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Old 11-08-2019, 01:28 AM   #16
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

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Originally Posted by Shogon
They don't care. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. They absolutely will not stop... ever, even after they get what they want.

This is why governments ultimately do not work and no form of government will ever remain pure long term.

Until we can objectively identify psychopaths and sociopaths with medical devices / artificial intelligence, or figure out how to "cure" these disorders, we will continue to have bad actors in government, bad actors as CEOs, just... bad actors everywhere.
Umm...psychopaths/sociopaths are not really the main reason for that.
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Old 11-08-2019, 06:54 AM   #17
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

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Originally Posted by iamgine
Umm...psychopaths/sociopaths are not really the main reason for that.

They are. I don't know if power makes them psychos or the come to power because they are, but it's obvious that the lack of empathy is a big reason why alot of politicians operate agendas that are malevolent for a huge part of the population.
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Old 11-08-2019, 08:50 AM   #18
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

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Originally Posted by Overdrive
They are. I don't know if power makes them psychos or the come to power because they are, but it's obvious that the lack of empathy is a big reason why alot of politicians operate agendas that are malevolent for a huge part of the population.
Lacking empathy doesn't mean they're psychos. For example, massive amount of kids in Africa are hungry and malnourished. I think almost everyone knows about this. But how many actually spend time to research about it? How many people actually donate? Why are we not empathizing with them? Are we all psychos then?
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Old 11-08-2019, 09:13 AM   #19
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

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Originally Posted by iamgine
Lacking empathy doesn't mean they're psychos. For example, massive amount of kids in Africa are hungry and malnourished. I think almost everyone knows about this. But how many actually spend time to research about it? How many people actually donate? Why are we not empathizing with them? Are we all psychos then?

thats not what empathy means. obviously there not a single person on this planet who spends time researching every needy group on this planet and then donates money to all them... that doesnt mean that empathy doesnt exist.

empathy is the ability to understand and feel another persons emotions. while empathetic people are more likely to help those that are less fortunate, empathy does not mean that a person is constantly compelled to improve the situation of those that are less fortunate. sociopaths/psychopaths lack empathy because they are incapable of feeling or understanding the emotions of others, including the people they hurt with their selfish actions.

Last edited by Nanners : 11-08-2019 at 09:24 AM.
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Old 11-08-2019, 10:01 AM   #20
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

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Originally Posted by Overdrive
They are. I don't know if power makes them psychos or the come to power because they are, but it's obvious that the lack of empathy is a big reason why alot of politicians operate agendas that are malevolent for a huge part of the population.
Correct me if Iím wrong. But a psychopath is not an evil person. A psychopath is someone who doesnít understand( or at least doesnít care about) the difference between doing good and evil.

Meaning for all we know someone like Bernie who might look inherently good might be a psychopath.
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Old 11-08-2019, 10:17 AM   #21
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

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Originally Posted by CelticBaller
Correct me if I’m wrong. But a psychopath is not an evil person. A psychopath is someone who doesn’t understand( or at least doesn’t care about) the difference between doing good and evil.

Meaning for all we know someone like Bernie who might look inherently good might be a psychopath.

you are wrong. a psychopath is defined as a person who has anti-social personality traits - like total disregard for the rights/interests of others or manipulating/exploiting others for personal gain.

bernie is obviously one of the least sociopathic/psychopathic politicians in all of government, he talks as though he empathizes with the less fortunate and cares deeply for the interests of others, and his actions/policies support this.
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Old 11-08-2019, 10:26 AM   #22
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

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Originally Posted by Nanners
you are wrong. a psychopath is defined as a person who has anti-social personality traits - like total disregard for the rights/interests of others or manipulating/exploiting others for personal gain.

bernie is obviously one of the least sociopathic/psychopathic politicians in all of government, he talks as though he empathizes with the less fortunate and cares deeply for the interests of others, and his actions/policies support this.
But psychopaths are known to put up an “act”. Am I wrong for saying this?

Again not trying to take a dig at Bernie or anything, I’m just using him as an example. A psychopath could literally act like an angel just for personal gain
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Old 11-08-2019, 10:30 AM   #23
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

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Originally Posted by Nanners
thats not what empathy means. obviously there not a single person on this planet who spends time researching every needy group on this planet and then donates money to all them... that doesnt mean that empathy doesnt exist.

empathy is the ability to understand and feel another persons emotions. while empathetic people are more likely to help those that are less fortunate, empathy does not mean that a person is constantly compelled to improve the situation of those that are less fortunate. sociopaths/psychopaths lack empathy because they are incapable of feeling or understanding the emotions of others, including the people they hurt with their selfish actions.

First @ shogun, sure congress is filled with psychopaths. TBH, I'm not even against those dudes enriching themselves if they just do what they were voted into office to do. They could be a freaking robot for all I care.

Now @ this, you're right re: empathy, but I don't agree psychopaths have no empathy. I think the understand feelings and emotions of others in regard to many things, it's just really skewed. Their idea of suffering, for instance, may be due to thinking the person is weak or inferior. But like if someone was like dood was poor n he robbed a bank, or dood's wife was cheating on him so he killed her, I think they could empathize with that feeling. haha.

