ESPN: Jordan's Bulls were always favored in the finals

[bigkingsfan]

No shit. We found that out when he retired and his competition all failed.

[Dray n Klay]

LeBron got better stats in the Finals than Jordan


That

[ballinhun8]

Jordan stans damage control recipe:

1 point - alts
2 points - ad homs
3 points - Lebron, Lebron, Lebron

Bringing up LeBron in a Jordan thread. Never fails

3 points!! Baaaaang

[TheImmortal]

Sad. We are now celebrating victims, losers, underdogs and excuse-makers. The question ahould be: Why does no one ever believe in LeBron?

Btw, it isn't even true. The Bulls weren't favored in 91, 93 or 98.

They don't believe in LeBron because he's a loser, beta mentality colluding choke artist extraordinaire.

[Duncan21formvp]

Lebron was the favorite vs Dwight Howard as well and lost.

[jstern]

Faulty logic. If you're the GOAT then chances are you're the favorite. Dumb childish agenda/mentality.

Having said that, I don't think the Bulls were favorite in every Finals. Specially in 98. And still Jordan overcame more odds where in a similar case Lebron would had quit. Like the flu game. Or Pippen hurt in 98.

Lebron was the favorite vs Dwight Howard as well and lost.

Another good point.

I don't think Jordan has ever lost as a favorite.

[Hittin_Shots]

3 points! BANGGGGGG

Just for a day post all your thoughts on one of your alts only. We all know them but maybe if you see how retarded it looks to us you'd stop..

[Elosha]

LeBron got better stats in the Finals than Jordan


That’s all that matters

First of all -- no he doesn't. Not unless you do dopey LeBron stan things like match up LeBron's best 6 stats in the Finals against Jordan's 6 and throwing out those where LeBron shit the bed.

Second, you do realize that "stats" tell only about half the story, right? LeBron literally gave up in many of his Finals games and got swept or lost in five games, in 4 out of 6 final losses. His man won Finals MVP four times. His defense throughout his 9 Finals appearances was generally porous, with notable exceptions such as 2016. A bunch of his "great stats" games came from running up empty points in games where Heat or Cavs were getting blown out, with Lebron stat padding meaningless, uncontested 10+ point fourth quarters when they are down by 15-25 points. Quite often, he was nowhere to be found when his team was getting crushed earlier in those games, when the games were getting put out of reach. It's not so hard to score big in the fourth when the other team's goal is primarily to let the clock run out. Rarely, if ever, will you see a Finals game where Jordan ran up empty stats like that.

As for leadership, the man gave up in OT of game 1 in 2018, just because JR Smith made an admittedly boneheaded mistake. But he sits there seething on the sidelines pouting about it rather than encouraging and inspiring his teammates. He refuses to take charge and plays a listless, defeated OT, wasting his own genuinely great game and taking away any chance for the Cavs to be competitive in the series. That's not the first time, the man gave up in at least three Finals, 2014, 2017 and 2018.

Other than "the block" in 2016, where's Lebron's iconic moments in the Finals? Where's Lebron's versions of Jordan's game tying shot in game 3 against 91 Lakers (hugely underrated shot), his flu gamewinner in 97, his other gamewinner in game 1 against Utah in 97, his huge steal, and gamewinner along with 45 points in 98? When has LeBron ever done anything in the Finals like that? Instead usually he's either getting blown out in the Finals or missing Finals gamewinners and playing tentative in close games.

As to LeBron's supposedly better competition, yes 2013-2014 Spurs and 2015, 2016 2017-2018 Golden State are great teams, (but not the 2007 Spurs or 2011 Mavs, and they still kicked Lebron's ass). Great or not, they usually didn't just beat LeBron's team, they usually eviscerated them. Most of LeBron's final losses aren't even close, they are blowouts, again with a lot of stat padding.

Despite their greatness, you throw those Spurs and Warriors back into the 90's where rugged defense is allowed, and I don't see either of them dethroning the Bulls on a regular basis. The Bulls defense in both of their threepeats was really a step above either the Spurs or Golden State and you can bet that Jordan, Pippen, Harper, Rodman, Grant, etc. would have relished grinding down those finesse offenses. And if you throw the Bulls into today's era and give them time to adjust, Jordan and also Pippen would simply murder the soft defense, hands free, easy driving lanes of today.

Look LeBron's definitely an all time great,probably top 5 of all time. His stats are overall tremendous, and he does have 3 Finals wins and three Finals MVPs. I respect what he's done, but I also take into account all that he hasn't done, and all that he's left on the table. When you make such stupid statements like "LeBron has better Finals stats than Jordan" you just validate what everyone says about dumb LeBron stans.

