How Good was Walt Bellamy

[LAZERUSS]

For those that may not be aware of it, a 60's Walt Bellamy was a beast. His only problem...he played in leagues with Wilt and Russell...and then Wilt, Russell, Thurmond, and even Reed.

But here is some interesting footage, with a way-past-his peak Bells going up against Kareem (Alcindor) in the early part of the 70-71 season, which would ultimately be KAJ's PEAK season (albeit, he was just as dominant in the 71-72 regular season.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pv9LhEH3YCw

Bellamy looked pretty damned good considering he was just a shell of what he had been.

[L.Kizzle]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=212351

He was probably the 5th best center in the 60s behind Wilt Russell Reed Thurmond.

[navy]

You're not going to get a good answer here, but I am curious to see your top ten center list.

[LAZERUSS]

You're not going to get a good answer here, but I am curious to see your top ten center list.

Wilt
Russell
Kareem
Shaq
Duncan (if you include him as a center)
Moses
Hakeem
Robinson

After that it gets interesting. Reed had a short, albeit, great career, but he wasn't even the starting center when he played alongside Bellamy. Thurmond is arguably the third greatest defensive center in NBA history (Russell and Wilt.) A PEAK McAdoo was the best player in the league for three straight seasons in the mid-70's. Some here would argue a peak Walton in there somewhere. And I suppose Dwight has to be among the best. And, of course, Bellamy was a beast on offense at his peak.

[L.Kizzle]

Wilt
Russell
Kareem
Shaq
Duncan (if you include him as a center)
Moses
Hakeem
Robinson

After that it gets interesting. Reed had a short, albeit, great career, but he wasn't even the starting center when he played alongside Bellamy. Thurmond is arguably the third greatest defensive center in NBA history (Russell and Wilt.) A PEAK McAdoo was the best player in the league for three straight seasons in the mid-70's. Some here would argue a peak Walton in there somewhere. And I suppose Dwight has to be among the best. And, of course, Bellamy was a beast on offense at his peak.

Mikan can't overlook his career.

[GimmeThat]

this probably sounds like a stupid question.

but for those old schoolers who were old enough to watch Walt Bellamy


without the 3 point line, how much of the X's O's still came in to play regarding each position?

was that more so just still a matter of player height/size as well as skills (ball handling)

because looking at these footages, the spacing all seemed so free and open, that it's as if you could really run any plays on any side of the floor in regards to the basket. since again, there's no 3 point line.


could be way out of the blank on this, but just straight shooting with a question.

[L.Kizzle]

this probably sounds like a stupid question.

but for those old schoolers who were old enough to watch Walt Bellamy


without the 3 point line, how much of the X's O's still came in to play regarding each position?

was that more so just still a matter of player height/size as well as skills (ball handling)

because looking at these footages, the spacing all seemed so free and open, that it's as if you could really run any plays on any side of the floor in regards to the basket. since again, there's no 3 point line.


could be way out of the blank on this, but just straight shooting with a question.

A lot of big men had food jumpers. Jerry Lucas being one of them.

[Jameerthefear]

i don't know who that is. stop posting.

[Marchesk]

i don't know who that is. stop posting.

Orlando sucks.

[LAZERUSS]

Bellamy vs. Russell 61-62 season:

Russell vs Bellamy 10 H2H games:

Russell: 21.3 ppg, 17.2 rpg, .593 eFG% (3 known games)
Bellamy: 33.2 ppg, 20.9 rpg (9 known games), (no known FG% games.)

Bellamy had high games of 41 and 47 points against Russell. He outscored Russell in 9 of the 10 H2H's. He outrebounded Russell 7 of the 9 known games.

Bellamy vs Russell 62-63 season:

Russell vs. Bellamy ... 9 H2H games:

Russell: 16.6 ppg, 22.0 rpg (6 known games), .314 eFG% (3 known games)
Bellamy: 30.3 ppg, 19.0 rpg (6 known games), no known FG% games.

Bellamy outscored Russell 9-0, and they tied in rebounding H2H's, 2-2-1.

Bellamy had games in which he outscored Russell by margins of 32-18, 39-24, 35-16, and 33-10.

Bellamy vs Russell 63-64 season:

Russell-Bellamy in their 10 H2H's:

Russell: 13.5 ppg, 20.9 rpg (9 known games), .366 eFG% (3 known games)

Bellamy: 24.9 ppg, 18.9 rpg (7 known games), and no known FG% games.

Bellamy outscored Russell, 8-2, in those 10 H2H's, with margins as high as 29-8, 32-10, and 45-14.

Russell outrebounded Bellamy in their 7 known games, 4-3.

Bellamy vs. Russell 64-65:

Bellamy in 9 H2H's: 25.8 ppg, 15.8 rpg (5 known games), no known FG%'s.
Bellamy's high scoring game against Russell was 45 points. He also had two other 32 point games against him.

Russell in 9 H2H's: 12.9 ppg, 19.7 rpg, .475 FG% (5 known games.)

