Kobe Bryant full highlights vs GSW (HD)

[derb2k2]

damn, that was brutal to watch. I thought it couldn't get any worse after every shot but man....clunkers, clankers, airballs, stuck balls...

for as much as I'd like Wade to surpass Kobe, I don't take pleasure in watching this happen to Kobe.

I hope this doesn't happen to Wade.

[Real Men Wear Green]

MJ was playing within the limitations of his body at that point, Kobe isn't due to an inability mentally to adapt, but also because the Lakers really have shit else on their squad to carry the offense. So it's being put on a guy no longer capable of doing it. It's a bad situation all-around.

Agreed with the part about physical limitations. Bryant had season-ending injuries for 3 consecutive seasons. Where my opinion may differ from yours a bit is I'm not sure if a player exactly like Bryant the way he is right now but without the cache that Bryant has built up with the Lakers would even make a team. Shooting 31% to average 15 points and playing bad D, who would want a guy like that? Maybe his play would be ok if he was taking a step back as a role player but he's never done that so how do we know? It's not like he's got Kyle Korver shooting ability from deep. He absolutely should not have his current role. I would argue that there isn't a guard in the league that couldn't average 15 points if he was allowed to shoot as poorly as 31%. There's nothing good about that at all.

[Naero]

He's still an all-time great player (Top 5 is debatable) he's just continued to play after injuries and age have pushed his body to a point where most guys would have retired. Using his current play as a reason to say his legacy is being damaged reminds me of how some people thought Wizards MJ was legacy damage. Really shouldn't be.

Realistically speaking, players can only take a detractive hit on their legacy if they underachieve expectations for what is expected out of an ATG at their ranking (consensus top-15 in Kobe's case); that isn't the case here. Considering his age, the onerous mileage on his body, and the rash of injuries he's sustained, he's overachieving expectations just by being on the basketball floor.

Kobe has already solidified himself as a consensual top-15 player in 2008-2010, and he hasn't done anything to drop off from that standing since--not while he was healthy and in a competent physical state. Through improved longevity and a continuantly impressive level of play (on the long-shot off-chance that Kobe picks it up this season), he can enhance his legacy through continued overachievement; otherwise, it's not sensible for his legacy to take a hit, as all the years of one's career expectancy (typically no longer than ~15 years) are all in the rear-view mirror.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

[BasedTom]

Realistically speaking, players can only take a detractive hit on their legacy if they underachieve expectations for what is expected out of an ATG at their ranking (consensus top-15 in Kobe's case); that isn't the case here. Considering his age, the onerous mileage on his body, and the rash of injuries he's sustained, he's overachieving expectations just by being on the basketball floor.

Kobe has already solidified himself as a consensual top-15 player in 2008-2010, and he hasn't done anything to drop off from that standing since--not while he was healthy and in a competent physical state. Through improved longevity and a continuantly impressive level of play (on the long-shot off-chance that Kobe picks it up this season), he can enhance his legacy through continued overachievement; otherwise, it's not sensible for his legacy to take a hit, as all the years of one's career expectancy (typically no longer than ~15 years) are all in the rear-view mirror.

To me you're both right and wrong here.

You're right because obviously very few players play 20 years in the league, and very few have as much mileage as him. Though his decline has been apparent in recent seasons, I think even his detractors are surprised at just how awful he has been this year. But his overall longevity is no doubt impressive.

But you're kind of wrong because of what we hear all the time from retired legends. "Oh man I could do ___, ___, ___" "I could still do ____" and even when they're bs'ing we just kind of half to take it since unlike with Kobe's case...when they were on the way out it wasn't anywhere near as miserable and as clear as day (social media era). If Kobe decides to become involved as a coach or executive or something, and a story comes out with Kobe supposedly practicing with a young player and him schooling him, we're immediately going to flash back to these games we're seeing from him today.

[DCL]

He was playing at a much higher level than Bryant is but if you were posting on message boards back then you would have seen a lot of criticism. He was vastly inferior to his prime level and people had no problem saying that. An example of a common sentiment:

we've never seen mj play like absolute garbage. he was a little older, slower, obviously out of his prime, but he was still highly respectable on the court. and he was still playing like the best 39yo+ shooting guard ever seen. the old bald guy was still dropping 40 and 50 and hitting game winners occasionally like the old days. anybody would take that for a 39+yo gimpy kneed body.

but kobe right now? he is totally washed up and playing like absolute garbage, and this harsh description might even be sugarcoating it.

