Matt Barnes: "Kobe > LeBron (MJ and Kobe 2 greatest ever)"

[Hey Yo]

Lebron was ~1 year older and got drafted to a bad team with no immediate pressure to make the Playoffs, Kobe had to prove himself off the bench and it only took him a year to become an all-star, just as same as Lebron.

Lebron has more regular season awards but Kobe was a better Playoff performer when it came to winning championships. Kobe was an elite defensive player for most of his career while Lebron wasn't considered one until his 7th season and that lasted about 5 years. Lebron hasn't made an All-NBA Defensive Team since 2014. Lebron has 6 All-NBA Defensive teams to Kobe's 12, Kobe's an 18x All-Star to Lebron's 15, has led the Regular Season in total points 4 times to Lebron's 1 season in 2008. Kobe's 5/7 in the Finals vs Lebron's pathetic 3/9 record.

Head-to-Head Regular Season records mean very little when most of Lebron's wins came after Kobe was old on rebuilding teams, they played eachother two times a year at best and usually early/mid-way into the season.

Kobe and Lebron were expected to meet in the Finals and Lebron failed to get there despite having the #1 seed in his Conference in 2009 and 2010. Lebron at his peak in 2009 went on National TV and said that Kobe's the better player.

Statistics mean very little when almost all of Lebron's great Playoff runs have come in a watered-down 3-point shooting era where a guy like Westbrook can average 32/11/10 followed by two other triple-double seasons. Is Westbrook a better rebounder and passer than Lebron because of his statistical averages? Is James Harden a better scorer than Lebron because he averaged 36 points for a whole season? NBA has moved away from physical defense and slow-paced half-court offense; an era which Kobe did most of his damage in.

It's almost like comparing Peyton Manning to Tom Brady. Do you care about numbers or do you care about winning? Kobe is unselfish to a fault while Lebron has always played for his stats, as proven below:




If you want stats, Lebron averaged 26 points for 2 out of his 3 title runs and that was in his prime (2013, 2016). Kobe averaged 29 and 27 points for his title runs in 2001 and 2002 and also won B2B titles in 2009, 2010, averaging 30 and 29 points in B2B runs. Kobe's still the only player in history to record 3 straight 600+ point post-season runs.

There's nothing that puts Lebron above Kobe. Your argument is based on media awards and inflated stats in one of the weakest defensive eras in league history.

Kobe wouldn't have had to come off the bench if he didn't cry his way to LA. He would have been Calapari's starting rookie SG from day one if he wasn't such a spoiled entitled bitch.

LOL @ comparing 2nd option Kobe numbers who got much less attention from defenses to 1st option James numbers who got 3x the attention from opposing D's

[tpols]

Barnes said kobe was like a beautiful mind.

people dont understand the nuances of how he broke shit down in the lab...

[Manny98]

Who df would care about what Matt Barnes says

[3ball]

.
Here's the tangible, non-vague weaknesses and reasons Lebron < MJ/Kobe


- sub-par shooting and FT touch

- doesn't dominate the post

- doesn't have a good mid-range game

- only elite with a live dribble

- turnover-prone; 3+ TO for basically every playoff run

- developed "choker" label from a few key chokes, underperformances, and/or losses as the favorite

- lacks killer instinct, "assassin" mentality

- not a great combo leaper - primarily a 1-foot leaper

- bulky physique not ideal for mitigating high traffic or unspaced areas without bully-ball

- turns teammates into spot-up shooters due to his ball-dominant skillset and lack of off-ball game

- can't play off teammates due to ball-dominant skillset

- fields low-assist, low ball-movement teams due to his ball-dominant skillset

- loses in the championship to teams that have more team assists and better ball movement - his teams get massively out-assisted in the championship

- lacks off-ball and catch-and-shoot skillset, so he doesn't fit with other ball-handlers - shooters are the only player-type that excels alongside him

- puts a ceiling on his teams by having a skillset that only shooters can excel alongside

- his rosters have high turnover because his skillset restriction to ball-dominance fits with so few player-types (shooters)

- nobody wants to play with him because they know that only shooters excel with him and he turns everyone into spot-up shooters

- only an elite defender from 09-13'... 1-way player in recent years

- only played at MVP level for 5 years (09-13') - hasn't won mvp in 7 years (since 13')

- his ball-dominant skillset (teammates become spot-up shooters) doesn't develop teammates or teams, so he must team-hop for ready-made veteran stars and teams

- lacks elite footwork/fakes, which limits repertoire and the ways he can get off a jumper compared to Kobe or MJ

- not a pure scorer and naturally a low-volume shooter because of it - i.e. limited repertoire/footwork/fakes and also passive/non-aggressive nature

- shoots poorly when forced to undertake high volume, due to the greater jumpshooting required, and the aforementioned limitations on repertoire/footwork/fakes

- Doesn't command double-teams due to lack of pure shooting or scoring, so defenses can stay at home and.lock down teammates (Stan Van Gundy's strategy in the 09' ECF)

[superduper]

Who df would care about what Matt Barnes says

What about what FMVP Andre Iguodala says?

https://twitter.com/Irv_Do/status/11...uard-reactions

[StrongLurk]

If Kobe is the second best ever then why is his resume AND his stats so underwhelming compared to one, MJ himself, and two, the rest of the top 8-10 other players?

You can talk about how skilled Kobe was all you want (he was a great athlete too), but his career in the actual basketball games was not the 2nd best ever.

[FKAri]

West, Kareem, Magic, Oscar, Bird:
Lebron > Kobe
Kobe stans: "Ya but what do Matt Barnes and MJ's son say?"

[Doranku]

Durant had one season with Westbrook/Harden when they were both elite players and lost to Lebron/the Heat in the finals which was a really good team. Durant in those finals was better than most of Kobe's finals performances.

It is a different era for top heavy teams compared to the lackluster late 90's/early 2000s for top heavy teams.

Those 00-02 Lakers wouldn't have beat the 2012 Miami Heat either because while Shaq and 01/02 Kobe were elite, the rest of the Lakers were not.

Durant's first 8 years in the league were better than Kobe's first 8 years, which means Durant would have won at least 4 rings with Shaq 96-04.

Durant got outplayed by Westbrook in the WCF during his MVP year. Imagine if Kobe lost to the Spurs in '08 while getting outplayed by Gasol.

[VictorMosquito]

OP got em DANCIN

[superduper]

And.... anotha one.

[SpaceJam]

Barnes couldn't even stop DFish from running through the mother of his children, pass. Bring me something more tangible

[brutalBBQ]

Matt Barnes comes off like that try hard guy from high school that was into hip hop and smoked weed because he copied everything he studied from The Source magazine.

[ImKobe]

Kobe wouldn't have had to come off the bench if he didn't cry his way to LA. He would have been Calapari's starting rookie SG from day one if he wasn't such a spoiled entitled bitch.

LOL @ comparing 2nd option Kobe numbers who got much less attention from defenses to 1st option James numbers who got 3x the attention from opposing D's

So a 17 y.o had the power to just force his way to the Lakers by himself? It's like Jerry West had nothing to do with wanting Kobe on his team after he had impressed him in workouts. Players just choose to go wherever they want, even as teenagers with late-lottery projections.

2nd options apparently lead their teams in shot attempts, assists and minutes

Oh yes, Kobe received 3x less defensive attention in one of the toughest defensive eras compared to Lebron playing in the weakest defensive era since the 60s.

[LAmbruh]

Add Matt Barnes to that exclusive collection of

-Stephen Jackson
-Kenyon Martin

[LAL]

Barnes couldn't even stop DFish from running through the mother of his children, pass. Bring me something more tangible

Delonte West