How did the blazers manage to lose to the Lakers in 2000?

[ShaqAttack3234]

coming from the guy who uses the Sacramento bee and some random newspaper in texas to prove how Kobe was hindering Shaq.

Or...his own coach saying in the 2000-2001 season that he'd bench Kobe if he had more quickness on the perimeter defensively to fill in for him.

He was ignoring how his coach wanted him to play, and was quoted as saying that he wanted a league MVP and scoring title and couldn't do it in LA. It's obvious that Kobe was playing selfishly in the first half of the season, and he's made comments that make his agenda obvious. He talked about how he had to play better than Vince Carter and Tracy McGrady just to get the same recognition.

It's common knowledge that Kobe was hurting the team early in the 2000-2001 season. It's no coincidence that they went 11-3 with Kobe out of the lineup and really got going because of that due to Kobe playing team basketball when he came back.

You can write it off as me being a hater or whatever, but it's the truth. You lose all credibility when you act like your favorite player is never at fault. That would be like me saying that Shaq doesn't deserve blame for the Lakers underachieving in 2002-2003 during the regular season due to him delaying his toe surgery.

U MAD becuase you spew B.S. trying to say Kobe wasn't viewed as the best allaround player in the NBA/on the Lakers as early as 2001...GTFO. I been following basketball longer then you and have alot more knowlege then you and Pete Newell put together...

Larry Brown has been following basketball longer than either of us, has been in the game for years and said in 2001 that he's never seen a better player than Shaq and followed that up by repeating that he meant it.

all my 4th quarter statistics were correct....the only ones that had discrepencies were the 00' playoff run....

No, you posted his 4th quarter stats for the '02 WCSF and '02 WCF and stated they were 4th quarter stats for the entire '01 and '02 playoff runs.

Kobe was the first option in the 4th quarters for 01' and 02'....and the teams best allaround player...

Funny how well they did without their "best all around player" those 2 seasons. Went 13-3, yet with Shaq out during those 2 seasons, they were barely above .500(12-11)

you would think "Hardcore" fan would have recognized.....but your elitist mentality has got u twisted...

Perhaps some day you'll be interested in facts, but I'll let you go back to this creepy hero worship. If you really are 37 and talk like this and worship a man whose younger than you this much, then I really feel sorry for you.

You're an exact replica of the 15 year old trolls, which is pathetic if you're as old as you claim.

get back in my pocket son..




next

Where the hell did this guy come from?

[AlphaWolf24]

ShaqAttack3234Or...his own coach saying in the 2000-2001 season that he'd bench Kobe if he had more quickness on the perimeter defensively to fill in for him.

He was ignoring how his coach wanted him to play, and was quoted as saying that he wanted a league MVP and scoring title and couldn't do it in LA. It's obvious that Kobe was playing selfishly in the first half of the season, and he's made comments that make his agenda obvious. He talked about how he had to play better than Vince Carter and Tracy McGrady just to get the same recognition.

It's common knowledge that Kobe was hurting the team early in the 2000-2001 season. It's no coincidence that they went 11-3 with Kobe out of the lineup and really got going because of that due to Kobe playing team basketball when he came back.

Here you go again...spewing your same ol' garbage....Kobe was playing outta his mind early in 2001 season....5 straight games of 32PPG - 35PPG..then came..43 vs the Spurs , 40 vs the Mavs , 36 vs A.I. and the sixers (while holding A.I. in check) ,51 vs the Warriors,42 Points on Air Canada (while merking, "vince") , 01' was the emergence of the "Kobe era" , it was the preview of the next 10 years of 28PPG 6REB 5AST as the premiere player of the NBA...you want quotes?....

01' Playoff's (the real NBA Finals) vs the Spurs...Shaq - "Kobe is the best player in the world right now"...Phil - "He is the best allaround player I ever coached"

You can write it off as me being a hater or whatever, but it's the truth. You lose all credibility when you act like your favorite player is never at fault. That would be like me saying that Shaq doesn't deserve blame for the Lakers underachieving in 2002-2003 during the regular season due to him delaying his toe surgery.

