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  1. #46
    Very good NBA starter elementally morale's Avatar
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rekindled
    eisenhower is a far better president than clinton.
    Sure, but it has nothing to do with WWII.

    You can save the league in 1980. There is nothing to save in 1998.

  2. #47
    Kiss my converse!!! Celts34's Avatar
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    Quote Originally Posted by elementally morale
    Sure, but it has nothing to do with WWII.

    You can save the league in 1980. There is nothing to save in 1998.

    Actually after MJ left in 98, added in with the lock-out....that kinda was like the NBA' version of the Great Depression

  3. #48
    Very good NBA starter elementally morale's Avatar
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    Quote Originally Posted by Celts34
    Actually after MJ left in 98, added in with the lock-out....that kinda was like the NBA' version of the Great Depression
    The league's future was not in real danger then, unlike the late 70s IMO.

  4. #49
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    Quote Originally Posted by allball
    Because Bird could dominate in more areas of the game.

    It's ridiculous to say Shaq was a better scorer when Bird could score in so many ways plus you have to count his assists.
    This.

    Quote Originally Posted by sixer6ad
    I think we are all finding that the differences in time periods and game styles makes this an impossible comparison.
    This too.

  5. #50
    7-time NBA All-Star
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    Quote Originally Posted by allball
    Because Bird could dominate in more areas of the game. people talk about Bird not being a great defender but his hustle had just as much impact as Shaq's or Duncan's defense.
    Uh, no. Bird was better than people give him credit for, but he did not bring the equivalent of shot blocking, rebounding, solid post defense and intimidation in the paint.

    Bird's defense, however was based 100% on anticipation and hustle. He was a poor post defender and not quick enough to stay with high scoring perimeter players.

    he was absolute money. who would you fear most in a game 7. Shaq, Duncan or Bird?

    It's ridiculous to say Shaq was a better scorer when Bird could score in so many ways plus you have to count his assists.
    Yeah, Bird could score in so many ways, but Shaq just couldn't be stopped from scoring. He'd score more than Bird and with more defenders.

    Bird averaged 29.9/6/9 at 31 years old while shooting .916 from the FT line. it doesn't get much better than that.
    What about 29.7/13.6/3.8/3.0 on 57.4% from the field at a much slower pace with 10 more wins than Bird and a championship to cap it off. Then we can mention his 31/15 playoff averages and 38/17 finals averages that season...

    When looking at rebounds you can't just look at the numbers. you have to look at how and when they got rebounds. Bird got 11 boards a night without playing under the basket. centers have a huge advantage in rebound position. Bird hustled for boards.
    And prime Shaq couldn't be boxed out. He was too big, strong and athletic. I still remember him just going over or around prime Dikembe Mutombo in the finals. He had back to back 20 rebound games vs Dikembe and easily outrebounded him that series.

  6. #51
    Decent playground baller
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    Shaq and Bird are close ... but Duncan isn't in this category ..

  7. #52
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    I don't see how Duncan is even in the discussion with Shaq and Bird. Bird's and Shaq's peak play was on another level than that of Duncan.
    Also, Bird is easily just as good an offensive player as Jordan, arguably better.

  8. #53
    Facts Are Misleading
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    Also, Bird is easily just as good an offensive player as Jordan, arguably better.
    I think Bird would tell you himself Jordan was better than him.

    Bird had three years over 26 points per game in his career.

    Jordan averaged between 30 and 37 points a year on 50 percent shooting or better for seven straight years.

    Jordan might not have been the passer Bird was... but he wasn't far behind. He could dish the ball and make plays for other people. You don't average eight dimes in one year without having superb passing skills.

    Overall, Bird had better passing and more range.... but he didn't shoot many 3 pointers. He attempted less than one a game four straight years. He attempted about two per game for his career.

    So while he was a better long distance shooter, it doesn't matter a whole lot because he didn't produce with it enough for it to matter a whole lot.

    Bottom line is Jordan put far more pressure on your defense than Bird did. Just watch a few finals games in 1993 and then a few 1986 finals games... it's clear to me who the better offensive player was.

  9. #54
    Facts Are Misleading
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    And as for Duncan... he is far more accomplished than Bird as far as his resume goes, and his resume is still growing.

    Take a look at Duncans finals/regular season MVP's, all-nba 1st and 2nd team selections, all-nba defense slections.... it's better than Birds.

    Has has four rings as the undisputable best player on his team (Only Jordan & Russell have as many being the udisputable best player)

    As far as longevity goes, Duncan will have him there as well... probably by a lot.

    The ONLY thing that Bird has an edge in is prime years, but how does that overcome Duncan's edge in the two other key factors in greatness?

    I'm not sold that Bird was completely better player than Duncan in his prime either. Duncan was a better rebounder, much much better defender, on par with Bird as an overall offensive player (taking into account how effective they were at creating/making shots for themselves/teammates) and he was something Bird was not - a dominant low post scorer which is so valuable.

    Bird was a better... leader, though who really knows for sure? It's not like WE were around both of them, so we don't know who is better in leading their guys.

    He was a better shooter and more versatile offensive player. He was better in hustle plays. More clutch. Free throw shooter.

    What else? Am I missing something?

    I have to be, right? Because I don't see how Bird is easily, without a doubt better than Duncan here.

    I'm just trying to get someone to make a valid case for Bird here. Instead, I see baseless claims like "bird the best! tough era! better shooter and passer!" and not really going into depth.

    I want someone to make a real argument, because for the life of me I cannot make a solid one for Bird - and I want to... he's my favorite basketball player from those days.

  10. #55
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    You are severely underrating Bird's offense if you're seriously saying Duncan is on par with him in that category. And while Duncan is a better low-post scorer, you have to remember Bird played PF for 5 years and was one of the most creative post scorers of all time.

    The amount Jordan is a better scorer is the same that Bird is better as a playmaker. Jordan was a good passer, yes, but Bird was one of the best ever.

    As for Duncan and his claim for greatness, well, IMO he never reached that top 8 GOAT level in his prime. His achievements speak for themselves, but everyone of these great as achieved a lot, so peak play becomes decisive.

  11. #56
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    Quote Originally Posted by Carbine
    I think Bird would tell you himself Jordan was better than him.
    Larry Bird:

  12. #57
    Great college starter
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    Bird via nostalgia.

  13. #58
    Winning>Stats
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    3 different types of player. like comparing Hip-Hop to country to classical.

  14. #59
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    Quote Originally Posted by Horatio33
    3 different types of player. like comparing Hip-Hop to country to classical.
    Classic wins

  15. #60
    I don't get picked last at the park anymore Aussie Outcast's Avatar
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    Default Re: What makes Bird greater than Shaq/Duncan?

    I would want Larry bird on my team over the other two. He was just that good. If you havent seen him play in his prime on a nightly basis can you please not respond to this thread.

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