prime dirk vs current durant?

[Pointguard]

Literally stopped reading.

Well, eventually your tutor will increase your hours and then you will get to four sentence paragraphs! As time progresses, you will start putting together five word sentences, and then ones even bigger than that.

[moe94]

Well, eventually your tutor will increase your hours and then you will get to four sentence paragraphs! As time progresses, you will start putting together five word sentences, and then ones even bigger than that.

Can you even begin to defend that ridiculous statement?

[DMAVS41]

I agree that Dirk's actual effect surpassed his statistical output, but it also speaks to his teammates and competition, and how they should be or are evaluated. I don't think Dirk drew the toughest match up in any series that year outside of maybe the Blazers w/ Aldridge, and even in that series Blazers were toast with BRoy broken down and playing like a shell of himself (he had 1 good game). Dirk had guys on his team to hound swingmen (Marion and Stevenson punked Lebron) and Chandler was great in the middle of the paint (lead Mavs in boards and blocks)... so it allowed Dirk to do what he does best (offensive stuff)... Credit to Cuban for building a great team relative to other teams that season, the best team to be exact.

This is absurd. The competition level in 11 was better than just about any year of this era.

The competition, for example, last year...was a joke compared to 11. The Spurs did not beat a single truly quality team. Lucked out with the Westbrook injury. Lucked out with the Kobe injury. Played a young and inexperienced Warriors team maybe 75% as good as the 11 Thunder...and then got a weak Grizzlies team in the WCF.

And then lost to an inferior Heat team compared to 11 in the finals.

LOL at a Spurs fan talking about competition strength...The Spurs have lucked out and played absurdly weak competition in 3 of their 4 title runs...especially in 03 and 07. And getting lucky breaks like Dirk going down in 03...

The Mavs competition to win the title was easily harder than any Spurs year outside of maybe 05...and it was still harder, just not at ton harder. Literally every title the Spurs won was a cake walk compared to 11 outside of 05.

And it's not that Dirk went head to head against those guys...it's that he clearly outplayed all of some of the biggest stars in the game except for Wade.

Whether you like it or not. Dirk outplayed LA, Gasol, Kobe, Westbrook, Durant, Lebron, and Bosh. You think that is easy? LOL

[ZMonkey11]

Right, except for the '06-'07 when Dirk won MVP, oh and '04-'05 and '05-'06 when he came in 3rd in MVP voting. And '09-'12. The Finals MVP in '11 was okay too.

Most VALUABLE Player, not BEST player.

Don't think I'd pick Steve Nash two years in a row over Shaq, buddy.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

KD one of my faves but this is Dirk until KD can win a chip
Dirk led scrubs to finals in 06 and almost won if it wasnt for refs and he was tripled like prime Shaq that series and his scrub teamates choked too

In 2011 he took a below avg cast to a title they gave him defense but offense they sucked without him a injured Raptors team blew the Mavs out at home w/o Dirk

Dirk is better shooter, rebounder, ballhandling
KD is better scorer, playmaker, offdribble
Defense is even

[Pointguard]

Can you even begin to defend that ridiculous statement?

You are on crack if you ever thought he was the premier scorer in the league. So that argument is out the window.

Now what year are you saying he's top tier? In 05 and 09 are the only two years he's top four in scoring. In 09 Wade and Lebron are in a separate tier. They were terrors and just unlike the rest of the pack. Way more creative, way more deadly than anybody else. RS or Playoffs.

In '05 Dirk has his best case but Iverson was 4 ppg higher than Dirk (with Kobe and Lebron 27ish a little over 27) and the second tier had six guys in that usual 24 -26 ppg range - that second tier. The playoffs Iverson goes up a notch and Dirk down a notch. Hard to make a case to say the same tier when its more than seven ppg.

[DMAVS41]

You are on crack if you ever thought he was the premier scorer in the league. So that argument is out the window.

Now what year are you saying he's top tier? In 05 and 09 are the only two years he's top four in scoring. In 09 Wade and Lebron are in a separate tier. They were terrors and just unlike the rest of the pack. Way more creative, way more deadly than anybody else. RS or Playoffs.

