Curry is not ''bigger'' than Lebron yet

[24-Inch_Chrome]

He is so experienced he measures during purely by internal feel

[Bandito]

I think it ia because Curry didnt make a "Decision" and colluded with other stars in order to win a ring. A lot of people disliked how much of uncompetitive spirit he has.

[JohnFreeman]

He is so experienced he measures during purely by internal feel

[coin24]

He is so experienced he measures during purely by internal feel

[dunksby]

He is so experienced he measures during purely by internal feel

Slayed

[3ball]

and the reason for this is pretty simple. His Finals do not get criticized at all, except for a few posts here and there, this is probably first thread on this topic.

Imagine Lebron in 12' going against OKC and Durant with OKC missing Westbrook and Harden and on top of that Chalmers winning FMVP over Lebron(let's say 4th best player on the team, like Igoudala). Lebron would get killed for it, he would get roasted till this day for it I guarantee it. Even as it is he still gets criticized ''but OKC was young and inexperienced team...''

[COLOR="Red"]On the other hand Curry gets a free pass for it[/COLOR], almost no one brings this up. To top it all the Cavs-GS series were pretty damn competitive and close for the first half of the series. But again for Curry all this seems like an ultimate success while for Lebron winning in such a scenario would be seen as a failure?

So how come Curry is already ''bigger'' than Lebron, like majority of the threads on ISH suggest if he's not held to the same standards as Lebron is/would be? And I'm not saying who's better right now, Curry IS currently playing better obviously....

Curry deserved the MVP - the Warriors could've won without Iggy, but never without Curry.

Lebron would've shot badly regardless of Iggy - he can't shoot a good percentage at high volume - too many pull-up jumpers and isolations required, where his efficiency is piss-poor - this is statistical fact - let me know if you want me to post the numbers.

Look how he shot vs. Chicago and Atlanta - like shit.. Iggy's MVP is one of the more obvious examples of how Lebron gets overrated - the media figured that whoever was guarding Lebron was the biggest factor in the series, which is a joke.

[aj1987]

Curry deserved the MVP - the Warriors could've won without Iggy, but never without Curry.

Lebron would've shot badly regardless of Iggy - he can't shoot a good percentage at high volume - too many pull-up jumpers and isolations required, where his efficiency is piss-poor - this is statistical fact - let me know if you want me to post the numbers.

Look how he shot vs. Chicago and Atlanta - like shit.. Iggy's MVP is one of the more obvious examples of how Lebron gets overrated - the media figured that whoever was guarding Lebron was the biggest factor in the series, which is a joke.

Dude shot 44% against the Hawks. MJ shot 46% during his 2nd 3peat. Over 3 entire PO's. Yeah, without Iggy's defense and near 20 PPG, the Cav's would've easily won. They had no one else to guard LeBron.

[3ball]

Dude shot 44% against the Hawks. MJ shot 46% during his 2nd 3peat. Over 3 entire PO's. Yeah, without Iggy's defense and near 20 PPG, the Cav's would've easily won. They had no one else to guard LeBron.

Lebron shot 41.7% in playoffs as a whole because he took 27 shots per game, his first high volume playoffs.

and harrison barnes would've been enough - you're forgetting how much the warriors underperformed offensively in the first part of that series..

once they figured out how to defeat the Cavs defense, they would've pulled it out... there's more than 1 way to skin a cat and the warriors would've made other adjustments if needed.

otoh, the cavs's lebron-ball had no adjustments or counter-adjustments - once lebron-ball gets figured out, it's over - that's why Lebron has been beaten 3 straight games to close out the series in each of his 4 finals losses - the rigid lebron-ball has no capacity for adjustments or counter-adjustments - it's an unsophisticated way to play ball.

[aj1987]

Lebron shot 41.7% in playoffs as a whole because he took 27 shots per game, his first high volume playoffs.

and harrison barnes would've been enough - you're forgetting how much the warriors underperformed offensively in the first part of that series..

Yeah, and they'd be losing a player who shot 16/6/4 on 59% TS. Their 2nd best offensive player. Also, their best defender in that series.

once they figured out how to defeat the Cavs defense, they would've pulled it out... there's more than 1 way to skin a cat and the warriors would've made other adjustments if needed.

But they didn't.

otoh, the cavs's lebron-ball had no adjustments or counter-adjustments - once lebron-ball gets figured out, it's over - that's why Lebron has been beaten 3 straight games to close out the series in each of his 4 finals losses - the rigid lebron-ball has no capacity for adjustments or counter-adjustments - it's an unsophisticated way to play ball.

