More impressive title, Wade in 06 or KG in 08?

[aj1987]

Is that really absurd? KG is a top 15ish player of all time. 08 was KG's second best season. Saying a top 10 player of all time only had 3 seasons better than that isnt even far fetched.. Wade is a borderline top 20 all time. Garnett > Wade.

@ KG being top 15. Dude is around 18-23 along with Wade.

You wade stans are relentless. Wont stop til your boy is best at everything.

You haters are worse though. Go back and read your earlier post. You compared Wade to ****ing Arenas.

Also, what are you even talking about. Can you stick to the topic?

[Papaya Petee]

Why are you guys wasting your time arguing with Tpols?

Hes a Kobe stan that hates Wade and nobody finds him credible when discussing Wade.

Anyone with half a brain knows Wade was better.

[tpols]

Yup.. It's absolutely crazy to compare the second best version of KG.. The best mix of his athletic prime and vet leadership.. to the third best version of Dwayne Wade.

Sorry for even thinking KG is even close.. He's only won MVP over prime Kobe Shaq Duncan but Wade naaaah.. It Ain't close.

[JellyBean]

KG's was more impressive. The Big 3 came together an owned the league from the jump. Minus that hiccup against the Hawks and Bulls (game 7s), I gotta give the edge to KG.

[ThatCoolKid]

This whole all time ranking stuff is so absurd. If you would rather build a team around prime Wade than around prime KG you are a fking idiot, period.

[Dresta]

Is that really absurd? KG is a top 15ish player of all time. 08 was KG's second best season. Saying a top 10 player of all time only had 3 seasons better than that isnt even far fetched.. Wade is a borderline top 20 all time. Garnett > Wade.

You wade stans are relentless. Wont stop til your boy is best at everything.

Get outta here with your contradictory logic and blatant ignorance of the game of basketball. KG top 15? Get ****ing real. As if anyone is trying to make out Wade is the 'best at everything' anyway, only that Garnett's 08 playoff run was massively inferior in every statistical and logical sense that doesn't involve 'OMG the refs' or some other classic fatuity of yours. The only reason you are defending this kind of blatant untruth and idiocy is because Garnett's Celtics embarrassed Kobe, and you're just another pathetic stan with another childish agenda.

GROW

THE

FUCK

UP


Thanks x

[Dresta]

Yup.. It's absolutely crazy to compare the second best version of KG.. The best mix of his athletic prime and vet leadership.. to the third best version of Dwayne Wade.

Sorry for even thinking KG is even close.. He's only won MVP over prime Kobe Shaq Duncan but Wade naaaah.. It Ain't close.

Nash only won mvp over prime Kobe, Dirk, Duncan, Wade, Bron etc.

Ergo, Nash >>>>>>>>>> Kobe

Otherwise why would Kobe IN HIS BEST YEAR still be so far inferior to Nash?

durp..

that is the logic you're using you magnificent imbecile. 2008 Garnett was nothing close to 2004 Garnett, and his playoff numbers and performances in 08 (which were average at best) show it unequivocally and unarguably. Stop arguing against the patently obvious because it is making you look a right fucking fool.

[LEFT4DEAD]

Not sure how this thread went 6 pages long. Garnett was not even FMVP the year he won his ring, and you are comparing him with Wade, who led the Heat who were the underdogs big time against Dallas, from 0-2 to 4-2 averaging 34 ppg? There is no comparison here. Garnett was never in his career able to do what Wade did in 2006.

[tpols]

Nash only won mvp over prime Kobe, Dirk, Duncan, Wade, Bron etc.

Ergo, Nash >>>>>>>>>> Kobe

Otherwise why would Kobe IN HIS BEST YEAR still be so far inferior to Nash?

durp..

that is the logic you're using you magnificent imbecile. 2008 Garnett was nothing close to 2004 Garnett, and his playoff numbers and performances in 08 (which were average at best) show it unequivocally and unarguably. Stop arguing against the patently obvious because it is making you look a right fucking fool.

Listen here you silly nancy chuffer! I say, you do have your facts in a quite the pickle!


To your first point.. Everyone knows kgs MVP was a bona-fide best player in the league award and not just an MVP of the Nash/Iverson/rose variety. Now you Quit your fagging around good sir!

To your second point. KG had the most efficient year of his career in 2008.. It was the only year in his prime he led the league in playoff and regular season defensive rating. He was given full reign as Boston defensive leader as he didn't have to focus on offense as heavily as when he was carrying shit teams in minny.. And it allowed him to have one of the most dominant defensive runs (along with being a 20+ppg scorer and double digit rebounder/great high post passer) in the past few decades. The 'stats' you've examined are mere surface information and don't capture the above.

