95 Rockets vs. 01 Lakers

[SouBeachTalents]

yabut tons of teams have faced weak comp. Look at the Heat. They even lost to 'weak comp.'

The 15-1 Lakers are one insane fluke game away from being perfect. Now, does that mean they were the GOAT team... I don't think so. Do they beat 95 Rockets? Who knows...

but in terms of that accomplishment, it's like winning 70 games to me.

Also: Shaq himself said he took it easy on Hakeem in 95, physically. If the refs let Shaq play vs him like he did vs Mutombo, it would get ugly.

-Smak

Exactly, plus the Rockets were down 2-1 in the first round & 3-1 in the conference semis. They lost 7 games in the playoffs, and if not for Nick Anderson's choke job, it would have been at least 8

[SexSymbol]

Ohh Kobe stans with their "records" again... Records would also lead you to believe the 2008-2010 competition was superior than 2012-2014... Different times & Teams.

2001 consisted of the broken down Blazers, catching the Kings right before their Peak, and a Spurs Team that was all Duncan and nothing else. (Similar to LeBron, carrying a Team to great regular season success, but come Playoff time the cast gets exposed.)




BTW: 2001 Lakers in 5 or 6

such an idiot

[LAZERUSS]

Laker sweep.

And a PRIME Shaq just crushes Hakeem.

If Mutombo couldn't stop Shaq, a weak ass Hakeem and his swarming teammates would have no chance...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJ3FXLyNFew

[millwad]

Laker sweep.

And a PRIME Shaq just crushes Hakeem.

If Mutombo couldn't stop Shaq, a weak ass Hakeem and his swarming teammates would have no chance...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJ3FXLyNFew

Haha, come on.
Mutombo was much weaker than Hakeem and this is not like when Kareem absolutely destroyed and crushed Wilt while averaging 40 points on 50% shooting in '72.

[LAZERUSS]

Haha, come on.
Mutombo was much weaker than Hakeem and this is not like when Kareem absolutely destroyed and crushed Wilt while averaging 40 points on 50% shooting in '72.

A PEAK Kareem shot .464 in his 28 career H2H's against Wilt, 27 of which Chamberlain was post-surgery.

A 37-42 year old KAJ< WAY past his prime, outscored a 23-26 year Hakeem, and outshot him by a .607 to .512 margin. And a 38-39 year old KAJ just ANNIHILATED a 23-24 year old Hakeem. 32 ppg on a .621 FG%, which included THREE games of 40+.

It was so embarrassing that the Rockets moved Sampson as the primary defender on a 39 year old Kareem in the WCF's. Hakeem NEVER could guard a near retired Kareem. One can only wonder how many 60+ point games a 23-25 year old Kareem would have hung on a PRIME Hakeem.

[LAZERUSS]

BTW, Shaq outplayed Hakeem in THREE games of the '95 Finals. He wiped the floor with Hakeem in game one, and easily outplayed him in game three. In game two, Hakeem outplayed him in the first half, but Shaq just downright crushed him in the second half. Hakeem was holding on for dear life in the second half of that game. The only game in which Hakeem outplayed Shaq was in game four.

And,by that time Shaq had given up. He had badly outplayed Hakeem, but Hakeem's teammates just overwhelmed his.

[Smoke117]

You guys are definitely overrating the '01 Lakers.

First of all, they faced weak competition, the Rockets played against better competition and Olajuwon faced way tougher opponents on the center position.

While Olajuwon outplayed prime Robinson and a very good Shaq, Shaq outplayed 34 year old Mutombo, old ass Robinson and Divac. And not only did the the Lakers face bad centers, they also faced pretty bad teams, no teams over 60 wins.

And don't underrate the '95 version of Shaq, he was probably a harder match-up for Olajuwon than what the 2001 version would be, much faster and more athletic.

Exactly. Why does everyone overlook that now? The Lakers didn't go through one great team in 01. They maybe faced one very good team at that...

[LAZERUSS]

Exactly. Why does everyone overlook that now? The Lakers didn't go through one great team in 01.

They SWEPT the 58-24 Spurs. In fact, they just annhilated them in the last two games of that series by margins of 111-72 and 111-82.

[LAZERUSS]

As a side-note, here were Hakeem's and Shaq's 94-95 TOTAL H2H numbers, covering their seven H2H games (three in the regular season, and the four in the Finals)...

