In retrospect, how horrible was Lebron's Finals?

[Ne 1]

His 2015 Finals is being overrated by some. Other than sheer numbers, which were pretty empty if you put them into context it wasn't all that impressive. His 2012 Finals series was easily better.

Sure statistically, there is no denying how "wow" his numbers are at first glance. But shotting 28% outside of the restricted area is extremely inefficient basketball. Please just take the time to imagine that. 28%. He had the ball in his hands nearly all the time, therefore had all the time in the world to get into rhythm, and yet still shot 28% from outside 5 feet. 5 feet is literally a gather and layup. And when Iggy was draped all over him on the perimeter, he shot under 38% all the same.

Not only that but his fourth quarter performances. Do I even need to get into that? Even in the games where you can tell he was deliberately saving himself for the final stretch (games 5 and 6), he not only played terribly, he got absolutely outplayed by Curry AND Iggy. And the games were always close at some point in the 4th quarter, so they were always there for the taking IF LeBron took his team home. That fact is especially striking to me.

[TheMarkMadsen]

Pretty selfish and full of low IQ bball

Kerr showed that he feared the cavs shooters more than he feared Lebrons ISO game.

Lebron fell directly into the gameplan Kerr set.. Lebron of course refused to change the way the cavs ran their offense which made it extremely simple and easy for the warriors to defend the cavs.

Something else that isn't talked about as much is the fact that Lebrons inability to shoot and desire to have the entire floor spaced out for him to work with made it so that the cavs couldn't play TT & Mozgof together for long stretches..

Basically rendering the only advantage the cavs had over the warriors useless...

[RRR3]

Pretty selfish and full of low IQ bball

Kerr showed that he feared the cavs shooters more than he feared Lebrons ISO game.

Lebron fell directly into the gameplan Kerr set.. Lebron of course refused to change the way the cavs ran their offense which made it extremely simple and easy for the warriors to defend the cavs.

Something else that isn't talked about as much is the fact that Lebrons inability to shoot and desire to have the entire floor spaced out for him to work with made it so that the cavs couldn't play TT & Mozgof together for long stretches..

Basically rendering the only advantage the cavs had over the warriors useless...

Jesus the things people tell themselves.

[TheMarkMadsen]

Jesus the things people tell themselves.

Which part of that isn't true

[GIF REACTION]

The argument against him is that he could have done so much better EVEN though he put up the numbers...

Goes to show you how great this man is...

[RRR3]

Pretty selfish and full of low IQ ball

Opinion, and I disagree. He controlled the pace, which kept the games close and prevented the Warriors from playing their usual game. Also hypocritical of you to call him selfish when you're a fan of a player who plays similarly to the way he played in these finals.

Kerr showed that he feared the cavs shooters more than he feared Lebrons ISO game. What shooters? James Jones?

Lebron fell directly into the gameplan Kerr set.. Lebron of course refused to change the way the cavs ran their offense which made it extremely simple and easy for the warriors to defend the cavs.

Yeah, Warriors had such an easy time in the series

Something else that isn't talked about as much is the fact that Lebrons inability to shoot and desire to have the entire floor spaced out for him to work with made it so that the cavs couldn't play TT & Mozgof together for long stretches..

LeBron can shoot, if you have followed his career. Not sure why he forgot how to shoot these playoffs (he certainly couldn't shoot in these playoffs I'll give you that) but in general he is a solid shooter, especially from 3.

Basically rendering the only advantage the cavs had over the warriors useless...
LeBron was their only advantage you troll

....

[Ne 1]

It was the best/worst finals ever. Shot like complete shit but played hard, incredible, inspiring basketball with a depleted team against all odds

Yeah, it reminded a lot of Iverson's 2001 Finals. They actually both averaged 35 ppg on 40% shooting.

LeBron had a 40%+ usage rate with a 5 foot cushion with isolation, 1 on 1 coverage the entire series and he shot 39.8% from the field and 28% outside 5 feet because his jumper is broken. Not to mention 68% from the FT line. If you play someone like Kobe, Durant or Melo like that, they'll go off for nearly 50+ a night. LeBron's offensive skill set is usually limited to bulldozing and streaky 3 point shooting. If neither one of those is happening then it's going to be a rough night for him.

Also, as usual he's escaping criticism from making his teammates noticeably worse on offense to play up the idea that he had "no help" especially on that side of the ball. But he had a 40+% usage rate in the finals and held the ball for at minimum 10 seconds out of each shot clock when he was on the floor. Tell me exactly who can play consistently offensively under those circumstances? This also goes into inflating his assist numbers too. I am not saying he had great supporting cast, but I am pretty sure if he utilized the bigs on this team (Mozgov and TT), it could've been a different story....

By having the ball in his hands for half the Cavs possessions, he stalls the flow of offense. Shooters like James Jones would normally have knocked down his jumpers. But shooters rely on rhythm, which Jones was obviously NOT in as he missed every single jumper he took in game 6. That's just one example. And anyone who watched his tenure in Miami know that as incredible as he is, his isolation tendency stalls good basketball.

The ball sticks and ends up in his hands. And in the biggest moments, when the ball is in his hands and the game is in his hands, he shrinks into inefficiency. As remarkable as his statistics are numerically, the inefficiency at which he achieves them costs him. We saw that when the ball stalled in Miami plenty of times. Yet, he praised the Spurs for their "Team basketball" after they dismantled the Heat.

[RRR3]

Yeah, it reminded a lot of Iverson's 2001 Finals. They actually both averaged 35 ppg on 40% shooting.