LeBron was purposefully slowing down the pace. You don't win against the Warriors (with a garbage ass team no less) playing run and gun ball. They're gonna out shoot you and destroy you. The Cavs would've lost in 4 straight blowouts if they played uptempo basketball.

He couldn't hand over the playmaking duties to others nor was he able to let others make decisions, because they're low IQ players. Shump and JR were terrible and can't create for others. Delly had a hard time bringing the ball up court. Actually, Shump is a below average playmaker, but the other two are worse than garbage.

The game in which Mozgov put up 28 points, the Cavs lost by 21 points. LeBron struggled shooting the ball, but he did have 20/12/8. 12 rebounds and 8 assists (oh wait, rebounds and assists only matter when it's Bird). Delly went 3-14, JR 2-12, Shump 2-9, JJ 0-3, etc.. A combined 18% FG%. Literally no one could hit a shot. To top it off, the Warriors went small and Moz couldn't guard anyone on the court. Bogut was benched and Green was playing at the C.

You're blaming LeBron for Moz not getting more involved in game 5 after the 28 point game, when in fact, the COACH played him 9 minutes. He played over 30 minutes in game 6 and LeBron got him involved. Dude put up 17/12/4.

For the series, the 3 guys who played the 3rd, 4th, and 5th highest minutes managed to score a combined 25.5 points on sub 40% TS. 29% FG% and 28% 3pt%.

You want to keep talking about how the Warriors underperformed offensively? Without their defense, they wouldn't have made the Finals and IF you get rid of Iggy, they're losing the Finals.

[coin24]

Curry big di.ck fam, got that smoking hot wife like kobes..


Lebaldo tiny cashew gets a fat hippo

[3ball]

Yeah, and they'd be losing a player who shot 16/6/4 on 59% TS. Their 2nd best offensive player. Also, their best defender in that series.

Iggy wasn't their 2nd best offensive player - he's a 7 ppg player last year and this year.

The same Warriors team that won 67 games with Iggy getting 7 ppg could've beaten the Cavs without Iggy, at least 5 out of 10 times or more - but they could never beat the Cavs without Curry.

[COLOR="blue"]LeBron was purposefully slowing down the pace.[/COLOR] You don't win against the Warriors (with a garbage ass team no less) playing run and gun ball. They're gonna out shoot you and destroy you. The Cavs would've lost in 4 straight blowouts if they played uptempo basketball.

Oh I understand what he was doing - it was a good strategy..

And it would've worked if he'd shot much better against the single-coverage and wide open strongsides he faced, AND if he hadn't let a role player be > Curry.

Seriously, if he shoots better and doesn't let 7 ppg Iggy be better than Curry, the Cavs win 2 more games.

he couldn't hand over the playmaking duties to others nor was he able to let others make decisions, [COLOR="blue"]because they're low IQ players. Shump and JR were terrible and can't create for others.[/COLOR] Delly had a hard time bringing the ball up court. Actually, Shump is a below average playmaker, but the other two are worse than garbage.

Those guys don't have to "create for others" - they just have to pass and move the ball.. If they had played that way ALL YEAR (moving the ball), they wouldn't be uselesss play-finishers come playoff time.

You should understand that if say, Larry Bird replaced Lebron on the Cavs FROM THE START OF TRAINING CAMP, the team would play completely differently all year long... Those guys wouldn't be useless play-finishers by the end of the year - they'd be moving the ball like the Spurs do..

Larry Bird didn't have a point-guard-level time of possession like Lebron does, which gives Blatt (a euro-style coach) more options - the team would look night-and-day different with Bird playing a different style.. The team would've looked more like the Spurs, where the ball MOVES..

The notion that the Cavs HAD to clear-out for Lebron every play like it's a pickup game is ridiculous, and it's an indictment on Lebron's style of play and the style of play he IMPOSES on the coach and the team - Bird wouldn't do this.

Lebron's time of possession was 12.0 minutes per game in the Finals - that was 50% higher than the RS leader John Wall's 8.1 minutes... That's insane.. Lebron's teammates aren't junior highers that shouldn't touch the ball - they're professionals.

For the series, the 3 guys who played the 3rd, 4th, and 5th highest minutes managed to score a combined 25.5 points on sub 40% TS. 29% FG% and 28% 3pt%.

