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Wilt Davis
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
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NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
Originally Posted by PP34Deuce
Lebron would have been their best athlete, playmaker, and scorer
Lebron's massive scoring deficit (5.5 ppg) on worse efficiency across the board isn't offset by his 1.0 assist edge (with higher turnovers) and 2.5 defensive rebound edge (with more turnovers).
So sorry.... "flipping" things doesn't work here and doesn't work MOST of the time - it makes things backwards.
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Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
Originally Posted by 3ball
Lebron's massive scoring deficit (5.5 ppg) on worse efficiency across the board isn't offset by his 1.0 assist edge (with higher turnovers) and 2.5 defensive rebound edge (with more turnovers).
So sorry.... "flipping" things doesn't work here and doesn't work MOST of the time - it makes things backwards.
Continously copy and paste stats stats. Mr Morey there's no reaching you.
Flipping the situation gives a less biased agenda. Those Bulls teams pre first 3 peat had scorers that weren't fed the ball unless forced to because Jordan had no shot to score. Lebron would maximize that team because of his versatility and all around ability to carry less talented teams. The 5.5ppg differential could be made up with better ball movement.
Bring on your copy paste Mr Morey. I'm ready.
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Lol
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
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NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
Originally Posted by PP34Deuce
I'd argue that Lebron would have lead those old Chicago teams further than Jordan did.
[COLOR="black"]There's all these intangibles when guys touch the ball. The magic and bird effect.[/COLOR]
[COLOR="DarkRed"]Lebron achieves his stats by lowering his teammates' PPG and APG.
Specifically, he turns them into play-finishers by lowering their APG (playmaking) and increasing their assisted rate (play-finishing):[/COLOR]
[COLOR="White"]................................................[/COLOR]APG, ASSIST %[COLOR="White"].......[/COLOR] ASSISTED RATE
Wade [COLOR="Navy"]before[/COLOR] Lebron (04'-10'):[COLOR="White"].....[/COLOR] 6.6, 34.8%[COLOR="White"]..................[/COLOR]29.2% [COLOR="DarkGreen"]<---- links to nba.com data[/COLOR]
Wade [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR][COLOR="White"]...[/COLOR] Lebron (11'-14'):[COLOR="white"].....[/COLOR] 4.7, 25.5%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR]40.3%
Irving [COLOR="Navy"]before[/COLOR] Lebron (12'-14'):[COLOR="white"]....[/COLOR] 5.8, 33.2%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR]31.9%
Irving [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR][COLOR="white"]...[/COLOR] Lebron[COLOR="white"]..[/COLOR] (2015):[COLOR="white"].....[/COLOR] 5.0, 25.6%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR]32.7%
Bosh [COLOR="Navy"]before[/COLOR] Lebron (04'-10'):[COLOR="white"]......[/COLOR] 2.2, 10.5%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR]55.8%
Bosh [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR][COLOR="white"]...[/COLOR] Lebron (11'-14'):[COLOR="white"]......[/COLOR] 1.6, 8.0%[COLOR="white"] ...................[/COLOR]71.6%
CONTINUED IN NEXT POST.....
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NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
.
CONTINUED FROM PREVIOUS POST.....
[COLOR="White"]................................................[/COLOR]APG, ASSIST %[COLOR="White"].......[/COLOR] ASSISTED RATE
Love [COLOR="Navy"]before[/COLOR] Lebron (09'-14'):[COLOR="white"]......[/COLOR] 2.5, 13.0%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR]62.7%
Love [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR] [COLOR="White"]...[/COLOR]Lebron (15'-16'):[COLOR="white"]......[/COLOR] 2.3, 11.4%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR]80.0%
Mo Will [COLOR="Navy"]before[/COLOR] Lebron (05'-08'):[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] 5.7, 30.2%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR]39.2%
Mo Will [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR]... Lebron (09'-10'):[COLOR="white"]..[/COLOR] 4.6, 22.3%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR]47.6%
FYI...
Pippen [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR][COLOR="white"]...[/COLOR] Jordan 91'-93':[COLOR="White"]......[/COLOR] 6.5, 24.5%
Pippen [COLOR="Navy"]w/out[/COLOR] Jordan 94'-95':[COLOR="white"]......[/COLOR] 5.4, 23.7%
Pippen [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR][COLOR="White"]...[/COLOR] Jordan 96'-98':[COLOR="white"]......[/COLOR] 5.8, 25.1%
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NBA Legend
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
Originally Posted by 3ball
.
