1994 Bulls (w/ Jordan) vs. 1994 Rockets

[Soundwave]

I actually think the '94 Bulls w/Jordan hypothetically might've been the best Bulls team ever.

Jordan + Pippen + Grant + a maturing Armstrong + Kukoc as well?

[millwad]

I'll definitely watch it when I get time. Your channel is like NBA TV, only better.


I had to respond to this. IMO, reason #2 Houston can potentially win is Robert Horry. I'm serious when I say this.

I've maintained this guy is one of the more underrated players in the last 20 years. Early in his career, he was getting comparisons with ..... you named it. Scottie Pippen. The length, versatility, the defense, high flying dunks. He didn't quite have his playmaking, ball handling or slashing though he'd drive on occasion and have a huge dunk out of nowhere.

I'm not saying he's as good. But Horry can nullify a lot of Pippen's advantages in a playoff series because he's a player in the similar mold.

In the 1995 finals, Horry was matched up with Grant. Horry said every newspaper he read gave an edge to Grant; he took that as offense just like he took the Rockets trading him to Detroit as offense. After the finals ended and Horry had thoroughly outplayed him, Grant compared him to Pippen for his ability to impact the game in different ways and wreak havoc on the floor. Horry had a steals record that series IIRC similar instincts like Pippen in the passing lane.

You saw some of his defensive versatility against the Suns too when he was assigned Barkley in 1995.

http://www.nytimes.com/1995/06/13/sp...anted=2&src=pm



Now, Horry didn't quite pan out. He was never the same player after the Rockets traded him to PHX and he had the towel incident with Ainge and became a bench player in LA. But Horry was much more than a clutch shooter in his Houston days than what he's perceived as now.

I'm not putting much emphasis in these but you can see it in some of those season games, Horry and Scottie nearly cancel each other out.


I've never actually heard about this but I wouldn't be surprised if Horry patterned his game after Pippen.

Great comment!
Watching Horry from the back-to-backs really gave me a feeling that he'd become a much better player then what he did. He really looked like someone with great potential, really all-round and for his height he had great handles, he also was really athletic and his shooting and chutchness was just top notch.

Sure, his career was a great one with alot of rings but I totally agree with you regarding his potential when he played for the Rockets.

[Harison]

On paper Bulls are better, and I usually dont bet against Jordan in the post-season However If anyone can match Jordan's insane Playoffs impact, its Hakeem, even more - a big man of such caliber can impact game in more ways than wing. Plus Rockets matched up Bulls well, and often had an edge over them, plus Jordan (who didnt feared anyone... feared Rockets, much like Magic feared Bird).

Bottom line, I give Bulls 60:40 edge, but it definitely wouldnt be one sided, either way. Battle of the Titans

[swi7ch]

I've simulated the Bulls vs Rockets in NBA 2K12 at least 12x and the Rockets always lose.

[NugzHeat3]

Michael Jordan analyzes Hakeem's career from start-present (present as in when the article was written). Article from November 1995.

SAN ANTONIO - The torch has been passed.
Michael Jordan is no longer the greatest player in the NBA. Jordan might be the highest-scoring and the most-recognizable player in the game, but the honor of greatest player belongs to the Rockets' Hakeem Olajuwon.

Sure, you're bound to get an argument from the fans of Jordan, the player who for so many years has provided the yardstick by which greatness is measured. And they would have plenty of ammunition, too, because the NBA record book looks almost like a page out of his resume.

Jordan's fans could point to his career 32.2 scoring average, the highest in NBA history. They could talk about Jordan's seven straight scoring titles, which tied Wilt Chamberlain's NBA record. It was a run that was only interrupted by Jordan's self-imposed 11/2-year exile to chase the dream of professional baseball. They could mention his seven straight first-team All-NBA honors, his six straight All-Defense first teams, his three Most Valuable Player awards, his two Olympic gold medals and three NBA championships.

All good arguments. But the endorsement for Olajuwon comes from the most unimpeachable source - Jordan.