[Town's Town]

That was painfully hilarious.

[f0und]

his "coming off two major injuries" is such a copout and is way overblown. its not like he's a geriatric hobbling around out there. he can still move around pretty well and sometimes get the shots he wants. the problem is, the shots he wants are stupid shots. being old does not excuse stupid basketball. it should be the opposite. 20 years in, and he should know how to play an old man game by now, but he's still chucking up bad shots like he's always been.

if he is as skilled as the kobe kids claim he is, he should be able to overcome his decline in athleticism and AT LEAST be a decent player. but he straight up sucks balls.

[catch24]

his "coming off two major injuries" is such a copout and is way overblown. its not like he's a geriatric hobbling around out there. he can still move around pretty well and sometimes get the shots he wants. the problem is, the shots he wants are stupid shots. being old does not excuse stupid basketball. it should be the opposite. 20 years in, and he should know how to play an old man game by now, but he's still chucking up bad shots like he's always been.

if he is as skilled as the kobe kids claim he is, he should be able to overcome his decline in athleticism and AT LEAST be a decent player. but he straight up sucks balls.

Why do people keep saying this?

Again... If Hakeem, KG, Mcgrady, and Kareem were as skilled as their "fans claimed", why were they garbage their last years in the league?

The easy answer is age and attrition ruined them JUST like it has Kobe...who's legs are completely shredded.

[f0und]

Why do people keep saying this?

Again... If Hakeem, KG, Mcgrady, and Kareem were as skilled as their "fans claimed", why were they garbage their last years in the league?

The easy answer is age and attrition ruined them JUST like it has Kobe...who's legs are completely shredded.

they were never on this level of garbage. they were simply reduced to run of the mill role player status but still at least had some impact on the game. kobe is literally the worst player on the floor by a wide margin. he has an unprecedented negative impact. but it doesnt stop there. its felt throughout the entire organization. kobe's toxic approach to the game. scott enabling of his *hitty play. his ridiculous contract. the "tanking" mentality. this organization is simply cultivating a losing culture, and kobe is at the very center of it.

[Lebronxrings]

almost hit 50 points.

[Town's Town]

Why do people keep saying this?

Again... If Hakeem, KG, Mcgrady, and Kareem were as skilled as their "fans claimed", why were they garbage their last years in the league?

The easy answer is age and attrition ruined them JUST like it has Kobe...who's legs are completely shredded.

How dare you act like Kobe is in Kareem's class. Kareem aged much more gracefully.

[catch24]

they were never on this level of garbage. they were simply reduced to run of the mill role player status but still at least had some impact on the game. kobe is literally the worst player on the floor by a wide margin. he has an unprecedented negative impact. but it doesnt stop there. its felt throughout the entire organization. kobe's toxic approach to the game. scott enabling of his *hitty play. his ridiculous contract. the "tanking" mentality. this organization is simply cultivating a losing culture, and kobe is at the very center of it.

They were/are absolutely garbage. In every sense of the word.

Complete and utter shells of themselves.

Were they never really skilled?

[f0und]

They were/are absolutely garbage. In every sense of the word.

Complete and utter shells of themselves.

Were they never really skilled?

thats a bit of an exaggeration. look at their all their final season numbers. take into consideration the reduced minutes and role and you'll see that their numbers fall in line with run of the mill role players. yes they were shells of themselves but thats expected. their impact on the game was solid or negligible at worst.

hakeem shot 46%(which by the way is higher than kobe's career average) and played solid defense in his 22 minutes, with 6 rebs and 1.5 blocks. that translates to 9.6 rebs and 2.4 blocks per 36.

kareem averaged 10 pts on 47%, 4.5 reb, 1.1 blk in 23 minutes

tmac played 16 min per game shot 43% from the field, 45% from 3

kg only plays 12 min per game. shoots 49% and has a rebounding rate of 12 reb per 36.

and most importantly, they knew their limitations at that point in their careers. compare that to kobe who shoots 16 times per game at 31% fg, 19.5% 3pt. his play is so much more beyond *hit than any of the others. the negative impact is literally unprecedented. someone posted a stat that showed his season is dead last out of 743 in terms of scoring efficiency.

[TheImmortal]