CONTINUED FROM PREVIOUS POST.....
[COLOR="White"]................................................[/COLOR] APG, ASSIST %[COLOR="White"].......[/COLOR] ASSISTED RATE
Love [COLOR="Navy"]before[/COLOR] Lebron (09'-14'):[COLOR="white"]......[/COLOR] 2.5, 13.0%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR] 62.7%
Love [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR] [COLOR="White"]...[/COLOR]Lebron (15'-16'):[COLOR="white"]......[/COLOR] 2.3, 11.4%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR] 80.0%
Mo Will [COLOR="Navy"]before[/COLOR] Lebron (05'-08'):[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] 5.7, 30.2%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR] 39.2%
Mo Will [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR]... Lebron (09'-10'):[COLOR="white"]..[/COLOR] 4.6, 22.3%[COLOR="white"]..................[/COLOR] 47.6%
FYI...
Pippen [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR][COLOR="white"]...[/COLOR] Jordan 91'-93':[COLOR="White"]......[/COLOR] 6.5, 24.5%
Pippen [COLOR="Navy"]w/out[/COLOR] Jordan 94'-95':[COLOR="white"]......[/COLOR] 5.4, 23.7%
Pippen [COLOR="DarkRed"]with[/COLOR][COLOR="White"]...[/COLOR] Jordan 96'-98':[COLOR="white"]......[/COLOR] 5.8, 25.1%
How do you explain JR Smith?
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Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
[QUOTE=tmacattack33]2.5 rebounds is a pretty sizeable amount. It's a 50% increase over MJ's 5 rebounds per game.
/QUOTE]
2.5 defensive rebounds is literally nothing. Defensive rebounds are a team effort and something players grab 9/10 by default. The real test of rebounding skill has always been offensive rebounds, in which Jordan - a guard - beats Lebron and that is honestly embarassing for Lebron.
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Free the banned users.
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
Originally Posted by TheMarkMadsen
Dude Lebron doesn't even lead his team in scoring and they made the ecf.
Comparisons are over, Pippen would never outscore Jordan while leading the team in scoring to make the ecf.
You don't need to keep doing this
OP has serious issues.
Literally no one actually believes Bran is even close to Jordan.
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NBA Superstar
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
The only aspect of the game Lebron is better than MJ is is transition.
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NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
Originally Posted by AirBonner
How do you explain JR Smith?
an exception..... which MAKES MY POINT
by definition, exceptions prove the existence of a NORM, which is that lebron reduces his teammates apg (playmaking), while increasing their assisted rate (play-finishing).
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NBA All-star
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
[QUOTE=90sgoat]
Originally Posted by tmacattack33
2.5 rebounds is a pretty sizeable amount. It's a 50% increase over MJ's 5 rebounds per game.
/QUOTE]
2.5 defensive rebounds is literally nothing. Defensive rebounds are a team effort and something players grab 9/10 by default. The real test of rebounding skill has always been offensive rebounds, in which Jordan - a guard - beats Lebron and that is honestly embarassing for Lebron.
but offensive rebounding is affected by era. Thanks to coaches like pop and stan van gundy, the trend in the NBA now is to go back on defense to prevent fastbreaks instead of going for offensive rebounds. It's kind of like steals, there's a price for getting them.
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Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
[QUOTE=NBAGOAT]
Originally Posted by 90sgoat
but offensive rebounding is affected by era. Thanks to coaches like pop and stan van gundy, the trend in the NBA now is to go back on defense to prevent fastbreaks instead of going for offensive rebounds. It's kind of like steals, there's a price for getting them.
Yes, but again, MJ was a guard meaning he would not be in rebounding position most of the time on defense. Lebron grabs 1.6 contested defensive rebounds to 5.6 uncontested.
Not really impressive.
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NBA Legend
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
87-93 Jordan, with the intangibles and refined in-between game, was at least a tier above LeBron at his best.
LeBron is with the Duncan's, Bird's and Magic's IMO. Still amazing. Comparing him to Mike though just does him a disservice. No other perimeter player comes really close.
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GOAT
Re: Lebron's "all-round" argument vs. Jordan is pure bs
Originally Posted by Hamtaro CP3KDKG
The only aspect of the game Lebron is better than MJ is is transition.
Transitioning from loser to colluder, yes.
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