Not surprising... Lebron turns teammates into play-finishers - he lowers their APG and increases their assisted rate - their predictable play-finishing roles no longer succeed against the best teams in the playoffs.. It's been this way for LEbron's entire career.

The story is ALWAYS how his teammates underperform - didn't you ever wonder WHY this happens?... [COLOR="Navy"]Or did you just chalk it up to coincidence every time?[/COLOR]

[aj1987]

Iggy wasn't their 2nd best offensive player - he's a 7 ppg player last year and this year.

The same Warriors team that won 67 games with Iggy getting 7 ppg could've beaten the Cavs without Iggy, at least 5 out of 10 times or more - but they could never beat the Cavs without Curry.

Curry deserved the MVP - the Warriors could've won without Iggy, but never without Curry.

We're talking about the Finals, you retarded shit.

Oh I understand what he was doing - it was a good strategy..

And it would've worked if he'd shot much better against the single-coverage and wide open strongsides he faced, AND if he hadn't let a role player be > Curry.

Seriously, if he shoots better and doesn't let 7 ppg Iggy be better than Curry, the Cavs win 2 more games.

How does LeBron shooting more help with Iggy not being better than Curry?

Those guys don't have to "create for others" - they just have to pass and move the ball.. If they had played that way ALL YEAR (moving the ball), they wouldn't be uselesss play-finishers come playoff time.

They NEVER played like that in their entire careers. You would know, if you actually watched basketball.

You should understand that if say, Larry Bird replaced Lebron on the Cavs FROM THE START OF TRAINING CAMP, the team would play completely differently all year long... Those guys wouldn't be useless play-finishers by the end of the year - they'd be moving the ball like the Spurs do..

Then it's settled. Bird is the GOAT. Dude can change players in a single RS. Their entire play style, which they've been accustomed to for seasons.

Larry Bird didn't have a point-guard-level time of possession like Lebron does, which gives Blatt (a euro-style coach) more options - the team would look night-and-day different with Bird playing a different style.. The team would've looked more like the Spurs, where the ball MOVES..

He didn't need to. He wasn't playing with JR, Shump, Delly, etc.. Dude had extremely high IQ players like McHale, Parish, DJ, Maxwell, etc..

The notion that the Cavs HAD to clear-out for Lebron every play like it's a pickup game is ridiculous, and it's an indictment on Lebron's style of play and the style of play he IMPOSES on the coach and the team - Bird wouldn't do this.

He didn't need to.

Lebron's time of possession was 12.0 minutes per game in the Finals - that was 50% higher than the RS leader John Wall's 8.1 minutes... That's insane.. Lebron's teammates aren't junior highers that shouldn't touch the ball - they're professionals.

JR, Shump, and Delly. Stop boxscore watching like a [COLOR="Black"]f[/COLOR]aggot and actually watch the games for a change. You literally have never seen them play, right? Even before the Cav's...

Without LeBron James:

JR Smith 0/9 FG
Delly 0/7 FG
J. Jones 0/3 FG
Shumpert 0/2 FG

Total 0/21 FG

Without James on the floor, Cleveland’s field goal percentage dropped for 40% to 17%, and it’s offensive efficiency fell from 97.3 to 50.9.

Not surprising... Lebron turns teammates into play-finishers - he lowers their APG and increases their assisted rate - their predictable play-finishing roles no longer succeed against the best teams in the playoffs.. It's been this way for LEbron's entire career.

Oh wait. When it was MJ, it was because he takes up possessions, but when it's LeBron, he's just a bad player? Eat shit, kid.

The story is ALWAYS how his teammates underperform - didn't you ever wonder WHY this happens?... [COLOR="Navy"]Or did you just chalk it up to coincidence every time?[/COLOR]

You might understand that if you actually knew basketball. It's not just about MJ's D, [COLOR="black"]f[/COLOR]agboy.

Your entire posts literally screams "box score watching stat nerd". Try.. Just TRY watching a game once in a while. It's not really that hard.

[3ball]

How does LeBron shooting more help with Iggy not being better than Curry?

Oh, so now you can't read?...

I said that if Lebron shoots better AND plays better defense so 7 ppg Iguoudala isn't > Curry, the Cavs win 2 more games... That's obvious...

[COLOR="DarkRed"]They NEVER played like that in their entire careers[/COLOR]. You would know, if you actually watched basketball.

Sure they have.. All those guys have moved the ball... All professional basketball players are capable of moving the ball - chest pass... bounce pass.. swing the ball.