Good day to you!

[CJ Mustard]

tpols educating these suckas!

KG's defensive impact can not be measured by basic/standard stats. The guy was Russell-like defensively all while being a consistent 20/10 player. He was dominant that year and would have netted another MVP trophy if he didn't get injured midseason.

Wish there more posters on this site who could analyze/interpret impact on the game on a deeper level like me and tpols.

[T_L_P]

tpols educating these suckas!

KG's defensive impact can not be measured by basic/standard stats. The guy was Russell-like defensively all while being a consistent 20/10 player. He was dominant that year and would have netted another MVP trophy if he didn't get injured midseason.

Wish there more posters on this site who could analyze/interpret impact on the game on a deeper level like me and tpols.

I feel like I do, and I think Wade's 06 Playoffs was better than KG's 08 Playoffs -- even more so when you consider how much weaker his team was, and the fact that his team didn't go to a game 7, while KG's team had two 7 game series, against a 37 win team and a 45 win team.

KG's regular season was definitely better (he was my second choice for MVP behind Paul). But just compare their Playoff production:

20/11/3/1/1 for KG on .542 TS%
28/6/6/2/1/ for Wade on .593 TS%

KG's defensive impact was so big that the two are almost inseparable. However, I trust 06-10 Wade in a Playoff run more than I do KG, because KG shooting 43% in a series and taking bad shots is bound to happen at least once (it basically happened in the Finals), and if he doesn't have such a strong cast behind him, it almost guarantees a Playoff exit.

Wade's bogus FTs in the Finals is definitely something to consider though. It's an interest comparison either way.

[mehyaM24]

KG's defensive impact was so big that the two are almost inseparable. However, I trust 06-10 Wade in a Playoff run more than I do KG, because KG shooting 43% in a series and taking bad shots is bound to happen at least once (it basically happened in the Finals), and if he doesn't have such a strong cast behind him, it almost guarantees a Playoff exit.

this post doesn't make sense. on one end, you claim kg's defensive impact was "big" and then then a few words later, talk about his FG% in a couple bad series. are you conveniently ignoring his rebounding, defense and passing?

we shouldn't be talking about casts either, because kg with the spurs wins at least 5 titles (he is more versatile and skilled than duncan).

[T_L_P]

this post doesn't make sense. on one end, you claim kg's defensive impact was "big" and then then a few words later, talk about his FG% in a couple bad series. are you conveniently ignoring his rebounding, defense and passing?

we shouldn't be talking about casts either, because kg with the spurs wins at least 5 titles (he is more versatile and skilled than duncan).

A balance needs to be struck between the two. In every year KG made the Playoffs from 98-08 he had have a very inefficient series -- which usually spelt the end of his season.

Imagine if the Celtics didn't have an offensive weapon like Allen (.708 TS% in the Finals) and they were facing a tougher opponent (08 Lakers were weak, Pau didn't have the 09-10 impact). They'd have lost. KG was always the defensive anchor on his teams but he didn't succeed (04 and 08) until there were two other great offensive options (in 08 he was the third best offensive piece). That's not easy to find.

Of course I can talk about casts you idiot. We're debating KG and Wade. Why is Duncan's name even being mentioned?

at "versatility". History has shown that the greatest players are the ones who are dominant in a few areas. Not the ones who are good in a bunch of them.

Speaking of casts, the 09 Celtics (weaker than the 08 version) won a fcking Playoff series without KG, their best player, and they took the eventual Finalist, a 59 win Orlando team, to 7 games. I have every right to talk about casts here, because whenever Duncan's missed the Playoffs (2000), or played like shit (2010 WCSF, 2011), the Spurs have crashed out of the Playoffs (sweep, loss to 8th seed).

Why am I even debating with a troll? You call fat Shaq and his beastly 13/10 on .532 TS% the most valuable player on a title team. His own teammate scored nearly 3 times as many points as him in a series. And he was still near his prime.

[mehyaM24]

A balance needs to be struck between the two. In every year KG made the Playoffs from 98-08 he had have a very inefficient series -- which usually spelt the end of his season.

Imagine if the Celtics didn't have an offensive weapon like Allen (.708 TS% in the Finals)

at "versatility". History has shown that the greatest players are the ones who are dominant in a few areas. Not the ones who are good in a bunch of them.