Bellamy vs Russell 65-66:

Bellamy vs, Russell in 11 H2H games:

Russell averaged 15.9 ppg, 25.2 rpg, and .554 (6 known H2H's.)
Bellamy averaged 23.8 ppg, 17.8 rpg (8 known H2Hs), .476 (9 known H2Hs)

Bellamy had games of 32 and 31 points against Russell. Russell's high game against Bellamy was 22 points. Bellamy's high rebounding games were 25 and 23, while Russell had 10 of 20+ with a high of 29. Overall, Bellamy outscored Russell by a 9-2 margin, while Russell outrebounded Bellamy, 8-0 in their 8 known H2Hs.

Bellamy vs. Russell in 66-67:

Bellamy vs. Russell in 9 H2H's:

Bellamy: 18.9 ppg, 13.3 rpg (3 known), .513 FG% (3 known)
Russell: 11.4 ppg, 20.5 rpg (6 known), .405 FG% (4 known)

Bellamy had four games of 20+ points against Russell with two of 27. He also had a 22 point, 23 rebound game. Russell's high game against Bellamy was 21 points, and his high rebound game against Bells was 26. Overall, Bellamy outscored Russell, 7-2 in those H2H's, while Russell held a 2-1 margin in known rebounding games.

Bellamy vs. Russell 67-68:

Bellamy vs Russell in 8 H2H's:

Bellamy: 14.8 ppg, 11.0 rpg (4 known), and .429 FG% (4 known.)
Russell: 10.8 ppg, 16.0 rpg, and a .677 FG% (4 known, but he had four games of single digit scoring, and none of them had known FG%'s.)

Bellamy did have a 30 point game, and another 26-19 game against Russell. Russell's high scoring game was 17, and in the same game, he had his high rebounding game, with 20.

[L.Kizzle]

I think Bellamy is a third tier center along with Deke Johnston Sikma Kerr ect.

[La Frescobaldi]

Wilt
Russell
Kareem
Shaq
Duncan (if you include him as a center)
Moses
Hakeem
Robinson

After that it gets interesting. Reed had a short, albeit, great career, but he wasn't even the starting center when he played alongside Bellamy. Thurmond is arguably the third greatest defensive center in NBA history (Russell and Wilt.) A PEAK McAdoo was the best player in the league for three straight seasons in the mid-70's. Some here would argue a peak Walton in there somewhere. And I suppose Dwight has to be among the best. And, of course, Bellamy was a beast on offense at his peak.

Bellamy couldn't play the 4 when he was on the Knicks. While Reed excelled there. Bellamy was tripping over his feet and everybody else's and it was so bad they put him back at the 5 and it didn't take long at all to figure that out either. I distinctly remember Walt Frazier laughing at him for being so clumsy.

They were both fine players but Bellamy was far and away one dimensional compared to the Captain. Reed is right up there when he was injury free.

[La Frescobaldi]

this probably sounds like a stupid question.

but for those old schoolers who were old enough to watch Walt Bellamy


without the 3 point line, how much of the X's O's still came in to play regarding each position?

was that more so just still a matter of player height/size as well as skills (ball handling)

because looking at these footages, the spacing all seemed so free and open, that it's as if you could really run any plays on any side of the floor in regards to the basket. since again, there's no 3 point line.


could be way out of the blank on this, but just straight shooting with a question.

there's a lot of factors, but no question the 3 point line changed basketball enormously.
Another thing is there was extreme levels of transition hoops in those days. They ran, and ran, and ran, and never stopped til they dropped.
Set plays were much less important than the fast break in those long ago days, and it was mid-70s when you saw the big sea change to the half court game. Of course the 3 came just a few years later and that blew the game wide open.
edit ~ the '72 Lakers were the last of those great '60s style fast break teams. You can see some of that team on youtube and the quality of the film is way superior to what you can get out of '60s tape. If you watch it seems like the league suddenly jumped levels higher, but the league didn't overnight change skill level like that. It's the quality of the film not the players............ who are actually the same 60's guys lol.

[cltcfn2924]

this probably sounds like a stupid question.

but for those old schoolers who were old enough to watch Walt Bellamy


without the 3 point line, how much of the X's O's still came in to play regarding each position?

was that more so just still a matter of player height/size as well as skills (ball handling)

because looking at these footages, the spacing all seemed so free and open, that it's as if you could really run any plays on any side of the floor in regards to the basket. since again, there's no 3 point line.



could be way out of the blank on this, but just straight shooting with a question.

It was more open. You could not play anything resembling a zone. All 1 on 1.

[cltcfn2924]

Bellamy vs. Russell 61-62 season:




Bellamy vs Russell 62-63 season:




Bellamy vs Russell 63-64 season:




Bellamy vs. Russell 64-65:




Bellamy vs Russell 65-66:




Bellamy vs. Russell in 66-67:




Bellamy vs. Russell 67-68:

Why are you talking about Russells' scoring? He never was a scorer.