"Hakeem is the best," Jordan said. "He's constantly trying to elevate his game to where he's not predictable, which is a sign of greatness. He's added a lot of different moves over the years. He eludes the double team and the triple team and finds a way to beat them. He's willing to kick (the ball) out or do whatever he has to do to win, and yet still knows how to shine.

"That's when you finally understand the game. It's not really the physical aspect of the game, it's more the mental - how to apply what you've learned to whatever situation. How to get yourself going, get yourself to where you need to dominate the game, or not dominate the game. I think he's learned that part and understands it very well.

"He's what I consider to be a late bloomer - you started to see his talent evolve, he refined it, improved it and sharpened it. Now he's a diamond, and he has very little polishing left to do on his game. He's worked on it so much because I think he has an appetite to improve. He's the best today."

There is no false modesty in Jordan's words. He is not trying to shift the onus of greatness, and subsequent media attention, on Olajuwon, who has led the Rockets to two straight NBA championships. Not by any means. No, Jordan merely thinks Olajuwon, who has led the Rockets to two straight NBA championships, is a cut above himself and other players such as Chicago teammate Scottie Pippen, Orlando's Shaquille O'Neal and Charles Barkley of Phoenix.

The difference? Stereotype-shattering versatility.

"Everyone says Hakeem's the best center in the game, but that's bull," Jordan, 32, said, pausing slightly before that (almost) trademark smile crossed his face. "He's not a center. He's a small forward playing center. You don't find that in this game, especially as successfully as he does it. Hakeem is the best. It took them (Rockets management) a while to understand that this guy is a very unique evolution in the game.

"A center, at least what I've always envisioned, is a guy who can't move well, who's right there in the paint - Artis Gilmore or Wilt Chamberlain. But Hakeem gets out on the perimeter and steals the ball, rebounds the ball, shoots it from 15 feet while facing up, can shoot it on isolations from the perimeter. And those shake moves.

"Those are things centers could never do."

Jordan is among the best qualified to pass judgment on Olajuwon's career. They entered the league the same year, Olajuwon as the No. 1 pick in the 1984 draft and Jordan the third selection, right after the Portland Trail Blazers (to their eternal regret) chose Sam Bowie. Olajuwon's ascension to top pro prospect that year was nothing short of amazing, Jordan said, considering his first glance at the player then known as Akeem Abdul Olajuwon was anything less than impressive.

Olajuwon, then a sophomore, came off the bench for two points and six rebounds in the University of Houston's 68-63 loss to North Carolina in the semifinals of the 1982 Final Four. Jordan, then a freshman, scored 18 points in the game, and then two nights later hit the game-winner against Georgetown that gave the Tar Heels a one-point victory and the NCAA championship.

"When I first saw Hakeem, it was when we played them (UH) in the Final Four," Jordan said. "He didn't even start and he was stumbling all over the place. The next two years he took his team to the (NCAA) Finals, and he was the focal point. Sure, they had Michael Young and those guys, but Hakeem was competing with (Georgetown's) Patrick Ewing and all those other centers for an identity.

"By the time '84 came, he was the No. 1 draft pick (in the NBA draft), which was my year. He came a long way in those two years."

And has come a long way since. Jordan said Olajuwon, 32, has what few in the league today possess - the will to be great. Such devotion to maintaining a standard of excellence, especially in a league that so richly rewards mediocrity, is difficult to find these days.

"Wanting to be great is OK, but to chase it, very few people can do that," Jordan said. "It's a goal to have out there, but you have to put forth the effort and work to get it. Then you have to sustain it because everybody's shooting at you. At first you kind of sneak up on people. But once you (achieve greatness), there's no more sneaking up.

"You're in a Catch-22 situation, and it's the same for me and him (Olajuwon) because you can't win (in the eyes of the fans and the media). Say he goes out and plays against one of these young centers - if he doesn't dominate, then people want to know why. If he dominates, well, he was expected to. We both have set certain standards for ourselves, so you know what to expect.

