Magic Johnson's only advantage over Larry Bird is longevity

[BlackVVaves]

Magic isn't even top ten. Lamar Odom would dominate the early 80's. Serious. We need to base rankings due to eras. The NBA before 98 was ****ing laughable.

Go tell it on the mountains. Over the hills. And everywhere.

[navy]

Nah, I believe in February they traded for McAdoo, so they didn't have a first round pick that year (79).

Ill take your word for it.

[Big#50]

Go tell it on the mountains. Over the hills. And everywhere.

Whatever. Magic didn't even have a jump shot. Saw him in about 200 games. The NBA is the only sport where people don't admit to eras being different.

[Micku]

Did Magic really had more talent though.

Mchale, Parish and DJ were all great players. Kareem of course were better than all of them but was Kareem and Worthy enough to offset that trio?

Earlier in their career yeah.

Kareem was considered MVP in Magic's rookie season, the best C and best player in the league. That was more than Bird got in his rookie season. And they still had Jamaal Wilkes and Norm Nixon.

The Lakers had the best talent all the way until the 1984-85 season imo when Mchale got better, Ainge and Wedman.

[Big#50]

Earlier in their career yeah.

Kareem was considered MVP in Magic's rookie season, the best C and best player in the league. That was more than Bird got in his rookie season. And they still had Jamaal Wilkes and Norm Nixon.

The Lakers had the best talent all the way until the 1984-85 season imo when Mchale got better, Ainge and Wedman.

The Lakers were the NBA's darling and they still got whooped 4 times in the finals during Magic's era. Magic is nothing more than Beasley with better attitude and work ethic.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

I was looking thru google news for Bird VS Magic a while ago and up until 87/88 it was literally NO QUESTION that Bird was better. Every article, newspaper i could find said the same things EVEN LA times. Bird was getting GOAT talks, Red (who coached Russell and against Wilt) said Bird might be greatest ever.

Then Birds back got fcked and Magic closed the gap. Fact is when they were both healthy and in prime Bird was EASILY the better player.

Much better shooter
better scorer
much better defender
better rebounder
better offball
not far away passing/playmaking

Magic never reached the level Larry was at in 84 or 86 and 88 Bird is the best offensive season in NBA history.

[Micku]

The Lakers were the NBA's darling and they still got whooped 4 times in the finals during Magic's era. Magic is nothing more than Beasley with better attitude and work ethic.

They dominated the 80s with Magic and Kareem. They only missed the Finals twice in that 10 year span. Won five times. Magic put up some great stats, and beat the Celtics 2/3 times. It was the best era of the Lakers for success.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

And the 80s East WAS WAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY better than 80s West. The gap was the same as 2000s East and 2000s West

[bdreason]

I think this is a commonly excepted opinion. Many believe Bird had a higher peak, but Magic had a longer, and more successful prime.

[SHAQisGOAT]

Said it before, when they were both (considerably) healthy, Bird was (considered) the best player for the most part, he had a better overall peak than Magic, played in a better conference, faced better competition at SF and Magic had better teammates on average (not that Bird never had it better, for example in 1986).
Magic has a bit more longevity, 2 more titles and his fame grew bigger than Bird's, as a blackman in a blackmen's sport, always in the spotlight opposite from Bird.

Whatever. Magic didn't even have a jump shot. Saw him in about 200 games. The NBA is the only sport where people don't admit to eras being different.

On the regular, he wouldn't just kill you from the outside, nor shooting off the dribble, and so on, but by his 4th year you really couldn't leave him open from mid or else he'd bury you. In the 1984 Finals, Celtics gave him the jumper, to prevent his passing, driving and post-game, while double teaming Kareem, and he wound up shooting 55% from mid-range, for example. He's a career 85% FT shooter, peaking at 91%, he was many times amongst the best in TS%, he always improved his 3pt shooting despite not coming up with the line and never needing it all that much, and he made plenty of clutch 3's too.
Now, imagine something like prime Rondo on offense, make him 6'8 with one of the best post-games in the league, with a much better ability to knock down mid-range jumpers, shooting 85% or more from the ft line...
No you didn't see him, stop lying, or else you'd know this.
Yea you can make a great argument for this era being weaker

Magic isn't even top ten. Lamar Odom would dominate the early 80's. Serious. We need to base rankings due to eras. The NBA before 98 was ****ing laughable.

The Lakers were the NBA's darling and they still got whooped 4 times in the finals during Magic's era. Magic is nothing more than Beasley with better attitude and work ethic.

Seriously, someone should ban this ****ing tool.

[BoutPractice]

Always a difficult comparison. One thing I've noticed is that Magic tends to be underrated as a scorer (he proved he could easily create his own shot, and like others have said, leaving peak Magic him open from midrange was more a way to "pick your poison" than to truly contain him), whereas Bird is very underrated as an all-around player (but slightly overrated as a scorer). They're both incredibly well rounded, and their "standout" skills are really the same: passing, court vision and basketball IQ. If there's any meaningful difference, it's not passing VS scoring but on ball VS off ball.

[Champ]

Some good posts in this thread. Nice to see a good dialogue

Lots of parity between both teams, with neither holding a clear talent advantage up until Bird's injury in '89. I don't agree with those who claim Magic was surrounded by better talent. Yes, he had Kareem, but Bird's teams were often as good or better and as deep or deeper.

I think you could argue, to some degree, that Bird actually had the better team around him during several seasons in the '80s, but failed to come away with rings either due to injuries, unfavorable playoff matchups leading up to the Finals, or both. In fact, the Celtics had the better regular season record from 79' through '88 while playing in the tougher conference.

This highlights at least one clear advantage Magic had over Bird that ultimately contributed to more career success - better post-season health for both himself and key teammates. This is not to take anything away from Magic, who, along with Worthy and Kareem, proved himself to be a superb post-season performer. It's just unfortunate we didn't see more collisions between these two great rivals when both sides were healthly and in top-form.

Key injuries hurt the Celtics in at least two seasons where they were arguably better than the Lakers: '81-82 (Archibald) and '84-85 (Bird and Maxwell).

Injuries again hurt the Celtics in '87 (McHale, Parish, Walton). What NBA fan wouldn't have loved to see this series with both teams healthy and at full-strength. As with the early-80s rivalry with the Sixers, once again we saw how a brutally-physical rivalry (Celtics-Pistons) again indirectly aided the Lakers in both '87 and '88.

I think there's a tendency to underrate just how good some of those Celtics teams were and the talent surrounding Bird during most of the 80s. He did benefit from this, just as Magic fed of his own surrounding talent.

Rejuvenated by youth, the C's made one last run during their often-overlooked '90-91 campaign. Not saying that they could've beaten the Bulls, but had they stayed healthy, they certainly would've posed a greater challenge, having the ability to get past the Pistons in the ECSF.

[eliteballer]

Magic was 3 years younger than Bird and STILL outplayed PEAK Bird in 2 out of 3 finals, and his numbers in the 84 finals were better as well.

Magic's playoff and finals run his rookie year are arguably better than ANY Bird ever had and also included beating the defending champs in the WC and a super team in the finals.

He was more versatile by virtue of his ballhandling ability, he led the league in steals(Bird never did), and his rebounding from the PG SPOT was just as good as Birds.

Not to mention Bird benefited from white east coast media bias.

[Rodmantheman]

I personally think Bird was better but they were so evenly matched.

[Marlo_Stanfield]

MAgic>Bird
that nignog would probably be considered the GOAt if he didnt retire because of Aids