Hakeem: 30.0 ppg, 11.0 rpg, 5.3 apg, .465 FG%
Shaq: 26.1 ppg, 13.6 rpg, 5.4 apg, and... a .608 FG%

This from a 22 year old Shaq, and going up against a PEAK Hakeem.

[millwad]

BTW, Shaq outplayed Hakeem in THREE games of the '95 Finals. He wiped the floor with Hakeem in game one, and easily outplayed him in game three. In game two, Hakeem outplayed him in the first half, but Shaq just downright crushed him in the second half. Hakeem was holding on for dear life in the second half of that game. The only game in which Hakeem outplayed Shaq was in game four.

And,by that time Shaq had given up. He had badly outplayed Hakeem, but Hakeem's teammates just overwhelmed his.

Now you're just being a clown, this is why no one takes you seriously. First all those essays about Wilt, then when you got exposed over the fact that you never saw Wilt play and then all your alts., Jlauber.

And I just love how stupid you are and how much of a hypocrite you are. First of all, every media outlet, all the fans and Shaq himself said that Olajuwon outplayed Shaq in the '95 finals. Everyone but you because it fits your agenda.

It's a draw at best for Shaq in game 3, Olajuwon outrebounded Shaq, outscored Shaq, outassisted Shaq, outstole Shaq and he had 3 turnovers than Shaq. And Shaq choked in the end of the game with two easy misses close to the basket which gave the Rockets the edge.

Regarding game 2 you've been destroyed time after time, as a Wilt fan I understand that you love the statpadding Shaq did in the end of the game when the game was over but fact was that Olajuwon tore Shaq in to pieces in the first half while scoring 22 points. Orland was never even close to make it back to the game and Shaq only scored 10 points in the first half on shitty percentage. The fact that you want to give the edge to Shaq in a game where he sucked in the first half while giving up 22 points to Olajuwon is laughable. The game was never even close after that and Shaq's points came when the game was already over.

And game 4 was an easy win for Olajuwon and the Rockets, Olajuwon put up 35 points, 15 rebounds, 6 steals and 3 assists.

There's absolutely nothing that you can come up with that can give the edge to Shaq, absolutely nothing. If you want to make a fool out of yourself, keep doing so but you are getting destroyed every time.

[LAZERUSS]

Now you're just being a clown, this is why no one takes you seriously. First all those essays about Wilt, then when you got exposed over the fact that you never saw Wilt play and then all your alts., Jlauber.

And I just love how stupid you are and how much of a hypocrite you are. First of all, every media outlet, all the fans and Shaq himself said that Olajuwon outplayed Shaq in the '95 finals. Everyone but you because it fits your agenda.

It's a draw at best for Shaq in game 3, Olajuwon outrebounded Shaq, outscored Shaq, outassisted Shaq, outstole Shaq and he had 3 turnovers than Shaq. And Shaq choked in the end of the game with two easy misses close to the basket which gave the Rockets the edge.

Regarding game 2 you've been destroyed time after time, as a Wilt fan I understand that you love the statpadding Shaq did in the end of the game when the game was over but fact was that Olajuwon tore Shaq in to pieces in the first half while scoring 22 points. Orland was never even close to make it back to the game and Shaq only scored 10 points in the first half on shitty percentage. The fact that you want to give the edge to Shaq in a game where he sucked in the first half while giving up 22 points to Olajuwon is laughable. The game was never even close after that and Shaq's points came when the game was already over.

And game 4 was an easy win for Olajuwon and the Rockets, Olajuwon put up 35 points, 15 rebounds, 6 steals and 3 assists.

There's absolutely nothing that you can come up with that can give the edge to Shaq, absolutely nothing. If you want to make a fool out of yourself, keep doing so but you are getting destroyed every time.

Shaq crushed Hakeem in the second half of game two. In fact by the 4 minute mark of the 3rd quarter, the 23 point margin was down to 13. Again, it was Hakeem's TEAMMATES who saved his ass in that game, and in the series.

In game three, Hakeem nearly shot his team down the drain... 14-30 from the field, while Shaq shot his usual high efficiency against Olajuwon, 11-17.

Just how dominant were Hakeem's teammates?

Hakeem's TEAMMATES, collectively, had a considerably higher TS% in that series, than Hakeem, himself. So, those that favor this stat, had better prepared to explain that. Looks to me like Houston won that series DESPITE Hakeem.