[Da_Realist]

First of all -- no he doesn't. Not unless you do dopey LeBron stan things like match up LeBron's best 6 stats in the Finals against Jordan's 6 and throwing out those where LeBron shit the bed.

Second, you do realize that "stats" tell only about half the story, right? LeBron literally gave up in many of his Finals games and got swept or lost in five games, in 4 out of 6 final losses. His man won Finals MVP four times. His defense throughout his 9 Finals appearances was generally porous, with notable exceptions such as 2016. A bunch of his "great stats" games came from running up empty points in games where Heat or Cavs were getting blown out, with Lebron stat padding meaningless, uncontested 10+ point fourth quarters when they are down by 15-25 points. Quite often, he was nowhere to be found when his team was getting crushed earlier in those games, when the games were getting put out of reach. It's not so hard to score big in the fourth when the other team's goal is primarily to let the clock run out. Rarely, if ever, will you see a Finals game where Jordan ran up empty stats like that.

As for leadership, the man gave up in OT of game 1 in 2018, just because JR Smith made an admittedly boneheaded mistake. But he sits there seething on the sidelines pouting about it rather than encouraging and inspiring his teammates. He refuses to take charge and plays a listless, defeated OT, wasting his own genuinely great game and taking away any chance for the Cavs to be competitive in the series. That's not the first time, the man gave up in at least three Finals, 2014, 2017 and 2018.

Other than "the block" in 2016, where's Lebron's iconic moments in the Finals? Where's Lebron's versions of Jordan's game tying shot in game 3 against 91 Lakers (hugely underrated shot), his flu gamewinner in 97, his other gamewinner in game 1 against Utah in 97, his huge steal, and gamewinner along with 45 points in 98? When has LeBron ever done anything in the Finals like that? Instead usually he's either getting blown out in the Finals or missing Finals gamewinners and playing tentative in close games.

As to LeBron's supposedly better competition, yes 2013-2014 Spurs and 2015, 2016 2017-2018 Golden State are great teams, (but not the 2007 Spurs or 2011 Mavs, and they still kicked Lebron's ass). Great or not, they usually didn't just beat LeBron's team, they usually eviscerated them. Most of LeBron's final losses aren't even close, they are blowouts, again with a lot of stat padding.

Despite their greatness, you throw those Spurs and Warriors back into the 90's where rugged defense is allowed, and I don't see either of them dethroning the Bulls on a regular basis. The Bulls defense in both of their threepeats was really a step above either the Spurs or Golden State and you can bet that Jordan, Pippen, Harper, Rodman, Grant, etc. would have relished grinding down those finesse offenses. And if you throw the Bulls into today's era and give them time to adjust, Jordan and also Pippen would simply murder the soft defense, hands free, easy driving lanes of today.

Look LeBron's definitely an all time great,probably top 5 of all time. His stats are overall tremendous, and he does have 3 Finals wins and three Finals MVPs. I respect what he's done, but I also take into account all that he hasn't done, and all that he's left on the table. When you make such stupid statements like "LeBron has better Finals stats than Jordan" you just validate what everyone says about dumb LeBron stans.

This deserves to be framed. I don't think LeBron is top 5 but other than that, perfect.

[OldSchoolBBall]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]But in actuality the Bulls were underdogs in the 91 finals due to inexperience, 93 finals, and 98 finals.

They also were the underdogs in the 93 eastern conference finals. You know because Jordan

[SpaceJam]

Exactly, the better team is supposed to be the favorite

3ball actually speaking facts for once! Stacked Bulls against weak competition

[34-24 Footwork]

In my opinion, I think LeBron stans have convoluted two different concepts.

How they feel about LeBron, emotionally

Vs

What they expect from him on the basketball court.


They love his dirty drawers, but what's more interesting is that they don't believe he'll ever win no matter how much talent he has.

Emotion vs practicality.

[Paul George 24]

Jordan has zero underdog rings so he's never beaten the odds

LeBron has 2 underdog rings LeGOAT wins again

REMIND YOU JORDAN NEVER NEED IRVING CARRY HIM

[Gileraracer]

Because winners are expected to win and losers are expected to lose.

Great groundbreaking analysis ESPN!!

Absolutely THIS!!!!!!

[Paul George 24]

Jordan was the underdog (86) but unfortunately he couldn't overcome the odds like LeBron did in 2016

BEACUSE IRIVNG CARRY LECHOKE TO WIN IN 2016