Oh Shut the hell up "Shaq Attack" ....U lose all credibility with that stupid screen name and quoting the Sacremento Bee ...you seriously calling others biased fanboys with a screen name of Shaq Attack???...(points)...GTFO!

Larry Brown has been following basketball longer than either of us, has been in the game for years and said in 2001 that he's never seen a better player than Shaq and followed that up by repeating that he meant it.

Great!.....I'll stick with the coaches and players who played with against or Coached Kobe and in some cases Jordan also.....all of them say Kobe is on MJ's level and in some opinions better...

also Many GM's don't feel Shaq is as important as Kobe...who got traded what is it 7 times now?.....

No, you posted his 4th quarter stats for the '02 WCSF and '02 WCF and stated they were 4th quarter stats for the entire '01 and '02 playoff runs.

I posted Both.....many times...you can go look for them.

Funny how well they did without their "best all around player" those 2 seasons. Went 13-3, yet with Shaq out during those 2 seasons, they were barely above .500(12-11)

what's also funny is how many good/great teams Shaq has played on without Kobe, yet he got merked in the Postseason because he didn't have a player with Kobe's ability to take over late in Games....except Wade in 06' getting 30 freethrows.

Shaq played on 7 teams capable of winning it all without KObe....

Kobe replaced Shaq with a soft Euro and turned him into Greatness....




next

Perhaps some day you'll be interested in facts, but I'll let you go back to this creepy hero worship. If you really are 37 and talk like this and worship a man whose younger than you this much, then I really feel sorry for you.

You're an exact replica of the 15 year old trolls, which is pathetic if you're as old as you claim.

creepy hero worship?....ok "Shaq Attack" ...don't feel sorry for me.....your the one reading my posts and Hating, without me you would be reading the Sacremento Bee right now.

I'm just having fun talking hoop and recognizing game....from 7 years old to 37 years old I keep it elementary....

Where the hell did this guy come from?

High in the SKY!!!!..

(opens pocket)

[ShaqAttack3234]

Here you go again...spewing your same ol' garbage....Kobe was playing outta his mind early in 2001 season....5 straight games of 32PPG - 35PPG..then came..43 vs the Spurs , 40 vs the Mavs , 36 vs A.I. and the sixers (while holding A.I. in check) ,51 vs the Warriors,42 Points on Air Canada (while merking, "vince") , 01' was the emergence of the "Kobe era" , it was the preview of the next 10 years of 28PPG 6REB 5AST as the premiere player of the NBA...

As Phil himself said in December 2000 when Kobe was apparently proving to be the best player in the league according to you.

"If we had a little bit better defensive speed and quickness, I'd probably bench him," said Jackson

Oh and this one from his book.

We were having a hard enough time beating teams we had beaten the year before. Shaq put it best on January 15th after an overtime win over Vancouver when he said to the press, "Hey, check it out for yourself; last year at this time we were 30 and 7, this year we're 25-12."

http://books.google.com/books?id=Pfm...20best&f=false

01' Playoff's (the real NBA Finals) vs the Spurs...Shaq - "Kobe is the best player in the world right now"...Phil - "He is the best allaround player I ever coached"

First of all, how were the WCF the "real NBA Finals" when the actual finals were far more competitive? Philly actually won a game and the 5 games were generally close while LA swept San Antonio by 22 ppg.

And to add to that, if playing against Philly was so easy(nevermind Shaq facing a more respected defender than Kobe faced vs Philly or San Antonio) then why didn't Kobe dominate Philly? If Shaq dropping 33/16/5/3 on 57% shooting was easy then why was Kobe only putting up 25/8/6 on 42% shooting?

Oh, and here's the actual quote.

"I think it's the best that I've ever seen a player of mine play with an overall court game. I'm asking him to do so much, and he's accomplishing it. I never asked Michael to be a playmaker. That's the greatest player that I've ever had, that I could consider the greatest player in the game, and I never asked him to be a playmaker in those terms. I asked him to be playmaker when he was doubled or tripled. But Kobe has to set up the offense, to advance the ball, to read the defense, to make other players happy, and he's doing a great job of that."

http://espn.go.com/page2/s/closer/020212.html

When you don't have an agenda, you can include entire quotes with the context and not feel a need to misrepresent anything.

