Apparently Mo Williams was an elite shooter

[theballerFKA Ace]

1. MJ
2.Kareem
3. Shaq
4. Hakeem
5. Russell
6. Wilt
7. Duncan
8. Magic
9. Bird
10. Kobe
11. Lebron

He's not top 10 but definitely top 20:

Wheels dusting off the AirBonner alt before season. Looks like it won't even pretend to be a Celtics fan this year

[SouBeachTalents]

I'm looking at the elimination games, he said Mo choked so he made it sound like he was hot garbage and that's why they lost the series, when in fact it was Lebron who put up a stinker in both elimination games.

Mo averaged 18/4/4 with 37.5%3PT for the Orlando series and 13/4/6 in the Boston one, he played well enough as a 2nd option for them to win, it's just Lebron who came up short in key moments. Mo wasn't even a 2nd option in 2010, Shaq and Jamison got about the same amount of shots.

18/4/4 on 51%TS and 13/4/6 on 52%TS is considered good 2nd option production now?

What a fcking clown

[3ball]

.
Mo averaged 18 on 37.5% - MJ won with much worse (especially 96-98'):

Pippen

1988 PLAYOFFS:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 10.0 on 46.5%

1989 PLAYOFFS:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 13.1 on 46.2% (9.7 on 40.4% in ecf)

1990 ECF[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] vs[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] DET:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.6 on 42.8% (2 pts, 1-10 in game 7)

1992 ECSF vs NYN:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.0 on 40.2%

1994 ECSF vs NYN:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 21.7 on 40.5%

1995 ECSF vs ORL:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 19.0 on 40.9%

1996 ECSF vs NYN:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 15.6 on 33.0%
1996 FINAL vs SEA:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 15.7 on 34.3%

1997 RD 1 vs WAS:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.7 on 38.3%
1997 ECF[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] vs. MIA:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.8 on 41.7%

1998 ECF[COLOR="White"]S[/COLOR] vs[COLOR="White"]N[/COLOR] IND:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.6 on 39.2%
1998 FINAL vs UTA:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 15.7 on 41.0%

MJ beat a better team than the Magic with a worse cast:

09' Mo Will ECF:[COLOR="White"].ni[/COLOR] 18/3/4.. 50.5 ts.. 102 ORtg.. lost to [COLOR="Red"]#4 SRS[/COLOR] (2 all-stars)
89' Pippen 1st Rd:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 15/9/4.. 51.0 ts.. 102 ORtg.. beat [COLOR="White"]'o[/COLOR] [COLOR="Red"]#1 SRS[/COLOR] (3 all-stars*)
89' Pippen ECF:[COLOR="White"]rd.[/COLOR] 10/7/3.. 45.3 ts.... 95 ORtg.. lost to champs

* plus 20/5/5 Ron Harper


^^^ Lebron had the far better cast and team defense but lost to a worse team than MJ defeated in 89'.. and Bron was a big favorite/1 seed while mj was the underdog/6 seed..

So Lebron's 09' loss as the favorite was clearly a black mark

SVG said he didn't double Lebron and stayed at home to lock down teammates - this kind of strategy wouldn't work against MJ, which is why he beat a better team (#1 SRS, 4-star Cavs) with a worse cast (Mo > 89' Pip)

[3ball]

18/4/4 on 51%TS and 13/4/6 on 52%TS is considered good 2nd option production now?

What a fcking clown

Why can't Lebron win with his 2nd option getting 18 on 38%?, when MJ won with much worse then that all the time? (see previous post)

What a fcking clown

It's one of the many reasons Lebron isn't on MJ's level.. he needs too much help to win

[scuzzy]

Steve Kerr was an elite shooter

Toni Kukoc was an elite shooter

[SamuraiSWISH]

He definitely was. Just 5-8 years ahead of the curve with the ball handling combo guard 3 point shot jacking. He

[RRR3]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]He definitely was. Just 5-8 years ahead of the curve with the ball handling combo guard 3 point shot jacking. He

[SamuraiSWISH]

Post this on your 3ball account.

What? Bro. I

[LAmbruh]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]What? Bro. I

[3ball]

amazing how he was a nobody before or after Lebron

seems to be a common tread of dozens of role players throughout his career

#MozgovMoney
#LeElevated

Actually, Mo's stats were better the year before joining Lebron:

Mo Will 08' - 17.2.. 3.5.. 6.3..48.0%
Mo Will 09' - 17.8.. 3.4.. 4.1.. 46.7%


So Mo Williams had 2 seasons of 17/3/6 in 07' and 08' before lebron reduced his assists to only 4.1 in 09'.. Lebron's abnormal ball-dominance as a frontcourt player reduces EVERYONE'S assists (not just Mo), so the team ranks low in assists and struggles on the championship level against better-passing teams that massively out-assist them.. 3/9

Ultimately, Lebron's ball-dominant skillset turns teammates into spot-up shooters, which doesn't develop teammates or the team, and necessities team-hopping for ready-made stars and teams.

[RRR3]

Actually, Mo's stats were better the year before joining Lebron:

Mo Will 08' - 17.2.. 3.5.. 6.3..48.0%
Mo Will 09' - 17.8.. 3.4.. 4.1.. 46.7%


So Mo Williams had 2 seasons of 17/3/6 in 07' and 08' before lebron reduced his assists to only 4.1 in 09'.. Lebron's abnormal ball-dominance as a frontcourt player reduces EVERYONE'S assists (not just Mo), so the team ranks low in assists and struggles on the championship level against better-passing teams that massively out-assist them.. 3/9

Ultimately, Lebron's ball-dominant skillset turns teammates into spot-up shooters, which doesn't develop teammates or the team, and necessities team-hopping for ready-made stars and teams.

Mo Williams BPM in the two seasons prior to joining LeBron: -0.1, 0.2

Mo Williams BPM with LeBron in 09 and 10: 2.3, 1.6

Mo Williams BPM in 11 without LeBron: -2.3


Shut up.

[LAmbruh]

Mo Williams BPM in the two seasons prior to joining LeBron: -0.1, 0.2

Mo Williams BPM with LeBron in 09 and 10: 2.3, 1.6

Mo Williams BPM in 11 without LeBron: -2.3


Shut up.

damn, slayed


crazy how Cavs fell off so hard in 2011, compared to the 55 win Bulls with Pippen

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Lebron doesn't get a pass for 2010, but Mo Williams?

Really?

Guy was hot garbage in the playoffs. Even worse, he was the "second best player" on Cleveland

[Hey Yo]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]He definitely was. Just 5-8 years ahead of the curve with the ball handling combo guard 3 point shot jacking. He

[3ball]

Mo Williams BPM in the two seasons prior to joining LeBron: -0.1, 0.2

Mo Williams BPM with LeBron in 09 and 10: 2.3, 1.6

Mo Williams BPM in 08 without LeBron: 0.2
Mo Williams BPM in 11 without LeBron: -2.3


Shut up.

Okay, let's look at those same stats for Lebron and see how "mini-Curry" Mo Williams impacted Lebron:

Lebron BPM 2008 without mini-Curry: 11.2
Lebron BPM 2009.... with mini-Curry: 13.0
[COLOR="White"]..................................................[/COLOR]______
[COLOR="white"].................................................. ..[/COLOR]1.8 increase... same increase as Mo's...

Every other category of Lebron's increased as well, along with 21 wins for the Cavs too - Mo was the only roster change - I mean "mini Curry" was the only roster change.. The stats show "mini Curry" was much better than 19' Middleton and ridiculously better than 89' Pippen.