Replace Shaq with Wilt on the 96 lakers

[ILLsmak]

I've seen A LOT of Wilt footage, but those are just the highlights that I think showcase him the best...I could have posted the defense video I made also but I didn't...Idk if you were dissing me or what lmao

Nah, I was more referencing that anyone who has valuable insight to offer on this "argument" would know about Wilt and what his skill set/athleticism was.

-Smak

[jongib369]

Nah, I was more referencing that anyone who has valuable insight to offer on this "argument" would know about Wilt and what his skill set/athleticism was.

-Smak

Yeah, you can't put in a real case for or against him unless you've put away your time bias and looked at him and the rest of the league at that time objectively. I'm only 21, and it was just 3 or 4 years ago I got warmed up to the fact that those old dudes COULD in-fact ball with players today....One thing that just made SO much sense was the dribbling rules from back then...Back then you could only dribble with your Palm facing down hitting the top of the ball...So all these fancy dribbles you see today would be called as palming/carrying...

You may have seen this but compare the 2 with that Rule in mind...you don't have to watch the whole thing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ee2Ag5GeMQ

and then

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CzwUXpaxXA

a little knowledge of a rule like that changes EVERYTHING

[senelcoolidge]

Yeah, you can't put in a real case for or against him unless you've put away your time bias and looked at him and the rest of the league at that time objectively. I'm only 21, and it was just 3 or 4 years ago I got warmed up to the fact that those old dudes COULD in-fact ball with players today....One thing that just made SO much sense was the dribbling rules from back then...Back then you could only dribble with your Palm facing down hitting the top of the ball...So all these fancy dribbles you see today would be called as palming/carrying...

You may have seen this but compare the 2 with that Rule in mind...you don't have to watch the whole thing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ee2Ag5GeMQ

and then

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CzwUXpaxXA

a little knowledge of a rule like that changes EVERYTHING

Great example showing Oscar and Iverson. What a difference. Had Iverson played in the 60's he would be called for traveling constantly. He would have to conform to the way players dribbled in the 60's. Likewise Oscar (never being fancy or a show off) would have had more freedom with his dribbling. Perhaps being more creative. More assists as well. Assists were counted differently in those days. It was a direct pass and shoot or make of the basket..no steps. Today assists are counted with a continuation of steps (more leeway).

Wilt would have adjusted his game to an era. He had the tools and gifts to dominate in any era thus far. The 90's had heck of a bunch of good centers. Wilt would have given these guys fits.

[DatAsh]

Wilt defensive Player of the year?

In a league with Hakeem , Mutumbo, Robinson , Zo and Rodman?

It's silly to think that he wouldn't be in the conversation. The only one of those guys I'd personally rate above him defensively is Olajuwon, and even then only by the smallest of margins. 67 Wilt is probably the best defensive season by anyone not named Russell.

[lilgodfather1]

Someone should page Jlauber and tell him to come and defend Wilt's honour.

[ShaqAttack3234]

They might win in the 90s with Jones, Van Exel and Bryant, but I think they'd split up earlier, since Kobe's drive to be the man what be more oppressed by Wilt.

It wasn't a question of talent with those late 90's Laker teams, but they just weren't mature enough. The '97 team probably doesn't beat a 69-13 Bulls team or a 64-18 Jazz team regardless. Not mature enough and Kobe was not a factor yet.

The '98 Lakers had the most talent in the league and the most talent Shaq played with as an elite player other than perhaps the mid 90's Magic. Certainly Shaq's most talented team in his prime.

But they crumbled in the playoffs, they didn't listen to their coach, and just weren't as good or disciplined as teams like Utah and Chicago.

Part of that can be blamed on Shaq, whose leadership and desire to win was questioned in the 90's, and Shaq was disappointing in the '97 playoff loss to Utah.

But to be honest, I trust Shaq more in the playoffs than Wilt, and in '98, Shaq showed a lot of competitiveness and heart. Shaq was dominant throughout the '98 playoffs. His Seattle series was one of the best all around performances I've seen. But what showed more heart was when he was getting zero support vs Utah and despite one of his best games in a must-win situation down 2-0 with 39/15, they lost and he still came back and played until the end in game 4.