Look at the bolded part, right after saying he thought Kobe was playing better than any player he's coached with an overall court game, he went on to refer to Jordan as the best player he's ever coached. So clearly Phil's quote doesn't mean he thought Kobe was the best player period, he was talking primarily about being a playmaker if you actually read the quote.

Oh Shut the hell up "Shaq Attack" ....U lose all credibility with that stupid screen name and quoting the Sacremento Bee ...you seriously calling others biased fanboys with a screen name of Shaq Attack???...(points)...GTFO!

Exactly the kind of response I'd expect when you don't have a real response. I post about many other players without bringing Shaq up, you seem to have trouble doing that with Kobe. Screen names are irrelevant in terms of judging how biased someone is. Their posts are much better evidence, and I'd bet that if you made a poll on this board, you'd be voted more biased in a landslide.

Great!.....I'll stick with the coaches and players who played with against or Coached Kobe and in some cases Jordan also.....all of them say Kobe is on MJ's level and in some opinions better...

also Many GM's don't feel Shaq is as important as Kobe...who got traded what is it 7 times now?.....

He was never traded by that point(2001), Shaq's value in his 30's has nothing to do with his value at 28 in fact, it was Kobe who was more likely to be traded during that time. This was from 2001.

Coach Phil Jackson had warned Kobe that the spat with Shaq could even jeopardize his Laker career.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/newswee...r-sharing.html

Go look up those yearly GM polls on who general managers would rather have, Shaq was the first choice during those 3peat years, and the guy who first took over in those polls was Duncan, not Kobe.

October 20, 2003

Even last season, when Shaq "struggled" in the first half, general managers in our annual top-players survey overwhelmingly voted Shaq the No. 1 player.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m.../ai_110404214/

And no, not all of the coaches and players from that era have said Kobe was on Jordan's level or better, what are you talking about?

And if you want to hear what player's have to say....

It was only four years ago that Hardaway was O'Neal's multitalented partner, the flash to Shaq's bash. To Hardaway, watching Bryant complement O'Neal with spectacular slashes to the hoop and smothering defense in Game I was like seeing another actor excel in the role he himself originated. "The way they work together looks a lot like what Shaq and I used to do," Hardaway said after O'Neal scored 37 points and Bryant added 25 in Game I. " Shaq takes so much pressure off you. He opens things up for Kobe."

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vau...9218/index.htm

I posted Both.....many times...you can go look for them.

Already proven wrong.

what's also funny is how many good/great teams Shaq has played on without Kobe, yet he got merked in the Postseason because he didn't have a player with Kobe's ability to take over late in Games....except Wade in 06' getting 30 freethrows.

Shaq played on 7 teams capable of winning it all without KObe....

Kobe replaced Shaq with a soft Euro and turned him into Greatness....

You do realize that Shaq was producing FAR more than Kobe in the 4th quarters of the 2000 playoffs, right? I'm talking over 9 ppg in the '00 WCF 4th quarters and 11.5 in the 2000 finals 4th quarters, both on great efficiency. But yeah, that's why he couldn't win a title before Kobe. Funny considering how much he was scoring in 4th quarters in the first title he actually won.

And at Gasol "replacing" Shaq.

Yeah, Shaq left, and Pau came in and replaced him with the same core around them. Shaq was traded in 2004, the Lakers acquired Pau in 2008 and other than Kobe and Fisher, who else was on the roster from the 2009 champions and the 2002 Lakers roster?

Pau didn't replace Shaq, Pau didn't do this over 3 seasons.

Regular Season- 28.6 ppg, 12.4 rpg, 3.5 apg, 2.6 bpg, 57.5 FG%
Playoffs- 29.9 ppg, 14.5 rpg, 3.0 apg, 2.4 bpg, 55.2 FG%
Finals- 35.9 ppg, 15.2 rpg, 3.5 apg, 3.2 bpg, 59.5 FG%

Pau didn't lead the Lakers in scoring 3 consecutive years in the regular season, playoffs and finals. Pau didn't finished higher than Kobe in MVP voting 3 consecutive years and win finals MVP all 3 years.