But yea, they are extremely selfish, but there are plenty of extremely selfish people that hurt other people that aren't psychopaths. I think psychopaths KNOW they are hurting people, another sign that they have empathy, but they just don't care; they probably think the people hurt are weak or willing victims. A lot of other people hurt others just because they lack understanding.

A psychopath, ideally, is like a different sort of person. It's something of a predator, and a predator needs instincts, too, to feel what is weak, what has something to offer, but yea they don't care (usually, but when they are slighted and end up murdering someone, or like becoming a serial killer of every blonde hooker cuz they hate their mom, I think that points to them caring about something.)

Generally, they are bad people. Autistic people might lack certain kinds of empathy, too, and I think there's an interesting possible correlation between... psychopathy, autism, and schizophrenia. Not that they are all the same, but that those with the disorders share a lot of the same core traits.

But yea, as you said, absolutely a psychopath ( I am using this as a catch all cuz I dunno how people are differentiating psycho n socio) is a purposefully malignant person. Someone who is extremely selfish and doesn't care is probably not even a psychopath but more of a narcissist. Lacking empathy, like if someone actually had no feelings, they wouldn't be a psychopath just because of that.

My hot take at least haha. As someone with no notable mental health experience.

Also, I'd say congress is probably populated more with narcissists than psychopaths.

-Smak
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Old 11-08-2019, 10:54 AM   #24
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

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Originally Posted by CelticBaller
But psychopaths are known to put up an “act”. Am I wrong for saying this?

Again not trying to take a dig at Bernie or anything, I’m just using him as an example. A psychopath could literally act like an angel just for personal gain

An "act" is temporary or situational, its a disguise used in order to further some other selfish agenda.

If a person puts up an "act" for their entire life then its not an "act"... thats who they actually are.
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Old 11-08-2019, 11:21 AM   #25
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CelticBaller
Correct me if Iím wrong. But a psychopath is not an evil person. A psychopath is someone who doesnít understand( or at least doesnít care about) the difference between doing good and evil.

Meaning for all we know someone like Bernie who might look inherently good might be a psychopath.

not inherently, no. people assume that just because someone is a psychopath it means they are automatically a john wayne gacy type who slaughters people and cannabilizes them for thrills.

but all a psychopath is is someone who is wired differently than the majority of people. external stimuli doesn't affect them like it does everyone else. environment/nurture is key for how a person like that turns out. a high number of ceos and surgeons are psychopaths. think about what kind of person you have to be to be able to slice a person open, rummage through their bloody organs... then go home and have a nice spaghetti dinner with your family.

is that person evil?

Quote:
bernie is obviously one of the least sociopathic/psychopathic politicians in all of government

bernie used you bros to make himself the sort of millionaire he used to rail against.

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Old 11-08-2019, 11:40 AM   #26
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

God is a psychopath and we have billions of people who worship that mofo.
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Old 11-10-2019, 07:37 AM   #27
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogon
Eh, I'd like to believe that if political candidates were factually known to be sociopaths or psychopaths, people wouldn't vote for them. And if people knew who the true psychos were, they wouldn't promote them into positions of power within companies or anywhere else for that matter.
I'd like to believe that too, but two things make me doubtful.

A.) a psychopath on your team can be pretty handy because they don't play by the same rules/have moral constraints that hold normal folks back so I'm sure there are some folks that think these people can be useful.

B.) people can't be trusted to vote for the best qualified candidate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogon
Currently, but there is the plethora of benefits that will arise from true AI if it doesn't just decide to wipe us out.
That AI will be written by flawed people and thus flawed. I see nothing but bad outcomes in this scenario.
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Originally Posted by Shogon
Who is to say that this personality disorder along with other mental disorders isn't something we're able to fix/modify some day.

Hopefully one day we have the means, but I already acknowledged that we currently do not.

Yes, I would want them removed, killed, aborted, whatever... once it's able to be 100% factually proven that they're a psychopath.
I guess we're so far off that it's hard for me to even imagine this ability.
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Originally Posted by Shogon
I don't think I'm an anarchist.
Your previous post echoed many thoughts I've had about government. Can't trust people in power, period. Even if the first gen of the regime is magical, you can be sure the future gens will be more flawed. We've obviously seen it too often throughout history.

I don't agree with many people politically. Never understood why until I took a political spectrum test. You might be interested to take it sometime too.

https://www.politicalcompass.org/

My results - https://www.politicalcompass.org/ana...8.13&soc=-8.26

Turns out I'm pretty hardcore anarchist. I took a similar test years ago and shrugged it off as nothing, but took it again just now and seem to have become more extreme with age.

I find anarchy for whatever reason is a loaded term so I did more reading to understand it.