Meanwhile, Shaq's TS% in that Finals was far greater than what his teammates gave him.

Hakeem shot 55-115 from the field, 1-1 from the arc, and 18-26 from the line.
His teammates shot 70-136 from 2pt range, 36-91 from the arc, and 77-97 from the line.

Shaq shot 44-74 from the field, and 24-42 from the line.
His teammates shot 78-156 from 2 pt range, 41-118 from the arc, and 37-47 from the line.

Using a TRUE TS%, Hakeem shot .508. His teammates collectively shot .589.

Shaq shot a TRUE TS% of .589. His teammates shot a collective .533.


Hell, Hakeem didn't even shoot the post-season NBA average in eFG% (.488 to the league average of .504.)

As for the REAL breakdown...Colts18...

I decided to rewatch the 1995 finals and chart each possession to see to how effective Shaq and Hakeem were on the court. A special shout out to Jordanbulls for providing the video of this series


Total:
Hakeem: 253 touches, 140 doubles (55.3%)
Shaq: 221 touches, 146 doubles (66.1%)

Here are their stats when they were guarded by each other:
Shaq 32-57 (56.1 FG%), 6-8 FT, 67.3 double teamed%, .578 TS%, 17 assists, 1 O-reb allowed to Hakeem
Hakeem: 31-75 (41.3 FG%), 9-13 FT, 60.2 double teamed%, .446 TS%, 8 assists, 3 O-reb allowed to Shaq

Shaq blocked 2 Hakeem shots, Hakeem blocked 0 Shaq shots. Hakeem did make a 3P on Shaq. Hakeem guarded Shaq on 73.3% of the touches he had, while Shaq guarded Hakeem on 69.6% of his touches. Hakeem got a lot more fastbreak touches than Shaq so in the halfcourt, they guarded each other about even.

When they weren't being guarded by each other, Shaq was being guarded by Charles Jones and Hakeem by Horace Grant.

Shaq vs Jones: 7-11 FG (63.6 FG%), 35 doubles in 52 touches (67.3%), 2 assists
Hakeem vs Grant: 13-24 (54.2 FG%), 33 double teams in 58 touches (56.9%), 6 assists

Jump shots:
Hakeem: 27-62 (43.5%)
Shaq: 2-7 (28.6%)

The vast majority of Shaq's shots were close range hooks.

Dunks:
Hakeem: 1 dunk (vs grant)
Shaq: 9 dunks (2 of them were in Hakeem's face)

Fouls drawn on offense:
Shaq: 37 (17 on Hakeem)
Hakeem: 21 (9 on Shaq)

Hakeem did draw 4 Shaq charges.

Shaq was called for 5 travels, Hakeem 2.

Plus/Minus (Houston outscored Orlando by 28 points total):
On court:
Shaq: -12 in 180 minutes
Hakeem: +17 in 179 minutes

Off court:
Shaq: -16 in 16:37 of action (Houston scored 133 points per 48 in the minutes Shaq missed)
Hakeem: +11 in 17:11 of action (134 points per 48 in the minutes he was off the court)

Interestingly enough, in 2 of the games, the Magic outscored the Rockets when Shaq was on the court. The magic were -8 in about 9 minutes of action without Shaq in game (lost by just 2 points). In game 3, they were -4 in the minutes Shaq missed in a game where they lost by 3 points. In game 1, the Rockets outscored the magic by 9 in the minutes Hakeem missed, but they were outscored by a combined 4 points in games 3 and 4 without Hakeem.

Observations:
-Orlando was for some reason really committed to doubling Hakeem in game 1. They were throwing a lot of hard doubles. Hakeem had 5 assists in that game, all of them 3 pointers, 4 came off of doubles (one was a triple team). I'm guessing it was a response to Hakeem's series vs Robinson. For the rest of the series, Orlando didn't double Hakeem as much and they threw softer doubles.

-Hakeem made like 5 or 6 baskets in transition to Shaq's 1 or so. So while Shaq didn't get credit for giving up those buckets since he didn't guard, a few of those times Shaq was slow in transition. Shaq got about 3 or shots

-One of the commentators compared Horry to Scottie Pippen and Walton took the comment seriously. They are vastly different players IMO

-I'm not sure why Penny wasn't more aggressive. Kenny Smith couldn't guard him at all. When Penny did drive to the basket, he made a few shots over Hakeem.

