Last Lakers game was Elgin Baylor night. If you havent seen how good he was DO IT NOW

[STATUTORY]

do you know what frame speed is bro?

the crowd is moving in regular speed

[LAZERUSS]

Satch Sanders would be Lebron's iso opponent in a game against the Celtics... exact same measurements as Kawhi Leonard (and we all know how that length bothered Lebron) and along side Gus Johnson was considered (by Elgin) to be the best defensive forward of the 1960's. Not to mention Bill Russell was the guy right behind him protecting the rim as good and relentlessly as anyone in NBA history has ever been capable of.

Lebron can't score 50 points on the Spurs in the Finals with 3 point shots against Kawhi and an absolutely ancient totally unathletic (especially relative to Russell) Tim Duncan. Both of whom dedicate their energy in a balanced fashion on both ends, not just defensively like the Russell and Satch front court of the Celtics.

I don't even care about pace, by matchup alone on his best most perfect night Lebron isn't capable of scoring 50 on the 1962 Celtics in a Finals game let alone 61. Lebron isn't a scorer at heart, Elgin was. Knowing how he played against the current Spurs the 1960's Celtics would be his worst matchup nightmare possible as far as scoring points is concerned, even if everything went well for him and he got every lucky bounce and was hot. Still wouldn't crack 50. It's just not the way he plays, it never has been. He likely wouldn't crack 35 to be honest unless his teammates were absolutely terrible and not making their own shots, and that would be by his own design. He looks to pass more than to score compared to Elgin (though Elgin had as good a court vision as just about anyone, he just looked to shoot more).

THIS is a GREAT post.

This addresses the ignorant and uneducated fans that honestly believe that if you could transport today's players back into the 60's and 70's, and that they would shatter the scoring records.

Think about this...Shaq's career HIGH game was 61 points. He played 45 minutes in a 20 point blowout of a 12-47 Clippers team. In that game, the Clippers started one of the biggest busts of all-time at center, Michael Olawakandi, who played 14 minutes...and managed to get 5 fouls in that time. The rest of the game, Shaq was either defended by the 6-9 Anthony Avent (who had 4 fouls in 16 minutes), the 6-7 Eric Piatkowski, or else, NO ONE at all. Just watch the game...the Clippers had no interest in defending him. They had long since mailed it in, and would "coast" to a 15-67 record. I'm sorry, but a prime Kareem, and certainly a prime Chamberlain, would have had no problems hanging 60+ on that Clipper team.

How often did Shaq throw up a 40 point game against the Robinson-led Spurs in the playoffs?

Bird had one 60 point game...and the OPPOSING players were cheering him on. Where were his 50+ point games in the post-season?

This is not a knock on Shaq, or Bird ... but it speaks volumes about just how difficult it is/was to score 50-60+ points against MEANINGFUL competition in a MEANINGFUL game.

And I get a kick out of those that disparage Wilt's numbers because of "pace" or "competition." During Wilt's 14 seasons, there were a TOTAL of 37 60+ point games. Again...TOTAL of 37 60+ point games. Baylor had FOUR of them, West had ONE,...and Wilt...32! That was IT.

Take Wilt's 32 out of the equation, and the decade of the 60's had no more 60+ point games, than any other decade.

And Baylor's 61, in a key title game, and against one of the greatest defensive teams in NBA history, speaks volumes about just how great he was.

[La Frescobaldi]

the crowd is moving in regular speed

lol yeah that's true they are sitting at the same pace regardless of frame speed

[iamgine]

The everyday top-10 is choke-full of plays that I've seen before and equally full of bad defense, and I don't see this pose any problem to knowledgeable fans.

It's everyday top 10 today vs hand picked from the 60s tho. Both

[LAZERUSS]

It's everyday top 10 today vs hand picked from the 60s tho. Both

You do realize that less than 2% of Wilt's entire NBA career is on video, right?

Same with just about most everyone else I listed.

Hell, other than the '62 ASG, we don't even have ONE of Chamberlain's 271 40+ point NBA games in video. Don't you think that perhaps he might have had at least a couple of more highlight moments in his career, in which he did something that was almost physically impossible...as were often witnessed first hand by so many players, coaches, and fans?

[CavaliersFTW]

It's everyday top 10 today vs hand picked from the 60s tho. Both

lol at hand picked... that's everything I've got bro. 2% of Elgins career field goals exists on film, I've counted. This is about the same relative amount as what is available of Wilt and once I finish my Oscar video I'll do another count, and I expect a similarly low amount. Even less exists of guys like Gus Johnson and Bob Cousy, guys who played more in the prior decade and/or on a lower market team. And the sources for anyone back then are very random, and generally bias towards the end of their careers.

So a random 2% of field goals of Elgin ..I don't remember the exact count off hand but whoever wants to count to verify there's only 8-12 dunks of Elgin that exist on film. Given the random nature of the 2%, that implies Elgin threw down 400 to 600 times and that's basically how many of Elgin's career dunks on film we're missing. Given that he posterized Bill Russell twice in the random 2%, and 2 or 3 other dunks were contested posters, that implies he acquired several hundred posters in his career.

Shouldn't I "hand pick" those? Maybe make an Elgin top 100 poster mix like has been done for MJ or Vince Carter? The math indicates there should be plenty to choose from lemme just contact the NBA to release every minute of 60's footage to allow these old mixes that are "hand picked"

[DaRkJaWs]

lol at hand picked... that's everything I've got bro. 2% of Elgins career field goals exists on film, I've counted. This is about the same relative amount as what is available of Wilt and once I finish my Oscar video I'll do another count, and I expect a similarly low amount. Even less exists of guys like Gus Johnson and Bob Cousy, guys who played more in the prior decade and/or on a lower market team. And the sources for anyone back then are very random, and generally bias towards the end of their careers.

