Bigger Finals Choke: 2004 Kobe or 2016 Curry?

[Fudge]

Kobe Bryant - 2004 Finals

NARRATIVE: Possibly the 3rd most stacked team ever behind the 2016 AND 2017 Golden State Warriors. Only to be closed out in 5 games to the superstar-less Detroit Pistons. Shaq, as always, held his own. His sidekick failed to show up.

22 ppg
3 rpg
4 apg
38% FG
17% 3PT
4 TO



Result: Lost in 5 games, despite being the favorites.



Stephen Curry - 2016 NBA Finals

NARRATIVE: Coming off a back to back MVP season, and a historic regular season for the (as of now) greatest team EVER, little Stephen failed to step up in the Finals for the 2nd consecutive year, only to be outplayed by teammate Draymond Green. Curry missed his last 4 FGA, including a very crucial turnover late in the game. The Warriors end up losing the last three games of the series, and the G7 at home.

23 ppg
5 rpg
4 apg
40% FG
40% 3PT
4 TO

Result: Lost in 7 games, despite being the favorites

[feyki]

2007 and 2011 .

[Mr Feeny]

Both were awful but Kobe was horrific. He singlehandedly lost them that title!

[lilteapot]

Curry easily.

He thought he could get away with playing like shit for the entire series and just conceding another Finals MVP to Iggy or Green or Klay. Easily most favored team in NBA history to win the title. Lost 3-1.

[Mr Feeny]

Kobe Bryant - 2004 Finals

NARRATIVE: Possibly the 3rd most stacked team ever behind the 2016 AND 2017 Golden State Warriors. Only to be closed out in 5 games to the superstar-less Detroit Pistons. Shaq, as always, held his own. His sidekick failed to show up.

22 ppg
3 rpg
4 apg
38% FG
17% 3PT
4 TO



Result: Lost in 5 games, despite being the favorites.



Stephen Curry - 2016 NBA Finals

NARRATIVE: Coming off a back to back MVP season, and a historic regular season for the (as of now) greatest team EVER, little Stephen failed to step up in the Finals for the 2nd consecutive year, only to be outplayed by teammate Draymond Green. Curry missed his last 4 FGA, including a very crucial turnover late in the game. The Warriors end up losing the last three games of the series, and the G7 at home.

23 ppg
5 rpg
4 apg
40% FG
40% 3PT
4 TO

Result: Lost in 7 games, despite being the favorites

38% and 17%3fg

A blind man could make more shots than Kobrick

[warriorfan]

In 2015 Curry put on one of the most clutch performances in Finals history

[COLOR="GREEN"]Most 4th Quarter Points during the Finals [/COLOR]

1995 Shaquille O'Neal 11.5
2000 Shaquille O'Neal 11.5 (61.1% TS)
2015 Stephen Curry 10.8 [COLOR="Green"](75.1% TS)[/COLOR]
1997 Michael Jordan 10.7 (55.1% TS)
1998 Michael Jordan 10.6 (50.6% TS)
2011 Dirk Nowitzki 10.3 (68.0% TS)
1993 Michael Jordan 10.3


In the 2016 Finals he was not able to play as well as he did in 2015

What happened in 2016 that didn't happen in 2015? The MCL injury




The time table for return of an MCL sprain is 2 to 4 weeks.

(Keep in mind that the healing timetable is for every day activity, nothing more strenuous than walking up one flight of stairs, NOT playing professional basketball)

Stephen Curry returned from the injury after only 2 weeks because the Warriors were struggling against Portland without him.

Stephen Curry re-aggravated his knee injury by coming back too early and then playing 40+ minutes of playoff basketball plus overtime in his record setting performance against Portland.


Therefore we can conclude that Curry's MCL injury was the differentiating factor which lowered Curry's production

[Mr Feeny]

In 2015 Curry put on one of the most clutch performances in Finals history

[COLOR="GREEN"]Most 4th Quarter Points during the Finals [/COLOR]

1995 Shaquille O'Neal 11.5
2000 Shaquille O'Neal 11.5 (61.1% TS)
2015 Stephen Curry 10.8 [COLOR="Green"](75.1% TS)[/COLOR]
1997 Michael Jordan 10.7 (55.1% TS)
1998 Michael Jordan 10.6 (50.6% TS)
2011 Dirk Nowitzki 10.3 (68.0% TS)
1993 Michael Jordan 10.3


In the 2016 Finals he was not able to play as well as he did in 2015

What happened in 2016 that didn't happen in 2015? The major MCL injury




The time table for return of an MCL sprain is 2 to 4 weeks.

(Keep in mind that the healing timetable is for every day activity, nothing more strenuous than walking up one flight of stairs, NOT playing professional basketball)

Stephen Curry returned from the injury after only 2 weeks because the Warriors were struggling against Portland without him.

Stephen Curry re-aggravated his knee injury by coming back too early and then playing 40+ minutes of playoff basketball plus overtime in his record setting performance against Portland.


Therefore we can conclude that Curry's MCL injury was the differentiating factor which lowered Curry's production

Agree that Curry >> any version on kobrick

[Fudge]

Keep in mind that Kobe had...

Gary Payton
Karl Malone
Shaquille O'Neal

on his team.

Steph had...

Klay Thompson
Andre Iguodala
Draymond Green
Harrison Barnes

on his team.

Both stacked beyond belief.