Speaking of casts, the 09 Celtics (weaker than the 08 version) won a fcking Playoff series without KG, their best player, and they took the eventual Finalist, a 59 win Orlando team, to 7 games.

kg being "somewhat inefficient" in a FEW series had nothing to do with minnesota losing. kg just never had the fortune of playing with the GOAT coach and multple HOFers like your boy.

posting allen's shooting percentages don't mean anything. his scoring was average at best. allen by 2010 was a spot up shooter.

and yes - kg is: better from midrange, has better footwork, is a better passer and defender, does more with less, and is infinitely more vocal, hence a better leader.

who cares about the orlando series? they were one of the worst finalists in history.

I have every right to talk about casts here, because whenever Duncan's missed the Playoffs (2000), or played like shit (2010 WCSF, 2011), the Spurs have crashed out of the Playoffs (sweep, loss to 8th seed).

2000 had better competition out west. as for 2010 and 2011? funny that you're using duncan playing like shit as a PLUS.

anyone who watched the spurs those years realizes, he played like absolute garbage and was a non factor on both ends. you could argue he was the singular reason they lost those years.

Why am I even debating with a troll? You call fat Shaq and his beastly 13/10 on .532 TS% the most valuable player on a title team. His own teammate scored nearly 3 times as many points as him in a series. And he was still near his prime.

fat shaq? at least i've backed my opinions with stats and actual sources (dallas' headcoach, dwyane wade himself, and miami's teammates). all your posts come off as sensitive and whiny.

what you posted earlier sounded like double talk, and i took exception. no big deal.

[T_L_P]

kg being "somewhat inefficient" in a FEW series had nothing to do with minnesota losing. kg just never had the fortune of playing with the GOAT coach and multple HOFers like your boy.

posting allen's shooting percentages don't mean anything. his scoring was average at best. allen by 2010 was a spot up shooter.

and yes - kg is: better from midrange, has better footwork, is a better passer and defender, does more with less, and is infinitely more vocal, hence a better leader.

No, not somewhat inefficient in a series. Inefficient. He had plenty of offensive help in 04 (20/5/4/2/.521 TS% Sprewell and 17/3/4/.579 TS% Cassell). This was peak KG, and his series TS% goes like this:

.508 TS% in rd. 1 against the 13th ranked defense
.512 TS% in rd. 2 against the 21st ranked defense
.518 TS% in rd. 3 against the 7th ranked defense

And this was with KG being assisted on a lot more baskets than TD. So you can't say offensive help was the reason KG was inefficient and Duncan was not (his least efficient series was in 02 against the Lakers where he averaged 29/17/5/1/3 on .517 TS%. That was KG's most efficient).

Here is Rasho Nesterović on Duncan vs. KG as a leader:

Reporters question:

You played alongside the best two PFs of the last 15 years Tim Duncan and Kevin Garnett who both won an MVP award and a championship ring. Who made a bigger impression on you?

Rasho:

I have to say Duncan. He is a true team leader. Garnett is a phenomenal player with great physical abilities but I don't think he is mentally strong enough to be a team leader. If he would have stayed in Minessota I don't think he would ever win a ring. He did the right move by going to Boston because there is Paul Pierce who is a true team leader that scores in clutch moments.

You like quotes. Go find me one of a teammate, past or present, saying anything like that about TD.

who cares about the orlando series? they were one of the worst finalists in history.

Yes, who cares that the Celtics were able to take a 60 win team to 7 games without their best player.

2000 had better competition out west. as for 2010 and 2011? funny that you're using duncan playing like shit as a PLUS.

anyone who watched the spurs those years realizes, he played like absolute garbage and was a non factor on both ends. you could argue he was the singular reason they lost those years.

If you seriously think the 2000 Suns were stronger than the 2009 Magic, something is seriously wrong with you.

Here is the RAPM for 2010 and 2011:

http://stats-for-the-nba.appspot.com/ratings/2010.html
http://stats-for-the-nba.appspot.com/ratings/2011.html

Garbage on both ends.

He was garbage in the Playoffs. And, like I said, the Spurs crashed out. Meanwhile KG isn't even on the floor and his team is still competitive.

fat shaq? at least i've backed my opinions with stats and actual sources (dallas' headcoach, dwyane wade himself, and miami's teammates). all your posts come off as sensitive and whiny.

what you posted earlier sounded like double talk, and i took exception. no big deal.

Wade had the best PER, WS, WS/48, raw stats, and achievements on that 06 team. But yes, Shaq has the Avery Johnson quote.

LeBron called Duncan the most dominant player of the past 15 years. There's a quote. Surely you must agree? Shaq said Duncan could be labeled the GOAT. Agreed, right? Dirk called Duncan the GOAT PF. Agreed? Magic said Duncan has the best footwork of anyone he's ever seen. The Logo said Duncan has better court vision than a lot of guards.

Damn, these quotes keep on coming.