I really don't even know why you attempt to argue with me. I win every single time, and this will continue.

[BlackJoker23]

shaqattack destroying alphawolf

[Jacks3]

Alphawolf destroying all the pathetic haters.

[RRR3]

Shaqattack vs alphawolf:

[AlphaWolf24]

ShaqAttack3234]As Phil himself said in December 2000 when Kobe was apparently proving to be the best player in the league according to you.



Oh and this one from his book.



http://books.google.com/books?id=Pfm...20best&f=false

.....that's all you doing...Phil already came back and coached 3 more Final teams...and said he was wrong...."any team with KObe has a chance for a championship"...you stumblin and mumblin...I'm talking about 01'..and your bringing up 00'???

AGAIN , ...in 01' the actual quote , "But Michael Jordan? In a chat about Bryant, Jackson said he has displayed a better "overall" game than any other player he has coached. That would include, um, Jordan. "It's the best I've ever seen a player of mine with an overall court game," he says. "I'm asking him to do so much, and he's accomplishing it."

then you spew this - "I never asked Michael to be a playmaker. That's the greatest player that I've ever had, that I could consider the greatest player in the game, and I never asked him to be a playmaker in those terms. I asked him to be playmaker when he was doubled or tripled. But Kobe has to set up the offense, to advance the ball, to read the defense, to make other players happy, and he's doing a great job of that."

Take the wax outta your ears son!!....he considered MJ as the best player , the same way he considered KOBE the best...except he's askind MORE outta KOBE!..he said plain as day Kobe is a better allaround player!!!

and from your Big DEEZ Himself....Shaq 01' playoff's - Kobe as "my idol" and "the best player in the NBA, by far."

First of all, how were the WCF the "real NBA Finals" when the actual finals were far more competitive? Philly actually won a game and the 5 games were generally close while LA swept San Antonio by 22 ppg.

Because San Antonio was a better team....that's why...and L.A. knew if they got past S.A. that they would win the Title....as proven when they played like boo boo in Game 1 of the Finals and looked past Philly..

And to add to that, if playing against Philly was so easy(nevermind Shaq facing a more respected defender than Kobe faced vs Philly or San Antonio) then why didn't Kobe dominate Philly? If Shaq dropping 33/16/5/3 on 57% shooting was easy then why was Kobe only putting up 25/8/6 on 42% shooting?

so Your saying the sixers were a better team then S.A.???......cot damn son...you betta then that!

Oh, and here's the actual quote.

Exactly the kind of response I'd expect when you don't have a real response. I post about many other players without bringing Shaq up, you seem to have trouble doing that with Kobe. Screen names are irrelevant in terms of judging how biased someone is. Their posts are much better evidence, and I'd bet that if you made a poll on this board, you'd be voted more biased in a landslide.

You are a Elitist poster who def has some sort of shiesty bias to Hair Rock and the Sacramento bee...why?...who know's...maybe you get your kicks from Cowtown hating Kobe and L.A. for so many years....

Shaq got the boot and Kobe replaced him with a soft Euro...we kept on Winning, Shaq wasn't really that important after all....

but it's ok....he was still great , well.......he was Big.

He was never traded by that point(2001), Shaq's value in his 30's has nothing to do with his value at 28 in fact, it was Kobe who was more likely to be traded during that time. This was from 2001.

Shaq value??.....dude was treated like a stepson in his prime By Orlando Fans......been traded so many times....dude fell outta his prime faster then Kazaam fell outta the movie theatres...

Read the Fine Print.....even at 22 years old....the world Knew.




Get back in my pocket son!



next

[AlphaWolf24]

Shaqattack vs alphawolf:

F@ck pillow slapping Boxing.....


Aldo>Pacman....

[ShaqAttack3234]

.....that's all you doing...Phil already came back and coached 3 more Final teams...and said he was wrong...."any team with KObe has a chance for a championship"...you stumblin and mumblin...I'm talking about 01'..and your bringing up 00'???