In '05 Dirk has his best case but Iverson was 4 ppg higher than Dirk (with Kobe and Lebron 27ish a little over 27) and the second tier had six guys in that usual 24 -26 ppg range - that second tier. The playoffs Iverson goes up a notch and Dirk down a notch. Hard to make a case to say the same tier when its more than seven ppg.

You do realize Dirk is 8th all time in playoff ppg...right? I think Durant is just as good scoring the ball, if not better, but to act like Dirk isn't an elite scorer...is just non sense. And he's done it on great overall efficiency as well.

[Pointguard]

This is absurd. The competition level in 11 was better than just about any year of this era.

It was the incredible year of superstar silence.

It had to be the worse year of superstar play in elimination series ever.

The perennials:
Duncan among his worse for sure.
Kobe among his worse for sure.
Lebron his worse

New stars
Durant below his standards
Rose his worse
Bosh his worse at that point

Wade his least effective when healthy but he was the only one that played competitively.

It was like a they all caught the same bug. You rarely ever see bad play catch on like that.

[DMAVS41]

It was the incredible year of superstar silence.

It had to be the worse year of superstar play in elimination series ever.

The perennials:
Duncan among his worse for sure.
Kobe among his worse for sure.
Lebron his worse

New stars
Durant below his standards
Rose his worse
Bosh his worse at that point

Wade his least effective when healthy but he was the only one that played competitively.

It was like a they all caught the same bug. You rarely ever see bad play catch on like that.

That is giving the Mavs 0 credit. Name the tougher year the Spurs faced please.

[Pointguard]

You do realize Dirk is 8th all time in playoff ppg...right? I think Durant is just as good scoring the ball, if not better, but to act like Dirk isn't an elite scorer...is just non sense. And he's done it on great overall efficiency as well.

To suggest Dirk as the premier scorer in the league like Durant has been, is pure nonsense and you know it. Dirk has always been an excellent scorer but in no way has he been in a tier above all or equal to the best. Name the year you think he has the case. Its that simple.

[Pointguard]

That is giving the Mavs 0 credit. Name the tougher year the Spurs faced please.

That has nothing to do with what I said.

I have said in the past Kidd had one of the best, if not the best, defensive stands ever by a wing player many times, tho.

[DMAVS41]

To suggest Dirk as the premier scorer in the league like Durant has been, is pure nonsense and you know it. Dirk has always been an excellent scorer but in no way has he been in a tier above all or equal to the best. Name the year you think he has the case. Its that simple.

What did I suggest? I merely said Dirk is an elite scorer...on par with just about anyone as a scorer in playoff history other than MJ.

You seem to care a lot about regular seasons. I just...well, don't. Not for all time top 25 or so players of all time. I don't care about the regular season. I want to know what these guys can do against teams that are trying as hard and are the better teams in the league. I guess you value games against the Bobcats highly...I just don't.

[DMAVS41]

That has nothing to do with what I said.

I have said in the past Kidd had one of the best, if not the best, defensive stands ever by a wing player many times, tho.

But it does. You are implying that players just "played bad"...and it didn't have anything to do with the Mavs. Which is just false of course.

But again...that wasn't even really my point you responded to. I said the Mavs faced tougher competition than any Spurs title. So again...what year did the Spurs face tougher competition while winning the title?

Or do you just agree with me?

[fpliii]

IMO Dirk, especially when he got the back-to-the-basket game going. One of the rare truly unguardable scorers in his day.

I like KD though, perhaps I'm undervaluing him here.

[DMAVS41]

And I'm sick of hearing about how the Lakers were clearly done..etc. The Boston Celtics in 08 didn't look good in round 1 at all...needing 7 to beat the Hawks...went on to win the title

Against the Lakers....Dirk averaged 25/10/3 on 57/73/94 shooting splits. And outside of game 4...it was a 50/50 series. As was the case in 11...the Mavs (mainly Dirk) just happened to come up super clutch in close games.

I swear it's like people just ignore the following;

Lakers were up 7 going to the 4th qtr of game 1
Lakers were down 6 going into the 4th qtr of game 2
Lakers were up 6 going into the 4th qtr of game 3

Then the Lakers quit in game 4. It was a sweep, but those 3 games could have gone either way. With the Lakers having the advantage in 2 of the 3 heading to the last period.

It's stuff like that...that is just glossed over. We have to pretend the Lakers just sucked...etc.