"If you don't stay on top, as soon as you start making those standards come down, people start looking for reasons and explanations. You find yourself defending yourself when actually you just had a bad game. So what? Everybody has a bad game. I think that because of the consistency that we put forth, a bad game is not accepted that often, but in actuality, everything can't go perfectly every day. But we don't see that when we're talking about great players."

And Jordan knows all about the pressures of greatness. Jordan had to maintain that level of excellence in the wake of much-publicized events in his life - his father's murder, the gambling accusations and the talk of his runaway ego after The Jordan Rules, a book that gave a less-than-flattering look at Jordan and the Bulls, hit the stands.

The time he took off to pursue baseball gave Jordan the chance to recharge his emotional and professional batteries.

"I needed it," Jordan said. "I felt like I needed that appreciation because I lost it. Just being on top, you tend to lose some of those steps you took to get there. No, you don't really lose them, you forget them. Somehow you have to revisit those steps just so you can understand where you are or where you've been. If you ever get off that and start working your way back up, it's harder than you can possibly imagine. I think it's harder than the first time."

So the torch has been passed. Well, maybe not fully passed just yet.

One gets the feeling Jordan, who always loved a challenge, maintains a tenuous grip, hoping to regain his status atop the NBA.

"I really don't try to make it an individual thing," Jordan said. "I can't control his destiny, I can only control mine. But we're going to be viewed in terms of competition."

He paused before adding a wink and a smile: "I want to be on top. I may not be there, but I know what it takes and I'm willing to work my way back up."

http://www.chron.com/CDA/archives/ar...d=1995_1309857

[NugzHeat3]

The Dream against the Bulls in late 1992.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-FbhBM9uvU

Look at the versatility.

[Da_Realist]

A numbers comparison doesnt matter one way or another because Jordan played in the 80's/early 90's while Kobe played in early 00's and deferred to Shaq, and also played on more balanced offensive teams later in his career.

Then you'll have to give up his rings and take your chances that Kobe could find a way to win 5 rings with a team like Charlotte (who drafted him) instead of walking on to a championship contender.

Either way, you keep acting like Jordan benefited from taking practically 2 years off to play baseball when Kobe's legacy benefited even MORE.

*It's likely Jordan would have won 4 or 5 titles anyway. Maybe 6, who knows? It's a better chance Jordan wins 5 or 6 titles playing 14 years straight than it is for Kobe to win 5 titles playing his whole career in Charlotte.

*How many more 40 and 50 point games did he leave on the table?

*It's no doubt his scoring, fg percentage, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks averages would have increased with him replacing his injured and Wizards years with 3 physical prime years. Jordan already owns all those categories over Kobe anyway. What would the masses say if the gap was even LARGER?

[Da_Realist]

Michael Jordan analyzes Hakeem's career from start-present (present as in when the article was written). Article from November 1995.


http://www.chron.com/CDA/archives/ar...d=1995_1309857

DAMN that's a great find!

[Fatal9]

Michael Jordan analyzes Hakeem's career from start-present (present as in when the article was written). Article from November 1995.


http://www.chron.com/CDA/archives/ar...d=1995_1309857

Mentally they are so much alike. I'd say the two most fearless players I've seen. And it's been like that the moment they entered the league...things they were doing by their second years that you're just not supposed to be doing...it takes years of ups and downs and experience to build that sort of mental toughness and they were going at some of the greatest teams ever with no fear at all. No surprise both almost always took it to another level in the playoffs.

And Hakeem's mastery of the game by 1993 is always interesting to me. He played the right way offensively even before, he's instinctively had it, but his decision making from that year was as good as you could get from a scoring center. I feel like it would have happened sooner if he landed in the right situation/coach before who built around him offensively more instead of letting chuckers control their team (mad max, sleepy etc). Also I'd say it was partly because he benefited a little bit from the slowing down of the game by that point too, less run and gun, more about working around and through your star/center.

[Bigsmoke]

The Bulls.

But I think the 95 Rockets would beat the Bulls with MJ in 94 and 95.

