Barkley: Kobe a top 5 alltime player, better than Magic and Bird and Kareem

[inclinerator]

kobe will never be better then KAREEM!

[Al Thornton]

maine lobstermen

[MayCeltics]

maine lobstermen

Texas Hold'em

[AirJordan&Magic]

kobe will never be better then KAREEM!

[Kurosawa0]

Bill Russel is by far the most overrated player of all time

I'm pretty sure he's the most winning athlete ever.

[Premeditated]

At least he dominated a weak era.

Bill Russel is by far the most overrated player of all time

this too. in fact I'll put Wilt ahead of Russell.

[MrJohnWall]

I'm pretty sure he's the most winning athlete ever.

and if Horry stayed around long enough he could have been too.

Any big man that shoots 40 percent from the field is not a all time great PERIOD!
Especially in that weak ass era

[Kurosawa0]

and if Horry stayed around long enough he could have been too.

Any big man that shoots 40 percent from the field is not a all time great PERIOD!
Especially in that weak ass era

Horry never had remotely the same impact on any team as Russell did on the Celtics. The guy was the best player on 11 championship teams. It's not like Boston just rolled everyone either. They won several games sevens to win those titles.

[ginobli2311]

and if Horry stayed around long enough he could have been too.

Any big man that shoots 40 percent from the field is not a all time great PERIOD!
Especially in that weak ass era

yep. lets just ignore defense/rebounding/leadership. LOL.

Russell is a top 5 player of all time by any standard or measure.

and by the way people....defense/rebounding is more important than offense. its really not even close when it comes to the playoffs.

[Timmy D for MVP]

yep. lets just ignore defense/rebounding/leadership. LOL.

Russell is a top 5 player of all time by any standard or measure.

and by the way people....defense/rebounding is more important than offense. its really not even close when it comes to the playoffs.

I agree. I mentioned a looooong time ago that for me rebounding is the biggest thing in the game of basketball. The key.

And Russell is one of the best. And possibly the best defensive player? Idk I wasn't around to watch him and stats weren't kept on stuff like that. But I'd imagine he'd put the block leaders now to shame.

[MrJohnWall]

yep. lets just ignore defense/rebounding/leadership. LOL.

Russell is a top 5 player of all time by any standard or measure.

and by the way people....defense/rebounding is more important than offense. its really not even close when it comes to the playoffs.

Lol @ leadership

So you would take Dikembe over Carmelo or Durant?
Good offense beats good defense anyday. This isnt football.

You can play unbelievable defense if your not scoring your not winning

Russel is not a top 10 player

[ginobli2311]

I agree. I mentioned a looooong time ago that for me rebounding is the biggest thing in the game of basketball. The key.

And Russell is one of the best. And possibly the best defensive player? Idk I wasn't around to watch him and stats weren't kept on stuff like that. But I'd imagine he'd put the block leaders now to shame.

i don't know who the BEST defender of all time is. i'd put russell/jordan/kareem/duncan/kg/pippen/hakeem/wilt...i'm sure i'm missing a bunch, but those guys are all in the ultra elite defender class.

just look at kg. he's somewhat of a modern russell. most people would tell you that kg is not as good as a guy like bosh or bogut as bigs....but people don't want to talk about kg's impact on the defensive end. he's still an amazing defender...still the most versatile defender in the league (maybe lebron now)...but the point is that his value is actually much higher for winning than we all think.

defense and rebounding wins championships. russell was arguably the best combination of that of all time. i understand career/resume is different, but if we are talking about impact and level of play. kobe has no case over:

jordan
russell
magic
kareem
wilt
duncan
shaq
bird
hakeem

i have kobe next in line at number ten closely followed by guys like oscar/moses

just think of it his way. if you had to pick one of the above players for the 12 best years of their careers....are you really going to pick kobe over any of those 9 guys to start your team? i just don't see any evidence as to why. kobe needs so much more help than a tim duncan to win titles. kobe has been blessed by fantastic circumstances and teams for all but 3 years of his career. the reason this is such a big deal is simply because kobe's level of play has not been up to the standards of the truly elite class of nba players of all time.

nobody would be harping on kobe's team strength if he played better. but when you look back and see that he shoots 40% or worse in the nba finals in over half his games....or that he's never really over-achieved once in his career. it just becomes the obvious talking point. thats why i said game 7 of the finals last year actually hurt kobe's legacy. people laugh, but wetting the bed in arguably your biggest game of your career is just no something that can be overlooked when you are being compared to the top 9 players of all time. kobe's team was good enough to overcome his horrendous play in that game. so i dont know how that is a positive for kobe's legacy. it just doesn't make sense.

[ginobli2311]

Lol @ leadership

So you would take Dikembe over Carmelo or Durant?
Good offense beats good defense anyday. This isnt football.

You can play unbelievable defense if your not scoring your not winning

Russel is not a top 10 player

comparing dikembe to russell is laughable.

a better comparison would be a vastly improved dwight howard if you wanted to be current...and yes i'd take that over carmelo and durant...considering i think howard is more valuable than both of those players right now.

how about david robinson dude. robinson is just a better all around version of howard. he was equal to howard on the glass and on defense and he was a much better offensive player. give me robinson over carmelo or durant all day.

and bill russell has something that robinson didn't. intangibles/leadership...call it what you want. he was a winner. he did what he needed to do to win. if you control the paint and the glass. its almost impossible to lose if you have a good team around you.

you clearly don't understand the game or what wins. people will LOL at you all day for your comments.

LOL

[Rojogaqu11]

Although Kobe has some flaws in his approach to the game, attitude, and constancy of production, overall, skill-wise he is as good as any player that has ever played. This doesn't mean that he is as good an athlete as Jordan, better shooter than Bird, or better court vision than Magic, it only means that he's been such a skilled player in all aspects of basketball, that when looking at his accomplishments and feats throughout his extensive career, there's a general agreement that he's reached a level that only a few select players have matched or surpassed.

Different games, different eras. We could argue statistics and what they mean now, what they meant at the time, but only looking at the big picture we can see that he's a player that has reached that level only the best of the best try to reach. His career is far from over, so let's no be surprised if the analysts and experts are now taking a bet on what most surely will be a valid discussion in the future, when criticism evolves into appreciation.

[MrJohnWall]

comparing dikembe to russell is laughable.

a better comparison would be a vastly improved dwight howard if you wanted to be current...and yes i'd take that over carmelo and durant...considering i think howard is more valuable than both of those players right now.

how about david robinson dude. robinson is just a better all around version of howard. he was equal to howard on the glass and on defense and he was a much better offensive player. give me robinson over carmelo or durant all day.

and bill russell has something that robinson didn't. intangibles/leadership...call it what you want. he was a winner. he did what he needed to do to win. if you control the paint and the glass. its almost impossible to lose if you have a good team around you.

you clearly don't understand the game or what wins. people will LOL at you all day for your comments.

LOL

Where did i compare Russel to dikembe?

Dikembe is all time great defender and a great rebounder with NO offensive skills.
Durant & Carmelo are offensive greats that cant play a lick of defense.

But who would take Dikembe over these guys

Offense> Defense

and thats just common sense

and fact is russel was a all time great defender who cant play a lick of offense

He makes Howard look like Hakeem in the post