So a random 2% of field goals of Elgin ..I don't remember the exact count off hand but whoever wants to count to verify there's only 8-12 dunks of Elgin that exist on film. Given the random nature of the 2%, that implies Elgin threw down 400 to 600 times and that's basically how many of Elgin's career dunks on film we're missing. Given that he posterized Bill Russell twice in the random 2%, and 2 or 3 other dunks were contested posters, that implies he acquired several hundred posters in his career.

Shouldn't I "hand pick" those? Maybe make an Elgin top 100 poster mix like has been done for MJ or Vince Carter? The math indicates there should be plenty to choose from lemme just contact the NBA to release every minute of 60's footage to allow these old mixes that are "hand picked"

We should do a random sample of Shaq's games and put it on video for 45 minutes as well so we can compare the two. Then we'll get these mofos to start crying that the videos we are showing aren't shaq at his best, and then we can really catch them in the proverbial rabbit hole.

[funnystuff]

Players in this time literally do not look brain smart the way they move around.

[3ball]

people like to hate and say that elgin played high school competition.

well, how many 6'5" high school kids average 20 rebounds per game?

how many HS kids taller than 6'5" do that?

how many 6'5" high school kids average 20 rebounds a game while playing a team with wilt chamberlain or Bill Russell 24 times per regular season...

and played oscar's royals another 12 times.... only 8 teams in the whole league - that would be like a league with only okc, spurs, dallas, warriors, clips, toronto, washington and houston in the league and a SG averaged 20 rebounds per game.

haters need to chill and learn about the game.

[Psileas]

Players in this time literally do not look brain smart the way they move around.

Agreed, which is why more and more people have started getting tired of 82 game seasons. Players are way too well payed and protected to take games, at least regular season ones, seriously. Result? Too much randomness, no ball movement, a crapload of low efficiency shots taken, and most fans even enjoy this thing, ignoring the much brainier, strategic and efficient game of teams like the Spurs.

[3ball]

.

Elgin Baylor Top Ten (from the 1% of footage we have of him)






... Standard Paint-Camping (Wilt Waiting)


... Poster AND1 Over Bill Russell











...Another poster over Russell











we see lebron routinely get contained for 15 point and 22 point impactless nights against boris diaw, fossil pierce, and unathletic teams like the Spurs and Mavs.

the notion that he could get 61 points in the Finals against the goat confidence and swag of Bill Russell's 4-time, defending back-to-back-to-back-to-back champions, is ridiculous.

lebron would crap his paints, let alone get 61 shooting the shots he hates the most - mid-range and all contested, low-percentage two-pointers - no waiting for the easy stuff like he tries to do today.

therefore, elgin > lebron.
.

[Dro]

THIS is a GREAT post.

This addresses the ignorant and uneducated fans that honestly believe that if you could transport today's players back into the 60's and 70's, and that they would shatter the scoring records.

Think about this...Shaq's career HIGH game was 61 points. He played 45 minutes in a 20 point blowout of a 12-47 Clippers team. In that game, the Clippers started one of the biggest busts of all-time at center, Michael Olawakandi, who played 14 minutes...and managed to get 5 fouls in that time. The rest of the game, Shaq was either defended by the 6-9 Anthony Avent (who had 4 fouls in 16 minutes), the 6-7 Eric Piatkowski, or else, NO ONE at all. Just watch the game...the Clippers had no interest in defending him. They had long since mailed it in, and would "coast" to a 15-67 record. I'm sorry, but a prime Kareem, and certainly a prime Chamberlain, would have had no problems hanging 60+ on that Clipper team.

How often did Shaq throw up a 40 point game against the Robinson-led Spurs in the playoffs?

Bird had one 60 point game...and the OPPOSING players were cheering him on. Where were his 50+ point games in the post-season?

This is not a knock on Shaq, or Bird ... but it speaks volumes about just how difficult it is/was to score 50-60+ points against MEANINGFUL competition in a MEANINGFUL game.

And I get a kick out of those that disparage Wilt's numbers because of "pace" or "competition." During Wilt's 14 seasons, there were a TOTAL of 37 60+ point games. Again...TOTAL of 37 60+ point games. Baylor had FOUR of them, West had ONE,...and Wilt...32! That was IT.

Take Wilt's 32 out of the equation, and the decade of the 60's had no more 60+ point games, than any other decade.

And Baylor's 61, in a key title game, and against one of the greatest defensive teams in NBA history, speaks volumes about just how great he was.

Good post but are you sure it wasn't Keith Closs that Shaq was playing against that game? Or the "great" Keith Closs as Shaq put it........

[Dro]

Elgin doing Eurosteps before folks even knew Europe had good basketball players

[3ball]

Elgin doing Eurosteps before folks even knew Europe had good basketball players

the move was a popular common move back then

[3ball]

Elgin doing Eurosteps before folks even knew Europe had good basketball players

It wasn't just Elgin - the wrongly-named "euro-step" was COMMON:





















the only reason it's called the "eurostep" is because people are dumb... literally.. it's like saying white people invented rock-n-roll...

no surprise - pretty standard procedure historically for white people to take something black people did, and take it over and act like it was theirs to begin with...

even today's game of basketball - the whole game has been europeanized....