Why are people bashing Jim Buss/Lakers organization for the Laker mess?

[ZenMaster]

You're still not answering the question: Did Buss choose the right coach? D'Antoni has never been a coach that emphasized defense and he is also known for promoting smallball with lineups that only used one big. Jackson would get better d out of the entire team including Gasol and would better utilize Howard on offense even with the injury. There is nothing in D'Antoni's history to suggest he is the kind of coach that will get the most of twin towers, play tough D, and pound it inside. If he's not going to get the most out of his team how is he the best coach for it, especially when we can directly point at PJ as the option?

I didn't think D'Antoni was a bad fit for that team, talking about Phil saying he would have forced the ball more inside wouldn't have made Dwights back any better, or Pau any better at guarding players he physically can't.
Plus they did not run anything close to the Phoenix system, there was a lot of flex and stuff in there they had to do because Howard didn't want pickn'roll.

Also, I don't want to speculate on how they practice offense and defense. Lakers weren't good on D with Brown and he was supposed to be a good defensive coach.
Pau was very bad defensively last year for reason I've already explained, Kobe played the most sloppy off ball defense we've ever seen from him and Dwight was never fully healthy.
In the last years with Phil and the one year with Brown Lakers where known as a team people would run against because of lack of athleticism and being old, last season that stuff went over the top along with all the injuries.

[Real Men Wear Green]

I didn't think D'Antoni was a bad fit for that team, talking about Phil saying he would have forced the ball more inside wouldn't have made Dwights back any better, or Pau any better at guarding players he physically can't.
Plus they did not run anything close to the Phoenix system, there was a lot of flex and stuff in there they had to do because Howard didn't want pickn'roll.

Also, I don't want to speculate on how they practice offense and defense. Lakers weren't good on D with Brown and he was supposed to be a good defensive coach.
Pau was very bad defensively last year for reason I've already explained, Kobe played the most sloppy off ball defense we've ever seen from him and Dwight was never fully healthy.
In the last years with Phil and the one year with Brown Lakers where known as a team people would run against because of lack of athleticism and being old, last season that stuff went over the top along with all the injuries.

When everyone is lapsing on D doesn't that point at the coach? Especially one that is known for porous defenses?

[ZenMaster]

When everyone is lapsing on D doesn't that point at the coach? Especially one that is known for porous defenses?

Brown was the coach before D'Antoni and he's supposedly one of the best defensive coaches in the league, he had a complete training camp to get this team where it needed to be yet they didn't look like a good defensive team before D'Antoni took over.

That fact, along with what I know, ie Pau being old and out of position, Howard still not healthy and Kobe sloppy(probably saving energy because of age) would lead me to believe it's not the coaches fault for them playing bad D. Didn't matter who the coach was.

Now they where supposed to be a very good offensive team, but they where always hurt and I think most importan Nash broke his leg very early in the season.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

When everyone is lapsing on D doesn't that point at the coach? Especially one that is known for porous defenses?

You realize Phil Jackson was the coach for this series right?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/..._2011_WCS.html

DAT TWIN TOWER OFFENSE/DEFENSE

[Real Men Wear Green]

Brown was the coach before D'Antoni and he's supposedly one of the best defensive coaches in the league, he had a complete training camp to get this team where it needed to be yet they didn't look like a good defensive team before D'Antoni took over.

That fact, along with what I know, ie Pau being old and out of position, Howard still not healthy and Kobe sloppy(probably saving energy because of age) would lead me to believe it's not the coaches fault for them playing good D. Didn't matter what the coach was.

Now they where supposed to be a very good offensive team, but they where always hurt and I think most importan Nash broke his leg very early in the season.

When you have to find an excuse for every player being subpar there is a fundamental problem. At best D'Antoni isn't the problem. That's the absolute nicest thing that can be said about him. You certainly can't say he's the solution and there is a far stronger case to be made that his defense and inability to use bigs are major issues than that his presence has improved anything. Just because he's done about as bad a job as Mike Brown would have is nothing to be satisfied with, not when you are handed a roster with championship aspirations like LA had last year. There is absolutely no way that he should have been picked over Jackson. You yourself haven't even gone that far and you're the one arguing for him.