It isn't hard... Moving the ball is something junior highers do... Should I post video of junior highers moving the ball?

Look at the Spurs role players, who many people say are D-leaguers - [COLOR="Navy"]but they move the ball[/COLOR][/i].

Kerr, Paxson, BJ Armstrong, Wennington, Longley, Cartwright, Scott Williams, trent tucker - all these guys were stiffs - [COLOR="Navy"]but they moved the ball[/COLOR]..

Then it's settled. Bird is the GOAT. [COLOR="DarkRed"]Dude can change players in a single RS.[/COLOR] Their entire play style, which they've been accustomed to for seasons.

Bird turned a 21-win team into a 61-win team in one season.. And his game allowed that 21-win roster to MOVE THE BALL - he didn't use a point-guard level time of possession like Lebron or clearout every play.

Again, professional basketball players know how to move the ball... It isn't complicated or some hard thing to do - junior highers do it... you're just making bad excuses for your favorite player's unsophisticated style of play that prevents ball movement.

Without LeBron James:

JR Smith 0/9 FG
Delly 0/7 FG
J. Jones 0/3 FG
Shumpert 0/2 FG

Total 0/21 FG

Without James on the floor, Cleveland’s field goal percentage dropped for 40% to 17%, and it’s offensive efficiency fell from 97.3 to 50.9.

21 FGA's????... That's it???

That was 12% of their total shots.. They shot horrifically on the other 88% too, so you have no argument - Lebron's teammates underperform alongside him against the best teams - this is a fact.

Specifically, Lebron turns teammates into play-finishers - he lowers their APG and increases their assisted rate - their predictable play-finishing roles no longer succeed against the best teams in the playoffs..

It's been this way for LEbron's entire career.. The story is ALWAYS how his teammates underperform - didn't you ever wonder WHY this happens?... [COLOR="Navy"]Or did you just chalk it up to coincidence every time?[/COLOR]

Your posts scream boxscore-watching nerd

If I posted what I really wanted to - which is strictly eye-test - you'd say I was crazy and didn't know what I was talking about - fools who never played (so they have no eye test) say I'm crazy and they want proof with stats.. So that's what I do - I statistically prove things I see with my eyes.. Here's a few examples:

1) I proved Lebron was a ball-dominator by showing he's the only non-point guard in the top 50 for time of possession, along with Harden.

2) I proved Lebron turns teammates into predictable play-finishers (lowers APG and increases their assisted rate)... See the next response below

3) I also proved 34-35 year old MJ was more dominant than 2000 Shaq by showing he scored a far higher proportion of his team's points.

Oh wait. [COLOR="red"]When it was MJ, it was because he takes up possessions, but when it's LeBron, he's just a bad player?[/COLOR] Eat shit, kid.

[COLOR="Blue"]MJ didn't reduce teammates APG and increase their assisted rate (turn teammates from playmakers into play-finishers) - here's Pippen's APG alongside Jordan - it went UP alongisde him:[/COLOR]


[COLOR="Green"]Pippen apg and assist % with[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] Jordan 91'-93':[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 6.5, 24.5[/COLOR]
[COLOR="Red"]Pippen apg and assist % w/out Jordan 94'-95':[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 5.4, 23.7[/COLOR]
[COLOR="Green"]Pippen apg and assist % with[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] Jordan 96'-98':[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 5.8, 25.1[/COLOR]



[COLOR="Blue"]Otoh, Lebron significantly lowers the APG and assist % of his teammates:[/COLOR]


[COLOR="Green"]Wade apg and assist % before Lebron (04'-10'):[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 6.6, 34.8% [/COLOR]
[COLOR="Red"]Wade apg and assist % with[COLOR="White"]...[/COLOR] Lebron (11'-14'):[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 4.7, 25.5% [/COLOR]

[COLOR="Green"]Irving apg and assist % before Lebron (12'-14'):[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 5.8, 33.2[/COLOR]
[COLOR="Red"]Irving apg and assist % with[COLOR="White"].....[/COLOR] Lebron (2015):[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] 5.2, 25.0%[/COLOR]

[COLOR="Green"]Bosh apg and assist % before Lebron (04'-10'):[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] 2.2, 10.5%[/COLOR]
[COLOR="Red"]Bosh apg and assist % with[COLOR="White"]...[/COLOR] Lebron (11'-14'):[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] 1.6, [COLOR="White"].[/COLOR]8.0% [/COLOR]

[COLOR="Green"]Kevin Love apg and assist % in MIN:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 2.5, 13.0%[/COLOR]
[COLOR="Red"]Kevin Love apg and assist % in CLE:[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] 2.2, 10.7%[/COLOR]

[COLOR="Green"]Mo Williams apg and assist % before Lebron:[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] 6.3, 30.0%[/COLOR]
[COLOR="Red"]Mo Williams apg and assist % with[COLOR="White"]...[/COLOR] Lebron:[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] 4.1, 20.1%[/COLOR]

[aj1987]

Oh, so now you can't read?...