LeBron had a 40%+ usage rate with a 5 foot cushion with isolation, 1 on 1 coverage the entire series and he shot 39.8% from the field and 28% outside 5 feet because his jumper is broken. Not to mention 68% from the FT line. If you play someone like Kobe, Durant or Melo like that, they'll go off for nearly 50+ a night. LeBron's offensive skill set is usually limited to bulldozing and streaky 3 point shooting. If neither one of those is happening then it's going to be a rough night for him.

Also, as usual he's escaping criticism from making his teammates noticeably worse on offense to play up the idea that he had "no help" especially on that side of the ball. But he had a 40+% usage rate in the finals and held the ball for at minimum 10 seconds out of each shot clock when he was on the floor. Tell me exactly who can play consistently offensively under those circumstances? This also goes into inflating his assist numbers too. I am not saying he had great supporting cast, but I am pretty sure if he utilized the bigs on this team (Mozgov and TT), it could've been a different story....

By having the ball in his hands for half the Cavs possessions, he stalls the flow of offense. Shooters like James Jones would normally have knocked down his jumpers. But shooters rely on rhythm, which Jones was obviously NOT in as he missed every single jumper he took in game 6. That's just one example. And anyone who watched his tenure in Miami know that as incredible as he is, his isolation tendency stalls good basketball.

The ball sticks and ends up in his hands. And in the biggest moments, when the ball is in his hands and the game is in his hands, he shrinks into inefficiency. As remarkable as his statistics are numerically, the inefficiency at which he achieves them costs him. We saw that when the ball stalled in Miami plenty of times. Yet, he praised the Spurs for their "Team basketball" after they dismantled the Heat.

[TheMarkMadsen]

Opinion, and I disagree. He controlled the pace, which kept the games close and prevented the Warriors from playing their usual game. Also hypocritical of you to call him selfish when you're a fan of a player who plays similarly to the way he played in these finals.

if you consider holding the ball for 20 seconds every possession "controlling the pace" then sure.. he controlled the pace, and froze out his teammates in the process..

What shooters? James Jones?

the shooters that Kerr chose not to double off of.. he told his players to not double onto lebron and to stay on the shooter.. like.. did you not even watch the series..

Yeah, Warriors had such an easy time in the series

they won the last 3 games in blow out fashion..

LeBron can shoot, if you have followed his career. Not sure why he forgot how to shoot these playoffs (he certainly couldn't shoot in these playoffs I'll give you that) but in general he is a solid shooter, especially from 3.

yeah but he was terrible shooting all through the playoffs, shot 28% from outside 5 feet.. so basically if it wasn't a layup he wasn't making it in these finals..

LeBron was their only advantage you troll

no, their other advantage was the massive size advantage that they had down low.. maybe you missed the game where Mozgof dropped 28/10 and then played 9 minutes the next game because it was fuccing up lebrons spacing..

their biggest advantage was what they had down low.. they were forced to double at times because Green can't guard 7 footers all game.. but they couldn't play TT & Mozgof together for long stretches because of the spacing problems it creates for lebron

try watching the games bub

[TheMarkMadsen]

RR3 keep telling yourself Lebron wasn't single covered the entire series.. shot 28% outside of 5 feet..

these are the facts

[FLDFSU]

When I hear anyone the least bit involved with or experienced in the game of basketball tell me it was terrible I'll start to consider that maybe my eyes play tricks on me. For now I'm going to assume they saw what I saw because of the multitude of coaches players and Hall of Famers who seem convinced he was somewhere between very good and unbelievably all-time great.

Haters on the internet aren't now and never have been worth listening to if you are actually trying to find the truth. You just kind of keep interacting with them because irrational haters are part of the fan experience.

But there is nothing to be gained by listening to people who think you put up 36 13 and 9 against the best team in the NBA with some of the least help to ever play on that level and you played horrible due to shooting percentages when the team literally shot 15% with you off the floor.

A rational person could come to the conclusion that it wasn't as great as the many people involved in the game suggested it was. But nobody trying to be the least bit reasonable could come to the conclusion it's literally playing poorly. Or even average.

Just a gang of people trolling online because apparently pretending to be a lot stupider than you are is entertaining when you get angry reactions.

It's not the "trolls" who are scary. Everyone recognizes what they are.

It's the people who actually believe and start quoting many of the things "trolls" say in the present, and then change their arguments in the future.
Or those who constantly contradict themselves.

Yes ISH is littered with possibly 100 "trolls" but at least half of the remaining population is littered with posters who does the above regularly.

[Droid101]

....

Dude come on. The Warriors had an easy time. Three close games and three total blowouts. That's as easy as a Finals can get without being four blowouts.

[FLDFSU]

....

His entire moronic premise is built on the notion that both teams in the Finals were somewhat equal. He literally just throws away the idea that the Cavs were with out their second and third best players (who they lost during the playoffs...it is not like they had a chance to meaningfully adjust without them).

This is what allows him to talk in absolutes about what the Cavs could have done in order to win.

EDIT: These are the same idiots that told us that teams/teammates get better when Lebron leaves because they no longer have to play "Lebron ball." Yet somehow the team Lebron joins consistently wins more games in the first year of Lebron then they did previous, and the team that Lebron leaves consistently wins less...

[Done_And_Done]

Peak Shaq herald as 'GOAT' finals performer

36/14/3 on 57% TS




LeBrons finals

36/13/9 on 47% TS



Hmm objectively it was probably the most dominating finals performance in NBA History

With the difference being Shaq always came through on the big stag, whereas your baby d1cked boy toy...... Yeaaaah not so much

[riseagainst]

it should have been a sweep if Curry didn't play like garbage the first half of the series.

Iggy definitely deserved the FMVP for holding lebron's efficiency down.