMVP, then Kobe should have won FMVP in 2000. Both silly arguments of course.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Ppl need to debate this shit?

2000 Shaq is the GREATEST PEAK of ANY player in history.

This... and I would say 06 Shaq > 00 Kobe but both were better players than the finals numbers would indicate.

[Roundball_Rock]

Shaq was the Heat's best player in the ECF. Also:

Miami Heat

2005: 53-20 (73%), 6-3 (67%) without him.
2006: 42-17 (71%), 10-13 (43%) without him. 1-0 with Shaq on the bench (23 minutes).
2007: 25-15 (62.5%), 19-23 (45%) without him. 0-1 with Shaq on the bench (14 minutes).
Totals: 120-52 (70%), 35-39 (47%) without him.

How about the Heat with Shaq, without Wade? Wade missed 7 games in 2006 and 31 in 2007.

2006: 4-1 (80%)
2007: 16-8 (67%)
Total: 20-9 (69%)

How about the Heat with Wade, without Shaq?

2005: 5-3 (62.5%)
2006: 11-11 (50%)
2007: 18-17 (51%)
Total: 34-31 (52%)

We have a 29 game sample of the Heat with Shaq, without Wade and a 65 game sample of the Heat with Wade, without Shaq. The data show Shaq's impact went beyond raw stats. After Shaq ceased to be an elite player the Heat missed the playoffs or lost in the first round for four consecutive years until LeBron went to South Beach.

[Y2Gezee]

Avery Johnson went on record to say that his gameplan was and remained throughout the series, to take Shaq out of the game with doubles and triples, and see if Wade could beat them.

Wade and the shooters beat them, but Shaq still may have been their most important player in that series. Wade was a beast no doubt, but Shaq took the coverage and played within himself. Avery just didn't adjust well

[GrapeApe]

Shaq was the Heat's best player in the ECF. Also:



We have a 29 game sample of the Heat with Shaq, without Wade and a 65 game sample of the Heat with Wade, without Shaq. The data show Shaq's impact went beyond raw stats. After Shaq ceased to be an elite player the Heat missed the playoffs or lost in the first round for four consecutive years until LeBron went to South Beach.

What about in the playoffs? How did the Heat fare without Wade vs without Shaq?

[Roundball_Rock]

What about in the playoffs? How did the Heat fare without Wade vs without Shaq?

Poorly in the 05' ECF when Wade went down. Where were the Heat in the playoffs after Shaq ceased to be elite/was no longer on the team?

Avery Johnson went on record to say that his gameplan was and remained throughout the series, to take Shaq out of the game with doubles and triples, and see if Wade could beat them.

What a "sidekick"! Having the opposing team game-plan primarily against you.

[PJR]

Shaq was the Heat's best player in the ECF. Also:

He most certainly was NOT.

Poorly in the 05' ECF when Wade went down. Where were the Heat in the playoffs after Shaq ceased to be elite/was no longer on the team?

Pat Riley had the Heat in rebuilding mode, gearing up for the 2010 off-season, and sat on contracts. I fail to see your point.


And BTW, here's how Wade faired without Shaq in the 2005 Post-season(you glossed over this),


2005 Eastern Conference Semis:

Game 3: 31-9-6 on 51% shooting (
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7tAwT30Gtk)

Game 4: 42-7-4 on 59% shooting (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lcmgy89_DNs)

2-0.

[GrapeApe]

Poorly in the 05' ECF when Wade went down. Where were the Heat in the playoffs after Shaq ceased to be elite/was no longer on the team?



What a "sidekick"! Having the opposing team game-plan primarily against you.

My point is that in the '05 and '06 playoffs Wade was the Heat's best and most important player. Avery Johnson being an idiot doesn't change this.

[Roundball_Rock]

My point is that in the '05 and '06 playoffs Wade was the Heat's best and most important player. Avery Johnson being an idiot doesn't
change this.

I don't disagree. I just think people make far too much about someone being a "sidekick" without looking at said player's actual impact on the team.

[SamuraiSWISH]

2006 Shaq got carried more. Had bum ass Dampier guarding him, and the whole defense was focused on Flash. Kobe was injured, he had an excuse, yet still won a game for LA single handedly without Shaq even on the floor.

[Mure]

Not sure if this thread is srs, but it's obviously Kobe. Dude was a straight up sidekick at this point.