Player's Views FAR GREATER than Media's View/Media's Accolades

[ImKobe]

Well for one:

Pippen on Kobe:
To me he ranks behind only MJ among all players in the last few decades.


Even most Kobe fans would disagree.

no they wouldn't

Kobe was voted player of the decade BY FAR

http://www.nba.com/alldecade/vote13/

54% of the votes went to Kobe vs 46% to Lebron, Duncan, Shaq, KG, Nash, and this was before Kobe won his 5th ring, so he's far ahead of everyone, Lebron makes a case with his 3rd ring but his 2011 choke puts him a tier below.

Lebron is a part of the new generation anyways, while Kobe was in his prime he was better than Lebron, as Lebron himself stated in 09. So Lebron is the best player after Kobe Bryant, I agree on that so far.

[LostCause]

For what it's worth, while the OP is clearly referencing an argument from authority, in this case it is not fallacious to do so, as the NBA players/coaches are credible in their expertise for... NBA basketball historically and presently. If he referenced the opinion of someone like say, Peyton Manning, then it would be fallacious, as basketball is clearly not his area of expertise

There are no degrees in basketball history to be had. Players/Coaches as students and then teachers of the game would be your best bet as an authority on it

That said, just because it's not fallacious for OP to do so, doesn't mean what those authorities have to say on the matter is correct. Still has to be proven as anything else would, and the proving thing is where the idea that Kobe> Lebron runs into trouble, regardless of who says what

[iamgine]

no they wouldn't

Kobe was voted player of the decade BY FAR

http://www.nba.com/alldecade/vote13/

54% of the votes went to Kobe vs 46% to Lebron, Duncan, Shaq, KG, Nash, and this was before Kobe won his 5th ring, so he's far ahead of everyone, Lebron makes a case with his 3rd ring but his 2011 choke puts him a tier below.

Lebron is a part of the new generation anyways, while Kobe was in his prime he was better than Lebron, as Lebron himself stated in 09. So Lebron is the best player after Kobe Bryant, I agree on that so far.

Your opinion don't matter, you're not a player.

oh wait, you're Kobe!

[toprange]

For what it's worth, while the OP is clearly referencing an argument from authority, in this case it is not fallacious to do so, as the NBA players/coaches are credible in their expertise for... NBA basketball historically and presently. If he referenced the opinion of someone like say, Peyton Manning, then it would be fallacious, as basketball is clearly not his area of expertise

There are no degrees in basketball history to be had. Players/Coaches as students and then teachers of the game would be your best bet as an authority on it

That said, just because it's not fallacious for OP to do so, doesn't mean what those authorities have to say on the matter is correct. Still has to be proven as anything else would, and the proving thing is where the idea that Kobe> Lebron runs into trouble, regardless of who says what

Are you going to bring up the Media's Trophies? Stats? The game of basketball is not about getting the best stats. What else? Competition. Who had the hardest competition. Help? Who had multiple stars in their prime on his team.

[toprange]

This just in. Another player putting kobe as one of the best. You can chose to ignore it since he is part of the Media now but it just goes to show what players are thinking.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=417861

[LostCause]

Honestly, I believe Lebron is better as his game and superior physical attributes lends itself to having larger impact on the game defensively and offensively

Kobe is the more polished scorer for sure, probably the most complete offensive player of all time, but 2 points are 2 points and while Bron's game isn't as flashy or refined, it's more efficient

Kobe's game, to me, leads to higher highs (See 81 points, 35 ppg average etc) but also lower lows. Bron's efficiency is more consistent. Defensively, Bron can have a greater impact largely due to his physical attributes before you ever get to the other things

[toprange]

Honestly, I believe Lebron is better as his game and superior physical attributes lends itself to having larger impact on the game defensively and offensively

Kobe is the more polished scorer for sure, probably the most complete offensive player of all time, but 2 points are 2 points and while Bron's game isn't as flashy or refined, it's more efficient

Kobe's game, to me, leads to higher highs (See 81 points, 35 ppg average etc) but also lower lows. Bron's efficiency is more consistent. Defensively, Bron can have a greater impact largely due to his physical attributes before you ever get to the other things

And are basketball players really playing to be a few percentages/points/rebounds/assists better than another superstar. HELL NO!!. They play to win it ALL the correct way. They do not cross the line and collude with other star players just to show that they can also win a championship.

[LostCause]

And are basketball players really playing to be a few percentages/points/rebounds/assists better than another superstar. HELL NO!!. They play to win it ALL the correct way. They do not cross the line and collude with other star players just to show that they can also win a championship.

No, but this matters and it also shows dominance. If you're inefficient that means you're pretty inconsistent by default, unless you mean to be consistently inefficient. Which just sounds bad, doesn't it?

Kobe's not THAT inefficient, but Lebron is quite a bit more efficient than Kobe and while you may say that extra rebounds or assists may be inconsequential that's not entirely true. If for whatever reason Bron's shot isn't falling he can bang the boards or set up his teammates better than Kobe could. His defensive impact would also be greater largely due to his size and athleticism being able to accomplish more on that end.

I'm not saying there's a significant gap between Kobe and Bron as pure basketball players, there isn't, but let's put it this way: If Kobe's shot isn't falling, and Lebrons isn't either, and it's Game 7 of the NBA Finals, who would you rather have on your team to bring home the chip? Probably the guy who can affect the game in more ways than the other guy, and at a higher level, right?

[toprange]

No, but this matters and it also shows dominance. If you're inefficient that means you're pretty inconsistent by default, unless you mean to be consistently inefficient. Which just sounds bad, doesn't it?

Kobe's not THAT inefficient, but Lebron is quite a bit more efficient than Kobe and while you may say that extra rebounds or assists may be inconsequential that's not entirely true. If for whatever reason Bron's shot isn't falling he can bang the boards or set up his teammates better than Kobe could. His defensive impact would also be greater largely due to his size and athleticism being able to accomplish more on that end.

I'm not saying there's a significant gap between Kobe and Bron as pure basketball players, there isn't, but let's put it this way: If Kobe's shot isn't falling, and Lebrons isn't either, and it's Game 7 of the NBA Finals, who would you rather have on your team to bring home the chip? Probably the guy who can affect the game in more ways than the other guy, and at a higher level, right?

All that efficiency talk and you are putting the ball in the hands of 3/7 versus 5/7

[TommyGriffin]

Kobe is more efficient at winning championships.

[toprange]

Bumping to remind ISH who Non Media Players perfer

[Da_Realist]

Efficiency can hide a reluctance to take risky shots and passive-aggressive play. For example, a guy can shoot layups and putbacks, pass off the tough shots all stars need to make, lose the series and then avoid criticism because he was "efficient".

Efficiency can also be affected by rim protection or lack thereof.

No stat should be taken at face value without considering other variables.

[Wally450]

Kobe is more efficient at winning championships.

I know, imagine if LeBron had peak Shaq?

[Smoke117]

Efficiency can hide a reluctance to take risky shots and passive-aggressive play. For example, a guy can shoot layups and putbacks, pass off the tough shots all stars need to make, lose the series and then avoid criticism because he was "efficient".

Efficiency can also be affected by rim protection or lack thereof.

No stat should be taken at face value without considering other variables.

Then it's a good thing we have 20 years of stupid ****ing shots to fall back on.

[TommyGriffin]

I know, imagine if LeBron had peak Shaq?

Imagine if LeBron had Pau Gasol as his second best player?