Ideally, I'd like people to mind their own business and find their own happiness. Obviously, that's not realistic for most. I'd like people to help others out of free will. I'd like a society without leadership, because again I feel power becomes corrupted inevitably with time. I also recognize we are not a smart enough or disciplined enough species to accomplish things without leadership so we have to make best with what we've got. I recognize that none of what I desire is realistic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogon
I just think that unfortunately due to bad actors such as the people we've been talking about, even ones that aren't on the extreme end of the spectrum, as you noted, that no form of government will ever work long term, as they will always be corrupted.
This is what makes me wonder if you might be similar on the above spectrum.
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Originally Posted by Shogon
I don't know what the solution is. I just think the best we could possibly do as a species would be one of two things... an extremely benevolent dictator(lol)
agree, but as stated above, probably only good for a generation or two
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogon
OR a democracy with all of the psychos and socios removed. I just don't know how we get rid of them without some form of massive technological advancement.
This would be ideal, but my problem with this tech is it's created by flawed people, therefore flawed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogon
But there must be a way. I can't imagine that psychopaths will exist throughout the entirety of humanity's future(assuming we don't get wiped out relatively soon or do it ourselves.) Surely there will be a solution eventually.
I think we're getting wiped out by a few opposing psychopaths long before we have a reliable way of sniffing them out and dealing with them before they can cause problems.

Regardless, interesting brainstorming topic.
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Old 11-10-2019, 07:41 AM   #28
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogon
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers....act_id=3185182

Yeah, just a coincidence.



There definitely aren't any more psychopaths in DC than the rest of the country.



Listen, buddy. Just because YOU *WANT* something to be true or not true, doesn't make it ****ing so.

Of course they aren't going to go door to door asking people if they're psychopaths or not, lollllll.
As usual, we've got more than a few people here just talking about stuff off their own preconceived notions instead of just reading and learning.

I think you're completely on target about this.
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Old 11-10-2019, 07:48 AM   #29
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CelticBaller
Correct me if Iím wrong. But a psychopath is not an evil person. A psychopath is someone who doesnít understand( or at least doesnít care about) the difference between doing good and evil.

Meaning for all we know someone like Bernie who might look inherently good might be a psychopath.
A psychopath does not have equals. He views others as means to an end, as objects/pawns to use/disregard on a whim while they achieve their own goals.

Is that evil? I'd say so.

Most important rule in life to me remains the golden one. Treat others as you expect to be treated.

This does not exist in a psychopath/sociopaths mind because they don't recognize that others suffer. Only their suffering exists.

Your Bernie premise is based on your political ideology and not on any psychological ideas.
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Old 11-10-2019, 08:05 AM   #30
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Default Re: Psychopaths & Sociopaths are essentially the human being version of Terminators.

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Originally Posted by ILLsmak
Now @ this, you're right re: empathy, but I don't agree psychopaths have no empathy. I think the understand feelings and emotions of others in regard to many things, it's just really skewed. Their idea of suffering, for instance, may be due to thinking the person is weak or inferior. But like if someone was like dood was poor n he robbed a bank, or dood's wife was cheating on him so he killed her, I think they could empathize with that feeling. haha.
The lack of empathy is the very definition of psychopathy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ILLsmak
But yea, they are extremely selfish, but there are plenty of extremely selfish people that hurt other people that aren't psychopaths. I think psychopaths KNOW they are hurting people, another sign that they have empathy, but they just don't care; they probably think the people hurt are weak or willing victims. A lot of other people hurt others just because they lack understanding.
They don't give two ****s about understanding, thus they are psychopaths.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ILLsmak
Generally, they are bad people. Autistic people might lack certain kinds of empathy, too, and I think there's an interesting possible correlation between... psychopathy, autism, and schizophrenia. Not that they are all the same, but that those with the disorders share a lot of the same core traits.
Perhaps, finally something plausible. This would be an extremely controversial idea however.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ILLsmak
But yea, as you said, absolutely a psychopath ( I am using this as a catch all cuz I dunno how people are differentiating psycho n socio) is a purposefully malignant person.
Psychotic people are the only people that matter in their existence and do not view other people as even human. They are objects.

Sociopaths are similar, but worse in that socios view people as objects that are here to be used by them to succeed. Far, far worse in scale in that they have grander goals.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ILLsmak
Someone who is extremely selfish and doesn't care is probably not even a psychopath but more of a narcissist. Lacking empathy, like if someone actually had no feelings, they wouldn't be a psychopath just because of that.

My hot take at least haha. As someone with no notable mental health experience
.
Clearly, the hottest of takes.

However, brainstorming a bit here, there may be an overlap of narcissism with autism that = psychopathy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ILLsmak
Also, I'd say congress is probably populated more with narcissists than psychopaths.
-Smak
Why not both?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeBlackDude
and surgeons are psychopaths. think about what kind of person you have to be to be able to slice a person open, rummage through their bloody organs... then go home and have a nice spaghetti dinner with your family.

is that person evil?
You know...............I never put two and two together, but I think you may be on to something. Surgeons are in large part, complete ***** and it does take a certain type.

Very interesting thought.
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