[NugzHeat3]

Mentally they are so much alike. I'd say the two most fearless players I've seen. And it's been like that the moment they entered the league...things they were doing by their second years that you're just not supposed to be doing...it takes years of ups and downs and experience to build that sort of mental toughness and they were going at some of the greatest teams ever with no fear at all. No surprise both almost always took it to another level in the playoffs.

And Hakeem's mastery of the game by 1993 is always interesting to me. He played the right way offensively even before, he's instinctively had it, but his decision making from that year was as good as you could get from a scoring center. I feel like it would have happened sooner if he landed in the right situation/coach before who built around him offensively more instead of letting chuckers control their team (mad max, sleepy etc). Also I'd say it was partly because he benefited a little bit from the slowing down of the game by that point too, less run and gun, more about working around and through your star/center.

I find Hakeem's sudden jump in 1993 to be interesting. I can't quite understand what led to it though because I can't see a 30 year old improving that much in one year.

I always thought it was due to a combination of factors. Contract settlement on the flight, Hakeem's willingness to pass, blending in within the team thanks to Rudy T and being focused as ever.

But you might be on to something here because I'm sure you've seen more games than me. But based on stats, I don't think he wasn't built around offensively in 1990. He took more shots in less minutes that year than he did in 1990 plus he turned the ball over quite a bit too.

What I do see though is poor spacing evident by the Lakers strategy of triple teaming him in the playoffs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0v1EWFeA2I
^0:40 mark, game 2 1990 playoffs Houston vs LA. Hubie Brown says LA triple teamed Hakeem 33 times in game 1, basically every time he touched the ball and the perimeter players either shot an air ball or hit the front of the rim. 28% from the perimeter.

I do find it interesting though. Hakeem had the rep of being selfish in the early 90s but then he goes on to take more shots/score more than he ever did and is called a tremendous team player. That rep may have been undeserved.

Seems like Rudy T's offensive schemes were also much more effective than Chaney's.

[QUOTE]At the same time, Rocket coach Rudy Tomjanovich has devised an offense populated with penetrators like rookie Sam Cassell and hair-trigger three-point shooters like Smith and Vernon Maxwell to complement Olajuwon's interior dominance. Catching the ball on the left block, Olajuwon usually has two frothing teammates poised on the arc facing him

[Fatal9]

But you might be on to something here because I'm sure you've seen more games than me. But based on stats, I don't think he wasn't built around offensively in 1990. He took more shots in less minutes that year than he did in 1990 plus he turned the ball over quite a bit too.

Mad Max and Sleepy used to take just as many shots or more than Hakeem per minute in those years (and these were major 25-35 minute rotation guys too). Lot of games are frustrating to watch offensively, just such poor structure. The only reason they were making the playoffs was because Hakeem anchoring the D made them one of the best at that end but offensively, they just had poor strategy and IIRC were usually in the bottom 10 then a sudden jump after Rudy T came in and the offense began running through Hakeem a lot more.

[NugzHeat3]

Mad Max and Sleepy used to take just as many shots or more than Hakeem per minute in those years (and these were major 25-35 minute rotation guys too). Lot of games are frustrating to watch offensively, just such poor structure. The only reason they were making the playoffs was because Hakeem anchoring the D made them one of the best at that end but offensively, they just had poor strategy and IIRC were usually in the bottom 10 then a sudden jump after Rudy T came in and the offense began running through Hakeem a lot more.

Good point. I see that in the per 36 numbers.

Some of it probably had to do with the offense being better with Hakeem out though. Remember when Houston went on a run when he had the eye injury. Those guards were thriving and playing more uptempo, specifically Kenny Smith, Floyd and Maxwell. They probably stuck with that offense when Hakeem came back.

In the end though, you weren't going to win with those guards as the focal point and you saw that in the 1991 playoffs where they got swept. Two games from that series are up on youtube and Doug Collins repeatedly mentions Hakeem needs more touches. Maxwell had more shot attempts than him for the series.

Floyd and Maxwell are the height of inconsistency. Fun to watch when they are on though. Maxwell had the 30 point 4th quarter against Cleveland and Sleepy's 4th quarter against LA.