I said that if Lebron shoots better AND plays better defense so 7 ppg Iguoudala isn't > Curry, the Cavs win 2 more games... That's obvious...

The **** are you even talking about? LeBron barely guarded Iggy. Also, it was Iggy's defense on LeBron that helped them more. As I keep saying, watch the games. Not BB-Ref.

Sure they have.. All those guys have moved the ball... All professional basketball players are capable of moving the ball - chest pass... bounce pass.. swing the ball.

THEY ARE LOW IQ PLAYERS. Literally anyone who has watched them play will attest to that.

It isn't hard... Moving the ball is something junior highers do... Should I post video of junior highers moving the ball?

Christ, you're retarded. Who should they move it to? The only one on that team capable of making plays was LeBron. We all (maybe not you) saw what happened when LeBron was sitting.

Look at the Spurs role players, who many people say are D-leaguers - [COLOR="Navy"]but they move the ball[/COLOR][/i].

The Cav's didn't/don't have pop.

Kerr, Paxson, BJ Armstrong, Wennington, Longley, Cartwright, Scott Williams, trent tucker - all these guys were stiffs - [COLOR="Navy"]but they moved the ball[/COLOR]..

Stiffs? They had high basketball IQ. Unlike JR, Shump, and Delly.

Bird turned a 21-win team into a 61-win team in one season.. And his game allowed that 21-win roster to MOVE THE BALL - he didn't use a point-guard level time of possession like Lebron or clearout every play.

Do you want to look at what LeBron did or do you just want to ignore it?

Again, professional basketball players know how to move the ball... It isn't complicated or some hard thing to do - junior highers do it... you're just making bad excuses for your favorite player's unsophisticated style of play that prevents ball movement.

Watch the games [COLOR="Black"]f[/COLOR]aggot. Just swinging the ball around =/= good basketball. Finding the open man and trying to get the best possible shot and utilizing the shot clock all matter.

21 FGA's????... That's it???

That was 12% of their total shots.. They shot horrifically on the other 88% too, so you have no argument - Lebron's teammates underperform alongside him against the best teams - this is a fact.

12% isn't significant enough? THEY LITERALLY DIDN'T MAKE A SINGLE SHOT WITHOUT LEBRON. Probably caps will help you understand.

How retarded does a player have to be to completely forget playing basketball, just because of a "system"? Please stop. You just sound retarded.

Love how you ignored this part:

Without James on the floor, Cleveland’s field goal percentage dropped for 40% to 17%, and it’s offensive efficiency fell from 97.3 to 50.9.

1) I proved Lebron was a ball-dominator by showing he's the only non-point guard in the top 50 for time of possession, along with Harden.

He's also the best passer/playemaker on all the teams he has been on. Any one with an ounce of basketball knowledge would give the ball to LeBron to make played. Who would your retarded ass rather give it to? MJ or Kerr, to make plays?

2) I proved Lebron turns teammates into predictable play-finishers (lowers APG and increases their assisted rate)... See the next response below

No you didn't. You just pulled up arbitrary random AF numbers with ZERO context.

3) I also proved 34-35 year old MJ was more dominant than 2000 Shaq by showing he scored a far higher proportion of his team's points.

Nope. He wasn't. Just because he scored more % of his team's points doesn't make him dominant.

Your entire posts literally screams "box score watching stat nerd". Try.. Just TRY watching a game once in a while. It's not really that hard.



EDIT: You keep posting that retarded shit, but as I said, LeBron has always been the best passer/playmaker on EVERY team he has been on. Any coach worth a damn would ask him to make plays. You also do understand that LeBron averages like 7 assists a game, right? That HAS to come from somewhere. Pippen's scoring also went up without MJ and with MJ, he had someone to pass to. Namely, MJ. A dude who was taking over 23 shots a game.

Context, you retarded shit.

[zeerghit]

He is so experienced he measures during purely by internal feel

damn