-Drexler was the man in this series. He really wanted to get his first title badly. For some reason, people rarely talk about him despite him getting more WS than Hakeem in that playoff run

-It's fashionable these days to **** on Hakeem's cast in 94, but this cast was much better than that one. The guards outplayed Orlando's guards. Horry played really well. The 3P shooters benefited a lot from the shortened 3P line.

-Contrary to popular belief, handchecking wasn't allowed in 95. The refs called like 2 handchecking fouls in this series

-I'm so thankful the NBA got rid of the illegal defense. The refs called like 5 of them in each game. It destroyed the flow of the game and limited the ways you could double team a player.

Hakeem was HELPLESS when defending Shaq one-on-one...

[T_L_P]

They SWEPT the 58-24 Spurs. In fact, they just annhilated them in the last two games of that series by margins of 111-72 and 111-82.

Spurs were pretty without Derek Anderson, who was without doubt their third best player, and who many considered the second option on offense.

This was their CF lineup

Duncan
Robinson (35)
Daniels
Ferry (34)
Avery (35)
Elliott (post kidney surgery)
Samaki Walker
Porter (37)
Malik Rose
Kerr (35)

That's a sweep and then some, especially considering how great that Lakers team was. I actually remember at one point in the second half of game 2, Duncan had 30-something and Daniels had about 15. Nobody else even had 5.

Anyway, to answer the OP: Lakers would win.

[millwad]

As a side-note, here were Hakeem's and Shaq's 94-95 TOTAL H2H numbers, covering their seven H2H games (three in the regular season, and the four in the Finals)...

Hakeem: 30.0 ppg, 11.0 rpg, 5.3 apg, .465 FG%
Shaq: 26.1 ppg, 13.6 rpg, 5.4 apg, and... a .608 FG%

This from a 22 year old Shaq, and going up against a PEAK Hakeem.

Haha, you're the same clown who claims that Kareem got murdered in '72 by Wilt. Wilt got absolutely slaughtered, Kareem averaged 40% on 50% shooting against prime defensive Wilt in the regular season.

And in the playoffs Kareem outscored Wilt with 23 points per game while shooting the ball with a better FG%, while shooting FT's twice as good and while outassisting Wilt.

That's pure abuse and you still want to give the edge to Wilt based on two articles, you didn't even post the stats in the beginning when you claimed that Kareem got "murdered" (your own words) and it was first when Fatal9 exposed your bogus that you started with the "stats don't matter, I have 2 articles that proves my point".

So now we have a series from '95, all media, all fans, all players and Shaq himself gave the edge to Hakeem and here you are acting like you know anything. I was the one who clowned you when you even couldn't break down one single game. You didn't even see the series, just like you didn't see Wilt play.

Your mom should have swallowed you, Jeff.

[LAZERUSS]

Spurs were pretty without Derek Anderson, who was without doubt their third best player, and who many considered the second option on offense.

This was their CF lineup

Duncan
Robinson (35)
Daniels
Ferry (34)
Avery (35)
Elliott (post kidney surgery)
Samaki Walker
Porter (37)
Malik Rose
Kerr (35)

That's a sweep and then some, especially considering how great that Lakers team was. I actually remember at one point in the second half of game 2, Duncan had 30-something and Daniels had about 15. Nobody else even had 5.

Anyway, to answer the OP: Lakers would win.

Duncan abused the Laker PFs throughout the Laker-Spurs H2H post-season series, but he always struggled mightily in the 4th quarters when Jackson would move Shaq on him.

[millwad]

Shaq crushed Hakeem in the second half of game two. In fact by the 4 minute mark of the 3rd quarter, the 23 point margin was down to 13. Again, it was Hakeem's TEAMMATES who saved his ass in that game, and in the series.

In game three, Hakeem nearly shot his team down the drain... 14-30 from the field, while Shaq shot his usual high efficiency against Olajuwon, 11-17.

Just how dominant were Hakeem's teammates?




As for the REAL breakdown...Colts18...



Hakeem was HELPLESS when defending Shaq one-on-one...

First of all, the fact that you had to copy and paste another guy's break down only confirms the fact that you didn't even see the series, what kind of clown would use another break-down than his/her own while trying to argue for it.

And what kind of bogus break-down would "miss" the fact that Shaq was in foul trouble all series long and that he had the highest turnover per game average among centers in NBA finals history? That is just laughable.