Mature discussion: 3 rings, 3 FMVPs, 4 MVPs vs. 5 rings, 2 FMVP, 1 MVP

[T_L_P]

Bron has an impressive resume as does Kobe. Kobe should have more mvp awards than 1. Bron could or should arguably have more rings. You won't get a mature discussion out of this thread. And maybe we should wait till they both retire, this topic has been beaten to death already

Which seasons do you think Kobe should have won it?

[JohnFreeman]

Which seasons do you think Kobe should have won it?

Yeah would be interesting to know this. Kobe has way too many defensive selections to his name

[T_L_P]

Yeah would be interesting to know this. Kobe has way too many defensive selections to his name

I mean, I definitely can't give him anything whilst Shaq was there. '05 they miss the Playoffs, Kobe's injured. '06 and '07. . .I don't know. Leading your team to the 7th seed doesn't beat leading your team to the 1st seed, even if your stats are better. '09 and '10 were definitely LeBron's. I don't think Kobe was really ever in the discussion after that.

[JohnFreeman]

I mean, I definitely can't give him anything whilst Shaq was there. '05 they miss the Playoffs, Kobe's injured. '06 and '07. . .I don't know. Leading your team to the 7th seed doesn't beat leading your team to the 1st seed, even if your stats are better. '09 and '10 were definitely LeBron's. I don't think Kobe was really ever in the discussion after that.

I agree.

[sbw19]

[COLOR=Teal]Kobe's been to the Finals 7 times, won 5 titles and was instrumental in winning 4 of them and helped win 5th.

Anyway you slice it 5 Finals appearances and 3 titles aren't as good. If you think otherwise that's fine and all but I don't. It just isn't quite the same as making the Finals 7 times in 11 seasons,, playing in a much tougher western conference no less.

LeBron needs 2 more rings to be in the same league in terms of contributing to winning titles IMO. And yes, he trumps Kobe in the regular season, but winning is the name of the game and the only reason why he joined forces with Wade and Co.
[/COLOR]

[russwest0]

Valuing the MVP award is like valuing the DPOY award. It's voted on by the media so it's meaningless.

[Keno]

Valuing the MVP award is like valuing the DPOY award. It's voted on by the media so it's meaningless.

yet you have your panties in a bunch for durant winning it this year. oh the irony. kobe stans and durant stans can't think straight.

[russwest0]

yet you have your panties in a bunch for durant winning it this year. oh the irony. kobe stans and durant stans can't think straight.

Using the MVP award to troll LeBron stans =/= I value it

[Deuce Bigalow]

I mean, I definitely can't give him anything whilst Shaq was there. '05 they miss the Playoffs, Kobe's injured. '06 and '07. . .I don't know. Leading your team to the 7th seed doesn't beat leading your team to the 1st seed, even if your stats are better. '09 and '10 were definitely LeBron's. I don't think Kobe was really ever in the discussion after that.

So were just gonna go by team accomplishments then?

BTW since 81-82, no player has won the "MVP" without a team record of 50 wins (or a 50 win pace for the lockout seasons). 81-82 is right around the time the media started voting on it over the players. Idk...seems kind of like a team award doesn't it? I mean lets just forget Kobe's 35.4 ppg (8th highest ever) and give it to Steve Nash! Because his team won over 50 games...

Edit:

No player has ever won the award unanimously by capturing all of the first-place votes.[3] Shaquille O'Neal in 1999–2000 and LeBron James in 2012–13 are the only two to have fallen one vote shy of a unanimous selection, both receiving 120 of 121 votes.[b][4] Since the 1982–83 season, every player who has won the award has played for a team with at least a .610 winning percentage (equal to 50 regular-season wins in an 82-game season, except the lockout-shortened 50-game 1998–99 season when Karl Malone won and the lockout-shortened 66-game 2011–12 season when James won).[5]

Until the 1979–80 season, the MVP was originally selected by a vote of NBA players. However, since the 1980–81 season, the award is decided by a panel of sportswriters and broadcasters throughout the United States and Canada, each of whom casts a vote for first to fifth place selections.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NBA_M...e_Player_Award

[Simple Jack]

So were just gonna go by team accomplishments then?

BTW since 81-82, no player has won the "MVP" without a team record of 50 wins (or a 50 win pace for the lockout seasons). 81-82 is right around the time the media started voting on it over the players. Idk...seems kind of like a team award doesn't it? I mean lets just forget Kobe's 35.4 ppg (8th highest ever) and give it to Steve Nash! Because his team won over 50 games...

Edit:


http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NBA_M...e_Player_Award

What point are you trying to make exactly?

[Deuce Bigalow]

What point are you trying to make exactly?

MVP should be more about the individual than the team. Wins matter of course since I wont agree with giving an MVP to a player that won his team something like 25 games. Look at what the player actually did that season individually and give the award to the player who had the best individual season.

[Simple Jack]

MVP should be more about the individual than the team. Wins matter of course since I wont agree with giving an MVP to a player that won his team something like 25 games. Look at what the player actually did that season individually and give the award to the player who had the best individual season.

Most of the time it goes hand in hand. I mean how good is someone's season really if it's not translating to some success? If some dude averages 40 ppg in this era but on the Sixers with their current record, you giving him the MVP? I think you'd have to by your standards. Kobe's season was spectacular, but not good enough in my opinion to call it a travesty that he wasn't awarded MVP.

[catquickspider]

I mean, I definitely can't give him anything whilst Shaq was there. '05 they miss the Playoffs, Kobe's injured. '06 and '07. . .I don't know. Leading your team to the 7th seed doesn't beat leading your team to the 1st seed, even if your stats are better. '09 and '10 were definitely LeBron's. I don't think Kobe was really ever in the discussion after that.

Leading your team to a 1st seed in the west>leading your team to a 1st seed in the LEAST in '09

eventually beating the team in the finals that the MVP choked against as well

Winning an MVP WHILST shaq on the team is a no no yet winning a team WHILST WADE and BOSH should not be questioned right

Not winning MVP cause Gasol was too much help ok but winning MVP despite better help from Wade AND Bosh

[Black Mamba's B]

Leading your team to a 1st seed in the west>leading your team to a 1st seed in the LEAST in '09

eventually beating the team in the finals that the MVP choked against as well

Winning an MVP WHILST shaq on the team is a no no yet winning a team WHILST WADE and BOSH should not be questioned right

Not winning MVP cause Gasol was too much help ok but winning MVP despite better help from Wade AND Bosh

Basically

[russwest0]

Leading your team to a 1st seed in the west>leading your team to a 1st seed in the LEAST in '09

eventually beating the team in the finals that the MVP choked against as well

Winning an MVP WHILST shaq on the team is a no no yet winning a team WHILST WADE and BOSH should not be questioned right

Not winning MVP cause Gasol was too much help ok but winning MVP despite better help from Wade AND Bosh

This. The media completely throws out their usual MVP standards (tough competition, poorer teammates) for LeBron. Shit is sad. He's like the Peyton Manning of the NBA.