[Real Men Wear Green]

You realize Phil Jackson was the coach for this series right?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/..._2011_WCS.html

DAT TWIN TOWER OFFENSE/DEFENSE

He also guided the Lakers to 2 Championships with Bynum and Gasol starting side-by-side. That's a rather large inconvenient truth for you to be ignoring.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

He also guided the Lakers to 2 Championships with Bynum and Gasol starting side-by-side. That's a rather large inconvenient truth for you to be ignoring.

Where were Bynum's stats in the playoffs for those 2 championships? Please enlighten me....

[ZenMaster]

When you have to find an excuse for every player being subpar there is a fundamental problem. At best D'Antoni isn't the problem. That's the absolute nicest thing that can be said about him. You certainly can't say he's the solution and there is a far stronger case to be made that his defense and inability to use bigs are major issues than that his presence has improved anything. Just because he's done about as bad a job as Mike Brown would have is nothing to be satisfied with, not when you are handed a roster with championship aspirations like LA had last year. There is absolutely no way that he should have been picked over Jackson. You yourself haven't even gone that far and you're the one arguing for him.

You call it excuses but I call it reasoning, and we're hardly talking about the whole roster but more like 3 players.

But again, if the Lakers last year had so much defensive potential why weren't they a good defensive team with Mike Brown? Did he magically lose his ability to coach defense that summer?

Don't matter who the coach was last year, Lakers where doing nothing with all the injuries.

[Real Men Wear Green]

You call it excuses but I call it reasoning, and we're hardly talking about the whole roster but more like 3 players.

But again, if the Lakers last year had so much defensive potential why weren't they a good defensive team with Mike Brown? Did he magically lose his ability to coach defense that summer?

Don't matter who the coach was last year, Lakers where doing nothing with all the injuries.

In Bryant, Gasol and Howard we're not just talking about three players, we're talking about the three most important players. We can also discuss guys like Ron Artest but the way I see it as a guy that is mainly about d and not particularly good for spreading the floor he's just another guy that didn't fit what LA wanted to do. I mean, how deep into the roster do you want to go? To be honest I'm not the type to pay attention to the third-string pg if we're not talking about the Celtics.

And again: You still won't say that taking D'Antoni over PJ was the right thing to do.

Where were Bynum's stats in the playoffs for those 2 championships? Please enlighten me....

8 and 7 one year, 6 and 4 the other. Of course you don't want to talk about the regular season, where he averaged double-doubles.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

8 and 7 one year, 6 and 4 the other. Of course you don't want to talk about the regular season, where he averaged double-doubles.

What does the regular season have to do with winning in the playoffs?

[ZenMaster]

In Bryant, Gasol and Howard we're not just talking about three players, we're talking about the three most important players. We can also discuss guys like Ron Artest but the way I see it as a guy that is mainly about d and not particularly good for spreading the floor he's just another guy that didn't fit what LA wanted to do. I mean, how deep into the roster do you want to go? To be honest I'm not the type to pay attention to the third-string pg if we're not talking about the Celtics.

And again: You still won't say that taking D'Antoni over PJ was the right thing to do.
8 and 7 one year, 6 and 4 the other. Of course you don't want to talk about the regular season, where he averaged double-doubles.

They are 3 players who for individual reason that I've explained each didn't live up to the expectations. Injuries, physical decline playing out of position etc.
On top of that the whole team was getting injured at different times which made the whole thing impossible, thus they imploded.

[Real Men Wear Green]

What does the regular season have to do with winning in the playoffs?

Seeding and home court advantage. Now are you seriously going to argue Jackson didn't show he can work with two big men?

[AnaheimLakers24]

old news.

[Real Men Wear Green]

They are 3 players who for individual reason that I've explained each didn't live up to the expectations. Injuries, physical decline playing out of position etc.
On top of that the whole team was getting injured at different times which made the whole thing impossible, thus they imploded.

So everyone had an excuse. But nowhere do we see how D'Antoni made anything better. The only thing he's done since he got there was feud with Hasol. You still won't even say that LA made the right decision. Why even argue?

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Seeding and home court advantage. Now are you seriously going to argue Jackson didn't show he can work with two big men?

That's a hell of a stretch. He showed he can work with Gasol/Odom and Bynum/Odom more so than Bynum/Gasol. Beyond that an older Gasol and Howard with his lesser post moves is even less of a slam dunk pairing. Phil Jackson could dig up Red Auerbach from the grave to be his head assistant and these Lakers post 2012 would still be going nowhere.