[SouBeachTalents]

2011 LeBron, although Curry's Finals this year were honestly just as bad. His Game 7 performance, specifically the 4th quarter was WOAT level. Kobe didn't "choke" in '04, he just played horrendously

[ShawkFactory]

In 2015 Curry put on one of the most clutch performances in Finals history

[COLOR="GREEN"]Most 4th Quarter Points during the Finals [/COLOR]

1995 Shaquille O'Neal 11.5
2000 Shaquille O'Neal 11.5 (61.1% TS)
2015 Stephen Curry 10.8 [COLOR="Green"](75.1% TS)[/COLOR]
1997 Michael Jordan 10.7 (55.1% TS)
1998 Michael Jordan 10.6 (50.6% TS)
2011 Dirk Nowitzki 10.3 (68.0% TS)
1993 Michael Jordan 10.3


In the 2016 Finals he was not able to play as well as he did in 2015

What happened in 2016 that didn't happen in 2015? The MCL injury




The time table for return of an MCL sprain is 2 to 4 weeks.

(Keep in mind that the healing timetable is for every day activity, nothing more strenuous than walking up one flight of stairs, NOT playing professional basketball)

Stephen Curry returned from the injury after only 2 weeks because the Warriors were struggling against Portland without him.

Stephen Curry re-aggravated his knee injury by coming back too early and then playing 40+ minutes of playoff basketball plus overtime in his record setting performance against Portland.


Therefore we can conclude that Curry's MCL injury was the differentiating factor which lowered Curry's production

[Doctor K]

In 2015 Curry put on one of the most clutch performances in Finals history

[COLOR="GREEN"]Most 4th Quarter Points during the Finals [/COLOR]

1995 Shaquille O'Neal 11.5
2000 Shaquille O'Neal 11.5 (61.1% TS)
2015 Stephen Curry 10.8 [COLOR="Green"](75.1% TS)[/COLOR]
1997 Michael Jordan 10.7 (55.1% TS)
1998 Michael Jordan 10.6 (50.6% TS)
2011 Dirk Nowitzki 10.3 (68.0% TS)
1993 Michael Jordan 10.3


In the 2016 Finals he was not able to play as well as he did in 2015

What happened in 2016 that didn't happen in 2015? The MCL injury




The time table for return of an MCL sprain is 2 to 4 weeks.

(Keep in mind that the healing timetable is for every day activity, nothing more strenuous than walking up one flight of stairs, NOT playing professional basketball)

Stephen Curry returned from the injury after only 2 weeks because the Warriors were struggling against Portland without him.

Stephen Curry re-aggravated his knee injury by coming back too early and then playing 40+ minutes of playoff basketball plus overtime in his record setting performance against Portland.


Therefore we can conclude that Curry's MCL injury was the differentiating factor which lowered Curry's production

The easy reply to this which you never have a counter to....



Where is the surgery you have been saying that will happen as a result of this major MCL injury?



As we stand, no surgery, and its more likely a fake injury

[ScalsFan21]

The answer to this is 2004 Kobe. I do admit that relative to my expectations for each player, 2011 LeBron was worse than either one, but I don't think Curry was 100% in these Finals from a physical standpoint. Still, 1 semi MVP-level game out of 7 tries was bad, no way around that.

Kobe literally... was just AWFUL. His numbers were brutal and his actual play somehow was even worse than that. I have a high level of respect for those Piston teams, but it was one of the worst performances I've ever seen. I'm not sure I'd call it a "choke" necessarily; there were a lot of factors at play with that Lakers team. Not every bad performance on the big stage is automatically a result of the pressure.

I think Curry might have "choked" a bit more than Kobe mentally, but maybe I only feel that way because unlike the Brick Mamba, I hold Curry to a higher standard of on-court decision making and those kinds of things. So to see him make plays down the stretch like ill-advised behind the back feeds with no upside, or not taking the ball inside against Kevin Love and creating offense that way... it was surprising.

I'd been saying all season that if push comes to shove, Steph will tone down the flashy/sloppy BS, that it wasn't truly a major concern for him. And then he allowed it to pretty much be the final difference between winning and losing. All 3 were pathetic performances.

[warriorfan]

The easy reply to this which you never have a counter to....



Where is the surgery you have been saying that will happen as a result of this major MCL injury?



As we stand, no surgery, and its more likely a fake injury

Curry may still have surgery

Curry has also withdrawn from the Olympic USA team due to the knee injury

Now that Curry has the entire off season for recovery, it is quite possible Curry's doctors could elect for a recovery plan that does not involve invasive surgery

[Doctor K]

Curry may still have surgery

Curry has also withdrawn from the Olympic USA team due to the knee injury

Now that Curry has the entire off season for recovery, it is quite possible Curry's doctors could elect for a recovery plan that does not involve invasive surgery

Right, but in all cases of serious MCL injuries surgery is strongly recommended if not required over rest. And its what you were harping about all playoffs long was coming in the off-season. Still don't see any surgery how does it feel to be always wrong?


Guess this just wasn't serious...just the usual thing players play with. Or maybe it was nothing. Those are the only 2 options. The usual or nothing

[warriorfan]

Right, but in all cases of serious MCL injuries surgery is strongly recommended if not required over rest.

This is not true.

Guess this just wasn't serious...just the usual thing players play with. Or maybe it was nothing. Those are the only 2 options. The usual or nothing

Just the usual thing players play with? I don't think players usually play at superstar levels while suffering from knee ligament injuries.

Want to give an example of Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant, Dwyane Wade, or LeBron James of suffering an MCL/ACL injury during the playoffs and how it effected their play afterwards?

Then if you are going to sit here and say that Curry's MCL injury was "nothing", you are disregarding all of the facts and making irrational conclusions that do not make any sense.