That was from the 2000-2001 season, you know, the start of the season when you cited Kobe's stats ansaid

Take the wax outta your ears son!!....he considered MJ as the best player , the same way he considered KOBE the best...except he's askind MORE outta KOBE!..he said plain as day Kobe is a better allaround player!!!

no. He did say that he was asking Kobe to do more all around, but he clearly stated that he thought MJ was the greatest player and the greatest player that he coached in that same quote.

and from your Big DEEZ Himself....Shaq 01' playoff's - Kobe as "my idol" and "the best player in the NBA, by far."

So when Shaq calls Kobe selfish his word doesn't mean anything, but when he called Kobe the best, suddenly you use his word.

Shaq says a lot of things, nobody takes his quotes seriously. Remember, when he was talking up Wade and talking down Kobe when he went to Miami?

How about this gem from Shaq in 2008.

So some brave soul raised the possibility that the guy across the hall in TD Banknorth Garden — Boston Celtics forward Kevin Garnett -- might be in the discussion as well. O'Neal shook his head. No way.
"I'm going to have to go with my guy before him," he said, motioning to teammate Amare Stoudemire's locker. "All day, every day. Garnett doesn't play defense".

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/rumors/p...?urn=nba-73715

And you realize that teammates hype each other up all the time, right? Jordan said the Bulls were Pippen's team in '96 and Bird said Parish was the Celtics MVP in '82.

Because San Antonio was a better team....that's why...and L.A. knew if they got past S.A. that they would win the Title....as proven when they played like boo boo in Game 1 of the Finals and looked past Philly..

Hard to win a game when Kobe shoots 7/22 from the field, scores just 15 points, has just 3 rebounds and has more turnovers(6) than assists(5), and he wasn't exactly successful in his attempt to guard Iverson either.

There's no excuse for "looking past a team" in the finals, and if that was the case, Shaq certainly didn't. He had 44/20/5.

so Your saying the sixers were a better team then S.A.???......cot damn son...you betta then that!

The Spurs second leading scorer Derek Anderson was injured(their only real perimeter threat as well) and Popovich as well as other Spurs stated this was a big factor in the series, so they weren't the Spurs of the regular season.

And regardless, I can't call the "real NBA finals" a series that was far less competitive.

Even after the game 1 loss(and you know LA wasn't overlooking Philly then since they got a lot of heat for that loss), the Philly series was much more competitive the next 4 games. LA won by 9 in game 2(and where would they have been without Shaq's 28/20/9/8 game?), game 3 was a 5 point victory(and decided by some role player's clutch shots, iirc, I think Horry and maybe Fisher in particular each hit a huge shot or 2 down the stretch, otherwise, they could've been down 2-1), though games 4 and 5 were easier LA wins(won by 14 and 12, respectively, though still not approaching the 22 point margin a victory they average vs San Antonio.)

You are a Elitist poster who def has some sort of shiesty bias to Hair Rock and the Sacramento bee...why?...who know's...maybe you get your kicks from Cowtown hating Kobe and L.A. for so many years....

Shaq got the boot and Kobe replaced him with a soft Euro...we kept on Winning, Shaq wasn't really that important after all....

Destroyed this trash.

Shaq value??.....dude was treated like a stepson in his prime By Orlando Fans......been traded so many times....dude fell outta his prime faster then Kazaam fell outta the movie theatres...

You mean when he was in his 30's and had been in the league a dozen or so years?(and had more elite years than Kobe, btw, Kobe has been elite at a later stage of his career, but Shaq was elite at an earlier stage, so the longevity argument holds no weight).

Read the Fine Print.....even at 22 years old....the world Knew.

Right, the casual fans are really the best way to judge the best player. The same type of guys who voted Iverson as one of the 2 starting guards in the East in '09.

I think I've effectively discredited you, so my job is done in this thread, I doubt anyone in this thread will see any of the misinformation you spread and believe it, which is the only reason why I bother debating with you.

[97 bulls]

It was nothing but a team with a bunch of old vets out of there primes who were down 3-1.
The bigger question is how would the Spurs/Lakers match had gone if Duncan doesn't get injured?

Exactly. Sabonis was old, pippen was old. And I'm talking really old. I believe pippen was 34-35 as was sabnis. Their best players were steve smith and rasheed wallace. And that wasn't. Prime wallace either.