In game 4, Shaq had 11 straight points at one point down the stretch and about 19 total in the 4th, iirc to finish with 38 points.

here's what I'm referring to about the Lakers completely choking in the playoffs. Here's their stats vs Utah.

Shaq- 31.8 ppg, 56 FG%
Jones- 15 ppg, 41 FG%
Kobe- 10 ppg, 37 FG%
Fox- 9.8 ppg, 41 FG%
Van Exel- 9 ppg, 24 FG%
Fisher- 5.5 ppg, 35 FG%
Horry- 4.5 ppg, 36 FG%

No player has a chance to beat a 62 win team when every key player fails to shoot even 40%, or at best, 2 of them just top that at 41%(Fox and Jones).

Van Exel's 24% is an embarrassment as was him talking about vacation plans in the timeouts. That's why it wasn't a bad move to trade Nick away for nothing.

But to be honest, trading Eddie Jones and Elden Campbell in their primes away for a past his prime Glen Rice post-elbow surgery was a bad move. Jones was a choker, but he was a much better player after the trade than Rice, and much more of an all around player. Campbell also didn't fit with Shaq, but they could have gotten more in return for a big man with his talent.

[ThunderStruk022]

You know what's almost as annoying as stans? 20 and 30 something year old posters that never saw guys like Wilt play, but think it's cool to go against the grain, and cram players from the 50s, 60s, and 70s down our throats every chance they get.

[joeyjoejoe]

They still get destroyed by utah, lets not pretend like its a huge improvement shaqs no scrub, championship teams need more pieces then one just look at 2011 mavs ppl say they only had dirk but that team was loaded with all the right pieces and even stevenson was big in the playoffs

[Deuce Bigalow]

That's pretty good competition, that's why his numbers would be about 30ppg 16-18 rpg 3-4 apg 4-5 bpg. Weaker competition and his numbers would be higher.

No No No. You did not just type that...

[jongib369]

You know what's almost as annoying as stans? 20 and 30 something year old posters that never saw guys like Wilt play, but think it's cool to go against the grain, and cram players from the 50s, 60s, and 70s down our throats every chance they get.

That could be said...But I'd say people who have probably never been able to watch any amount of footage objectively and put rules into consideration of an era with an obvious and pathetic time bias who go around shitting on others opinions is just as annoying if not more so...That's almost like saying Atheist's are just denying god to go against the grain and be cool....Looking at facts and being able to say "you know what? Sometimes the majority opinion IS borderline retarded" isn't done just to be cool.

(Just playing around and giving back what you gave...this shit is all what ifs and its just my opinion that he would be the best center all around in ANY era he played in...whether it be the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s or 90s or 00's)

[jongib369]

You're replacing Shaq with Poor Man's Javale Mcgee at best..

I think 5 feet weak nonathletic center were already phase out during that time.. So theres no more players for Wilt to dominate..

Take this into consideration

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzbLYYnAsFI&t=0m27s

[jongib369]

No No No. You did not just type that...

Just to say how many quality centers are in the league right now compared to the past? Would any of these centers today give Kareem ANY problem what so ever??? Besides the obvious 2....who Kareem would face 2 or 4 times a year only...Why wouldn't wilt tear apart the league today?

Not that this says anything buuuut



Shaquille O'Neal vs. Patrick Ewing

26 Games

Shaquille O'Neal vs. Alonzo Mourning

16 Games

Shaquille O'Neal vs. David Robinson

23 Games

Shaquille O'Neal vs. Dikembe Mutombo

24 Games

Shaquille O'Neal vs. Ben Wallace

23 Games

Shaquille O'Neal vs. Arvydas Sabonis

21 Games

Shaquille O'Neal vs. Yao Ming

13 Games

Shaquille O'Neal vs. Hakeem Olajuwon

20 Games




Total Games =166


Bill Russell VS Wilt


143 games

Wilt VS Kareem (only 4 years)

28 Games

Total games 171

[clipps]

Wilt beasted Kareem who beasted Hakeem who beasted Shaq who beasted Dwight who beasts the league today so yes. Wilt would demolish this era. /thread

[iamgine]

Wilt beasted Kareem who beasted Hakeem who beasted Shaq who beasted Dwight who beasts the league today so yes. Wilt would demolish this era. /thread

It doesn't work that way.

[clipps]

It doesn't work that way.

B-b-but it happened that way