Top 3 Power Forwards of All-Time

[Brunch@Five]

1) McHale might just be the most overrated player of all time. He at no point showed that he could be a team leader, really put a team on his back. Was a 6th man for half of his career. Had only one statistically overwhelming season. Was a black hole on offense and didn't create for others. There is absolutely no reason for him to be ranked over players like Dirk or KG. I'm not saying that his career could not have played out differently on another team, but his resum

[Scoooter]

I want Kblaze to get in here and lay some truth down on Karl Malone.

[G.O.A.T]

I can't give the nod to KG because Dirk always outplayed him head-to-head and has had far more team success as the #1 option.

A lot of people seem to think so, but that was not the case.

Head-to-head KG has superior numbers.

In 12 meetings from 2003-04 to 2006-07 Garnett posted better numbers in 11 of 12 meetings.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...1&p2=nowitdi01

[Brunch@Five]

A lot of people seem to think so, but that was not the case.

Head-to-head KG has superior numbers.

In 12 meetings from 2003-04 to 2006-07 Garnett posted better numbers in 11 of 12 meetings.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...1&p2=nowitdi01

was referring mostly to the playoff series when Dirk dropped 33/16 per game on the best defensive PF ever and swept him out of the playoffs. While KG played great too that series, to me it cemented him not being better than Dirk in any way, shape or form.

[chazzy]

How much do you guys factor in head to head play when evaluating two players? If one player outplays another in their matchups, but the other player is better against everyone else.. what do you take away from that?

[G.O.A.T]

was referring mostly to the playoff series when Dirk dropped 33/16 per game on the best defensive PF ever and swept him out of the playoffs. While KG played great too that series, to me it cemented him not being better than Dirk in any way, shape or form.

Than you should have said that and not "Always" which something totally different.

You should have said "Dirk was better than KG the only time I remember them going to head to head."

[DMAVS41]

How much do you guys factor in head to head play when evaluating two players? If one player outplays another in their matchups, but the other player is better against everyone else.. what do you take away from that?

Head to head should not be a huge factor unless its two players that play the same position playing each other many many times throughout their careers.

In the case of Dirk and KG is almost useless. The only thing the 02 series should show is that KG was not on "another level" than Dirk. That is all. Nothing more should be read into a 3 game series.

[Harison]

was referring mostly to the playoff series when Dirk dropped 33/16 per game on the best defensive PF ever and swept him out of the playoffs. While KG played great too that series, to me it cemented him not being better than Dirk in any way, shape or form.

Cherry picking much? Thats 3 games sample, with KG having 24.0/18.7/5.0 and dropping 31/18/4/2/3 game and still losing to better team.

When we check bigger sample of prime vs prime, KG outplayed Dirk very often, and thats before we get to part where KG is elite defensive anchor, and Dirk anchors... what? Its easier to just focus on scoring than to play both ends of the floor. So how does that translate to "I can't give the nod to KG because Dirk always outplayed him head-to-head"

You can as well pick samples of games where Dirk burned Duncan, or Amare did the same, Duncan is no longer better than them either? Think about it for a second.

[Brunch@Five]

Than you should have said that and not "Always" which something totally different.

You should have said "Dirk was better than KG the only time I remember them going to head to head."

What happens in the playoffs certainly is the most relevant head-to-head sample we can get. Seriously, who cares about head-to-head in the regular season? Does anyone know whether Hakeem had better stats than DRob in the regular season? Only thing everyone knows is that Hakeem punked him when they met in the playoffs. Same as Dirk with KG. KG flamed out at home with a 22 points 9/19 FG 6 TO performance that series while Dirk had 39 on 11/17 FG with only 3 TO (and as many steals). That was pre-prime Dirk vs prime KG.

Before KG went to Boston, he had 6 games out of 47 where he shot better than 50% from the field. He had 8 shooting worse than 40%...

He's a great player, no doubt, but he can't carry his team on his back offensively like Dirk, and this is the biggest asset your star player can have.

[Skep]

I want Kblaze to get in here and lay some truth down on Karl Malone.

Kblaze is a known Malone hater. All of his arguments involve off the court stuff about Karl. Nothing to do with how he played. Pretty sure Kblaze has daddy issues.

[Harison]

What happens in the playoffs certainly is the most relevant head-to-head sample we can get. Seriously, who cares about head-to-head in the regular season? Does anyone know whether Hakeem had better stats than DRob in the regular season? Only thing everyone knows is that Hakeem punked him when they met in the playoffs. Same as Dirk with KG. KG flamed out at home with a 22 points 9/19 FG 6 TO performance that series while Dirk had 39 on 11/17 FG with only 3 TO (and as many steals). That was pre-prime Dirk vs prime KG.

Before KG went to Boston, he had 6 games out of 47 where he shot better than 50% from the field. He had 8 shooting worse than 40%...

He's a great player, no doubt, but he can't carry his team on his back offensively like Dirk, and this is the biggest asset your star player can have.

Again, basing which player is better by few cherry picked games only, even if its Playoffs, is not very bright. Lets pick MVP Dirk 1st seed being swepped by 8th seed Warriors and conclude he is a bad player and a choker. Garnett never lost in the Playoffs when his team was favorite. Dirk? Many times. Stick has two ends, if you want to cherry pick basing on few games.

[DMAVS41]

Again, basing which player is better by few cherry picked games only, even if its Playoffs, is not very bright. Lets pick MVP Dirk 1st seed being swepped by 8th seed Warriors and conclude he is a bad player and a choker. Garnett never lost in the Playoffs when his team was favorite. Dirk? Many times. Stick has two ends, if you want to cherry pick basing on few games.

Many times?

The Mavs under achieved twice technically. 07 losing to the warriors and 10 losing to the spurs.

Every other year the Mavs went farther than expected or lost when expected.

[rmt]

What happens in the playoffs certainly is the most relevant head-to-head sample we can get. Seriously, who cares about head-to-head in the regular season? Does anyone know whether Hakeem had better stats than DRob in the regular season? Only thing everyone knows is that Hakeem punked him when they met in the playoffs. Same as Dirk with KG. KG flamed out at home with a 22 points 9/19 FG 6 TO performance that series while Dirk had 39 on 11/17 FG with only 3 TO (and as many steals). That was pre-prime Dirk vs prime KG.

Before KG went to Boston, he had 6 games out of 47 where he shot better than 50% from the field. He had 8 shooting worse than 40%...

He's a great player, no doubt, but he can't carry his team on his back offensively like Dirk, and this is the biggest asset your star player can have.

This (to me) is what makes these all-time discussions interesting. Is it the getting there (say to the NBA Finals) or is it the carrying the team in game 7s/crunch situation? Do you prefer the defense from KG (which Dirk has gotten from Chandler this year) or the clutchness of Dirk in crunch times?

As I've watched this year's playoffs from Randolph to Dirk to Lebron, it seems to me that it's the ability to come through in the clutch that's more important as the team's defense can be had in other (lesser) players. The team that has the most (unstoppable) player is usually the one that wins.

It makes me appreciate how very special it is to have players that deliver both and why (historically) dominant two-way big men have been the foundation of the majority of championships.

To the poster who has McHale as #2, sure his post moves are great but he never had to carry a team or be the focal point of a team the way the other PFs have.

[GOBB]

Now Dirk a top 5 PF of all time. He mustve played very well last night.

Oh wait.

[G.O.A.T]

What happens in the playoffs certainly is the most relevant head-to-head sample we can get. Seriously, who cares about head-to-head in the regular season?

Well again, you said always. But obviously you'd rather be wrong and not admit it than just learn something.